Cost of living comparisons (New York, Buffalo: appointed, lease, houses)

[marc3565]

I've seen many discussions on this forum about moving from one place to another and the differences in cost of living.

I found a site that some might find helpful.
PayScale - Cost of Living Calculator

Plug in your two cities , answer some questions about your job and it estimates what you'd need to make in the new city to break even.

[Canerican]

Thanks for the link. I tried plugging in a whole ton of Southern cities, and with the exception of south Florida, Maryland, and Northern Virginia (which aren't really The South) all were cheaper or the same cost as Buffalo. Except in the other cities you have far more earning potential than in Buffalo.

So for all you who value the ability to make your limited income go further, stay out of Buffalo, a city that is far more expensive to live in that most of the South.

[RocketSci]

Originally Posted by Canerican

Thanks for the link. I tried plugging in a whole ton of Southern cities, and with the exception of south Florida, Maryland, and Northern Virginia (which aren't really The South) all were cheaper or the same cost as Buffalo. Except in the other cities you have far more earning potential than in Buffalo.

So for all you who value the ability to make your limited income go further, stay out of Buffalo, a city that is far more expensive to live in that most of the South.

Other costs in moving South:
1 - cost of the move itself
2 - lost income during job transition
3 - travel costs in order to visit family back home
4 - cost of additional vehicles since most places have poor/no public transport
5 - cost of a/c which may not totally offset Bflo heat cost in deep south
6 - cost of additional property upkeep due to longer/wetter warm season (mold, mildew, yard) and cheaply built homes (in general)
7 - termites, cockroaches, water mocassins, fire ants, mosquitoes 12 months of the year
8 - school districts are not all equal - you pay higher home prices for so-called "better" districts which are really those of the highest median family income - which as some enthusiastic posters may agree is higher than WNY - so you get less bang for buck
9 - "we don't do it that way down here" - get used to hearing it
10 - you are a "damn Yankee" or maybe "alright for a Yankee" - it may be your house but it will never be your home - they really are still fighting the Civil War
11 - In Texas schoolkids have to pledge allegiance to the Texas flag (really)
12 - you may have to purchase a deer lease to hunt - there is little public land in Texas (don't know about other states) - hundreds of dollars per gun per day or thousands for the season
13 - if you are left wing you may be disappointed to find the south full of "poor ignorant bible thumping rednecks" who control most public offices and are likely to be your bosses at whatever job you find
14 - if you are right wing you may be disappointed to find the south full of "poor undereducated" African-Americans and a large population of "undocumented" Mexicans and Central Americans who are "overrunning" your town/school/mall/whatever
15 - if you are looking to settle you find that most places are just way stations for the rootless - military (active or ex) and corporate relocated who are of no discernable home town - and though you may decide to stay your neighbors will not - the natives of wherever you move to who actually do have roots will generally either have nothing to do with you or be the type of people who you would rather avoid (unless you marry one of them)

Please feel free to contribute more - moving is never a zero-sum game. You need to be damn sure that all of the moving costs are taken into account.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by RocketSci

Other costs in moving South:
1 - cost of the move itself
2 - lost income during job transition
3 - travel costs in order to visit family back home
4 - cost of additional vehicles since most places have poor/no public transport
5 - cost of a/c which may not totally offset Bflo heat cost in deep south
6 - cost of additional property upkeep due to longer/wetter warm season (mold, mildew, yard) and cheaply built homes (in general)
7 - termites, cockroaches, water mocassins, fire ants, mosquitoes 12 months of the year
8 - school districts are not all equal - you pay higher home prices for so-called "better" districts which are really those of the highest median family income - which as some enthusiastic posters may agree is higher than WNY - so you get less bang for buck
9 - "we don't do it that way down here" - get used to hearing it
10 - you are a "damn Yankee" or maybe "alright for a Yankee" - it may be your house but it will never be your home - they really are still fighting the Civil War
11 - In Texas schoolkids have to pledge allegiance to the Texas flag (really)
12 - you may have to purchase a deer lease to hunt - there is little public land in Texas (don't know about other states) - hundreds of dollars per gun per day or thousands for the season
13 - if you are left wing you may be disappointed to find the south full of poor ignorant bible thumping rednecks who control most public offices and are likely to be your bosses at whatever job you find
14 - if you are right wing you may be disappointed to find the south full of poor uneducated African-Americans and a large population of undocumented Mexicans and Central Americans who are overrunning your town/school/mall/whatever
15 - if you are looking to settle you find that most places are just way stations for the rootless - military (active or ex) and corporate relocated who are of no discernable home town - and though you may decide to stay your neighbors will not - the natives of wherever you move to who actually do have roots will generally either have nothing to do with you or be the type of people who you would rather avoid (unless you marry one of them)

Please feel free to contribute more - moving is never a zero-sum game. You need to be damn sure that all of the moving costs are taken into account.

Besides this generalization and maybe a couple others, you are pretty much on point.....

Can't forget taxes or higher fees in regards to some possessions in parts of the South, it might take longer to commute due to having cities/areas that sprawl and in turn you might have to be a complete slave to the gas pump, most of the cheaper places don't have much to offer and the one's that do are more pricey than even places in the North......Anything else?

