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A local news source said 4000 people moved to VT during the last 2 years. Is that '74%?'
I'd like to know how many remain after two long, dark, cold winters!!
Let’s put the traffic here in perspective. Unless there is an accident or lanes are closed for construction like you said, traffic is a breeze compared to most cities of a similar size. And it’s nothing like bigger metro areas. I’ve lived many other places and traffic here isn’t bad at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by looking4home
Interesting take on Florida and it sounds like you checked out a lot of places. I’ve heard Florida is one of those states where you are better off living in a gated community with an HOA. My mother lives in Florida (The Villages) and I visited her last month. It was a lot nicer than I thought it would be, and great for my mother, as it’s relatively safe, clean, etc. But it’s a little fake-y with too many golf courses and golf carts whizzing around. It has a Disneyland-ish feel about it.
I was in Vermont this summer, and last year as well, in a rural area south of Burlington. I was astounded at how bad the traffic was at all hours of the day. My forays into Burlington, South Burlington and Williston resulted in gridlock traffic much of the time (some of that is from roadwork). But that’s where a lot of the growth has occurred over the past few years which has raised property values sky high and it’s becoming unaffordable for most, especially first time homebuyers.
Let’s put the traffic here in perspective. Unless there is an accident or lanes are closed for construction like you said, traffic is a breeze compared to most cities of a similar size. And it’s nothing like bigger metro areas. I’ve lived many other places and traffic here isn’t bad at all.
Well that is true, on the highway. But during peak times or on a weekend, traffic in B'ton is quite congested. It moves, though. Not like the 405. LOL
I’ve never encountered any traffic congestion on the highways. The problem with Burlington roads, and most other Vermont towns and cities in general, is that they’re old! The roads aren’t wide enough to accommodate increased traffic and the roadway striping and other traffic markings are confusing (if there at all). The worst are the intersections, with barely enough room to pull out into traffic to make left turns.
Last edited by looking4home; 08-21-2022 at 11:38 PM..
I’ve never encountered any traffic congestion on the highways. The problem with Burlington roads, and most other Vermont towns and cities in general, is that they’re old! The roads aren’t wide enough to accommodate increased traffic and the roadway striping and other traffic markings are confusing (if there at all). The worst are the intersections, with barely enough room to pull out into traffic to make left turns.
This is the truth!! there used to be a subterranean parking garage near the Macy's at the now defunct Church St Mall and the spaces were the size of a golf cart!!! Not to mention, so close together your car would always get dinged.
As for road expansion, it seems like there just isn't any room to make them wider or add a lane or two. There are houses right on the road. And some designs really make me question the engineer's skill. Like, who designed this intersection?? or this 5-way??
I was born and raised in Maine. The schools there, on the whole, are not as good as Vermont schools. Vermont is, in almost every ranking of K-12 public schools, ranked in the top 5. Maine is typically ranked around 15. The higher taxes likely have a lot to do with that.
Thanks for your reply. Thankfully, I am happily child-free.
I can only tell you that in my experience, when I lived in Vermont (after we unfortunately left Boston when I was 10 years old) we moved of all places to Rutland - really the armpit of the state - and the schools - particularly the Catholic school I unfortunately went to, in a word, sucked. I could tell you miles of stories about that place. The Catholic high school wasn't much better. This was the 70s/80s, but I doubt much has changed in that town.
The quality of schools I'm sure varies from town to town as it does in most states. There are good and bad schools everywhere, but I've never checked the tax rate to see if any of that corresponds with low taxes vs high. Interesting. Thank you.
When I compare low taxed States like Delaware and NC, I just don't understand how our gov't can justify spending so much money, especially when it comes to our failing education system. We have a decline every year of students, but never a decline in teachers. As far as getting a good education, VT ranks 23rd, but we are the third highest in education spending in the country. I would never move here if I had young children. Vermont is a beautiful state to visit, but unfortunately, it isn't run the way it should. The Progressives control our gov't and they thrive on spending tax dollars. Our governor is a Republican in name only, so if you lean to the Left, you will like it here.