[RocketSci]

Originally Posted by Canerican

Thanks for the link. I tried plugging in a whole ton of Southern cities, and with the exception of south Florida, Maryland, and Northern Virginia (which aren't really The South) all were cheaper or the same cost as Buffalo. Except in the other cities you have far more earning potential than in Buffalo.

So for all you who value the ability to make your limited income go further, stay out of Buffalo, a city that is far more expensive to live in that most of the South.

Originally Posted by ckhthankgod

Besides this generalization and maybe a couple others, you are pretty much on point.....

Can't forget taxes or higher fees in regards to some possessions in parts of the South, it might take longer to commute due to having cities/areas that sprawl and in turn you might have to be a complete slave to the gas pump, most of the cheaper places don't have much to offer and the one's that do are more pricey than even places in the North......Anything else?

I did a slight edit - I don't want to offend just highlight stereotypes people may run into.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by Canerican

Thanks for the link. I tried plugging in a whole ton of Southern cities, and with the exception of south Florida, Maryland, and Northern Virginia (which aren't really The South) all were cheaper or the same cost as Buffalo. Except in the other cities you have far more earning potential than in Buffalo.

So for all you who value the ability to make your limited income go further, stay out of Buffalo, a city that is far more expensive to live in that most of the South.

Actually, I looked at Birmingham, Little Rock, Nashville, Atlanta, Memphis, Raleigh, Charlotte, Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Columbia SC, Richmond and Houston and for the most part, the differences in costs are slight. In some cases things like Health Care and Housing were higher. I did notice that utilities were lower, but are they taking into account the hot and humid summers, in which air conditioning will be on throughout the day and night. What about transportation costs in terms of travel time, which I'm not sure was considered, as well as public transportation.

[UpstaterInBklyn]

Excellent, insightful points, RocketSci, especially #10 and #15, which captures a very real "intangible" cost of relocation to the South. This is the essence of why a lot of people who have done it are unhappy with their move, even in cases where they may be ahead a few percentage points economically.

Ultimately its about quality of life as defined by each individual, and for most people that is defined by the relationships and friendships they are able to create in their new locale.

Only the most shallow and/or self-centered people measure success and happiness solely by material gains. I'm not usually one to post feel-good happy talk, but this happens to be very true, and proven!

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by RocketSci

I did a slight edit - I don't want to offend just highlight stereotypes people may run into.

You didn't offend. I knew what you were getting at.

[ckhthankgod]

Originally Posted by UpstaterInBklyn

Excellent, insightful points, RocketSci, especially #10 and #15, which captures a very real "intangible" cost of relocation to the South. This is the essence of why a lot of people who have done it are unhappy with their move, even in cases where they may be ahead a few percentage points economically.

Ultimately its about quality of life as defined by each individual, and for most people that is defined by the relationships and friendships they are able to create in their new locale.

Only the most shallow and/or self-centered people measure success and happiness solely by material gains. I'm not usually one to post feel-good happy talk, but this happens to be very true, and proven!

I think that is what everyone else has been trying to get at all along.

Even if we went the materialistic route, people would be surprised that things aren't necessarily better on the other side. Looking cities that seem to be places people from the North move to regarding the South like the list I presented, the costs seem to be a wash. If I went to Western cities, the costs might actually be higher in many, if not most cases.

[Canerican]

10 - you are a "damn Yankee" or maybe "alright for a Yankee" - it may be your house but it will never be your home - they really are still fighting the Civil War

That's OK. So am I, I think the South was 100% right to secede.

11 - In Texas schoolkids have to pledge allegiance to the Texas flag (really)

So what?

9 - "we don't do it that way down here" - get used to hearing it

That's fine, I am moving into someone else's town, I don't expect them all to adapt to my lifestyle.

1 - cost of the move itself
2 - lost income during job transition
3 - travel costs in order to visit family back home

Fine. Then you ought to tell this to people planning on moving to Buffalo as well.

4 - cost of additional vehicles since most places have poor/no public transport

I have a car and a truck. I have never and probably would never take a bus.

6 - cost of additional property upkeep due to longer/wetter warm season (mold, mildew, yard) and cheaply built homes (in general)

And in the north everything freezes and thaws causing cracks... Not all homes in the south are cheaply built. That's a ridiculous statement. The houses in the north are no better than those in the south.

12 - you may have to purchase a deer lease to hunt - there is little public land in Texas (don't know about other states) - hundreds of dollars per gun per day or thousands for the season

You have to get a hunting license in NY too. At any rate I don't hunt, so that really doesn't bug me. At least in Texas I'll be able to own a pistol (without insane restrictions and fees), unlike in NY.

14 - if you are right wing you may be disappointed to find the south full of poor uneducated African-Americans and a large population of undocumented Mexicans and Central Americans who are overrunning your town/school/mall/whatever

Versus the White trash here in Buffalo. I would prefer have my race be the one that is better off... I have found in the South that the Blacks are actually far better off, more educated, and certainly more polite than here -- but so are the Whites.

====

Can't forget taxes or higher fees in regards to some possessions in parts of the South

You're seriously still on this one? The south is never higher taxwise than New York. Get over it.