I pay as much for the garbage I have to bring to the dump myself, as my family on Long Island pays through their taxes, and they get 3 pickups a week, including large appliances and furniture. It works out much better but with this administration, I don't know if it would be a good idea. It would just be giving them more reasons to tax us and more excuses as to why they have to raise taxes.
Burlington is totally different than the rural towns in VT. At a time like this, when people are worried about having enough money to feed their family, Burlington is voting on legalizing prostitution. Where their priorities are, who knows. But nothing surprises me after living here over twenty years. My hairstylist just closed her shop, sold her house and is moving south. She said she can't take the politics in VT anymore. It's very sad.
Thanks for your response. Certainly the fact that Vermonters pay a crazy high property tax rate yet don't even get their trash picked up like I do here in Maine, just baffles me. When my family moved from Boston in the mid 1970s (when I was 10) to ****hole Rutland, I had never been to a dump and was absolutely aghast and horrified (as was my mother) to have to haul our trash to one. To me, it was like we had stepped back in time and definitely stepped down several rungs on some ladder. Ours years in Rutland proved me right, pretty much.
As an adult, I a absolutely love to visit Vermont and do frequently (was just in Stowe for a long weekend, and Colchester over July 4th week, with a work-from-home/vaca week coming up in Dorset/Manchester). The beauty and outdoor activities are of course breathtaking. I love the vibe of the place and the cultural activities which seem well in excess of the what one may expect from such a small state. I love the lack of traffic vs what we find here in coastal Maine alll summer into the fall - ugh! There is much to love about Vermont, and to boot, I am happily child-free, so the quality and direct cost of schooling is not a concern, though of course, schooling tends to be the the majority of what constitutes one's property taxes, true.
I lean moderate-liberal, but am open to a Republican governor so long as they are moderate and pro choice. Legalizing prostitution doesn't bother me. Like with marijuana, making this stuff illegal just hurts and endangers those directly involved and helps no one. But I get why someone who isn't liberal or terribly left wing would find Vermont (parts of it, anyway) hard to stomach. It's the same way I feel about moving down south, which I have considered. I would find it very uncomfortable, even with the low taxes, I'm afraid.
I don’t know why you’re participating in the deflection attempt in this thread. The topic is Vermont property taxes which means the topic is Act 68. The AirBnB cited in the original post is commercial property. It’s taxed at the commercial rate for the state school property tax. That tax rate is fixed state-wide and there is no tax relief for commercial property owned by someone with middle class income. By state law, towns are required to assess at 100% of market valuation. We all know what happened to property prices nationwide in the last couple of years.
I owned a vacation home in Killington for 26 years. I bought well before the Brigham decision. Vermont residential housing is 17% vacation homes and by valuation more like 25% of the residential tax base. Act 60 was designed to deflect the Brigham decision onto vacation home owners, commercial property owners, and the few high income residents. The median Vermont homeowner doesn’t pay much of the state school property tax since it’s means tested. It’s no different than the graduated state income tax that is designed to be quite moderate for that median Vermonter but hit the high income residents. I personally have no problem with the tax system even though I got hammered by it. I understand why it was done and who the legislature was targeting.
The market value of my Killington place doubled during COVID-19. I did the math and decided to sell it before my taxes doubled. I paid my big pile of nonresident state income tax on the “gain” that was mostly 26 years of inflation, and exited Vermont forever. I bought a condo at the base of Beaver Creek. Colorado doesn’t have a state school tax. I pay $1,700 in property taxes. That’s what Killington was like in 1993 when I bought there.
Personally, I think Vermont needs to adjust Act 68 for commercial property. It’s fine to soak the vacation home owners and the AirBnB. The state needs to encourage rental housing stock so new construction long term rental property should get a tax break. Perhaps a means test for resident owners of older rental housing. Those property taxes are just being passed on to the tenants.
Hi - I posted the original post. The house we rented as an airbnb was owned by the immediate neighbors, one of whom grew up in the house. It was rented out to long term tenants before and after the brief period they used it for airbnb. Does the fact that the owner doesn't live in the property alone make the house a "commercial property"? I guess I thought that term would be for an actual business, not for a rental property - whether airbnb or long term traditional rental.
I notice that the vast majority of homes in Burlington and suburbs, Stowe, Waterbury, Waitsfield, Warren, Killington, Manchester, have extremely high taxes, even if they weren't previously airbnbs or rentals. I haven't looked much in other towns. I just know that the same houses in the Portland, Maine area, would have taxes thousands less.
Good on you for selling your Killington place. (I have stayed at the Inn at Long Trail for about 15 yrs now - great people, great place). When I heard the state was reassessing property taxes in the middle of the pandemic, I knew that it would drive the middle class out even more. Having grown up that way, it saddened and angered me.
Interesting take on Florida and it sounds like you checked out a lot of places. I’ve heard Florida is one of those states where you are better off living in a gated community with an HOA. My mother lives in Florida (The Villages) and I visited her last month. It was a lot nicer than I thought it would be, and great for my mother, as it’s relatively safe, clean, etc. But it’s a little fake-y with too many golf courses and golf carts whizzing around. It has a Disneyland-ish feel about it.
I was in Vermont this summer, and last year as well, in a rural area south of Burlington. I was astounded at how bad the traffic was at all hours of the day. My forays into Burlington, South Burlington and Williston resulted in gridlock traffic much of the time (some of that is from roadwork). But that’s where a lot of the growth has occurred over the past few years which has raised property values sky high and it’s becoming unaffordable for most, especially first time homebuyers.
I spend several weeks a year in Vermont and was just in Colchester for a week in early July. We drove all over the place at all hours and encountered zero traffic, even during traditional "rush hour" timeframes, even in and north/south of Burlington. It had much less traffic than the Portland Maine area has during those timeframes, we noticed.
Yes, Florida is interesting to say the least. I have never visited The Villages but doubt I would want to live there, and I doubt I'll ever be able to retire. It's just the crime in that state in all of it's big and small cities that puts me off and baffles me. As i said, in cities of a similar size up north, the crime level is not even comparable as to that found in Florida cities and towns. Frustrating as I love Miami, love Sarasota, St Pete, Delray Beach. Sad.
I don’t know Rutland that well but I have heard it’s schools have many issues. It’s not a city I would consider moving to based on its reputation.
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Originally Posted by Marguerite2015
Thanks for your response. Certainly the fact that Vermonters pay a crazy high property tax rate yet don't even get their trash picked up like I do here in Maine, just baffles me. When my family moved from Boston in the mid 1970s (when I was 10) to ****hole Rutland, I had never been to a dump and was absolutely aghast and horrified (as was my mother) to have to haul our trash to one. To me, it was like we had stepped back in time and definitely stepped down several rungs on some ladder. Ours years in Rutland proved me right, pretty much.
As an adult, I a absolutely love to visit Vermont and do frequently (was just in Stowe for a long weekend, and Colchester over July 4th week, with a work-from-home/vaca week coming up in Dorset/Manchester). The beauty and outdoor activities are of course breathtaking. I love the vibe of the place and the cultural activities which seem well in excess of the what one may expect from such a small state. I love the lack of traffic vs what we find here in coastal Maine alll summer into the fall - ugh! There is much to love about Vermont, and to boot, I am happily child-free, so the quality and direct cost of schooling is not a concern, though of course, schooling tends to be the the majority of what constitutes one's property taxes, true.
I lean moderate-liberal, but am open to a Republican governor so long as they are moderate and pro choice. Legalizing prostitution doesn't bother me. Like with marijuana, making this stuff illegal just hurts and endangers those directly involved and helps no one. But I get why someone who isn't liberal or terribly left wing would find Vermont (parts of it, anyway) hard to stomach. It's the same way I feel about moving down south, which I have considered. I would find it very uncomfortable, even with the low taxes, I'm afraid.
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