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Old 12-23-2012, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
4,486 posts, read 14,928,983 times
Reputation: 3919

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Quote:
Originally Posted by julian17033 View Post
Incorrect.
This nation was not founded as a Christian nation nor were the founding fathers Christian they were Deist's.

The definition of Deism is this;

Deism\De”ism\ (d[=e]“[i^]z’m), n. [L. deus god: cf. F.
d['e]isme. See Deity.]
The doctrine or creed of a deist; the belief or system of
those who acknowledge the existence of one God, but deny
revelation.
Note: Deism is the belief in natural religion only, or those
truths, in doctrine and practice, which man is to
discover by the light of reason, independent of any
revelation from God. Hence, deism implies infidelity,
or a disbelief in the divine origin of the Scriptures.

For further enlightenment and education on this subject please reference the following material;

Our Founding Fathers Were NOT Christians

The Christian Nation Myth

Treaty of Tripoli - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The U.S. NOT founded upon Christianity

Daily Kos: America was NOT founded on Christianity

DEISM AND THE FOUNDING FATHERS | Citizen Tom

Deism and the Founding of the United States, Divining America, TeacherServe®, National Humanities Center



I trust this clarifies the issue.
So to illustrate your point, you select every liberal source you can find? Obviously your judgement is clouded with liberal propaganda. Here's an interesting article from a REPUTABLE source about the debate over Christianity in America:

Was America Founded As A Christian Nation? - Forbes

You can spout off all of your nonsense but truth is, American IS a Christian nation whether you deny that is your problem.

Personally, if you want to deny the existence of the true creator of man, that's entirely your business. I'm not going to debate beliefs with you but I do feel sorry than you haven't found God in your life. I was raised Catholic and while I'm not the most church-going person in the world, my Catholic faith is part of what drives me to be a better human being. To celebrate Christmas without the belief in Christ would be a life that seems miserable; I truly hope one day you'll find the Lord working in your life.
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Old 12-23-2012, 11:26 PM
 
Location: Columbus, Ohio
1,413 posts, read 3,734,109 times
Reputation: 1424
Quote:
Originally Posted by Idon'tdateyou View Post
I am aware of why Christians celebrate Christmas because I celebrate it, including going to church. However this country IS a Christian country.
No it isn't. It is folks like you that give Christians a bad name. You are no different then other extremist from other religions. I don't see a problem with places being open for Christmas. Sure it sucks for the employee, but this is what people need to o to keep a job.

BTW I am Atheist, but have no problem with other religions. I even say Merry Christmas, go figure!?
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Old 12-23-2012, 11:32 PM
 
Location: Columbus, Ohio
1,413 posts, read 3,734,109 times
Reputation: 1424
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyAZ View Post
So to illustrate your point, you select every liberal source you can find? Obviously your judgement is clouded with liberal propaganda. Here's an interesting article from a REPUTABLE source about the debate over Christianity in America:

Was America Founded As A Christian Nation? - Forbes

You can spout off all of your nonsense but truth is, American IS a Christian nation whether you deny that is your problem.

Personally, if you want to deny the existence of the true creator of man, that's entirely your business. I'm not going to debate beliefs with you but I do feel sorry than you haven't found God in your life. I was raised Catholic and while I'm not the most church-going person in the world, my Catholic faith is part of what drives me to be a better human being. To celebrate Christmas without the belief in Christ would be a life that seems miserable; I truly hope one day you'll find the Lord working in your life.
Founded and is, two different subjects. Yes America was founded Christian, but Christian beliefs no longer determine our laws. If you want a Christian country, the Philippines will welcome you.
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Old 12-24-2012, 06:43 AM
 
Location: Lehigh Valley, PA
2,311 posts, read 3,466,205 times
Reputation: 5304
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyAZ View Post
So to illustrate your point, you select every liberal source you can find? Obviously your judgement is clouded with liberal propaganda. Here's an interesting article from a REPUTABLE source about the debate over Christianity in America:

Was America Founded As A Christian Nation? - Forbes

You can spout off all of your nonsense but truth is, American IS a Christian nation whether you deny that is your problem.

Personally, if you want to deny the existence of the true creator of man, that's entirely your business. I'm not going to debate beliefs with you but I do feel sorry than you haven't found God in your life. I was raised Catholic and while I'm not the most church-going person in the world, my Catholic faith is part of what drives me to be a better human being. To celebrate Christmas without the belief in Christ would be a life that seems miserable; I truly hope one day you'll find the Lord working in your life.

Well let's look at my history being raised in the Assembly of God church.
I'm 46 years old.

I was raised to believe that rock and roll was the devils music, gay people were not really human and were pawns of the devil, women are to be subservient to men in every aspect of society, that any country other than the U.S. was to be treated as a child not capable of it's own governing, that the earth was only 8000 years old, that evolution( a scientific fact) was the work of Satan and despite overwhelming evidence to support that dinosaurs roamed the earth millions of years ago we were taught not to believe this scientific fact.

I do have the Lord in my heart as I accepted the deity 40 plus years ago.

In this modern day the Catholic Church and child rape are interchangeable as the allegations and proof continue to eat away at the base like a cancer.

In the other camp you have what I was raised in; Now a diseased husk with the average age of the self identified fundamentalist "Christian" being now in their mid fifties.

Because of the belief system of omnipotent dominion over everyone and everything these
" Christian " sects are shuttering their houses of worship due to how the majority of the country views their abhorrent and disgusting behavior.

Anything that is so fundamentally flawed as to dismiss thus destroy humankind is destined to become extinct and it is, rapidly.

My church is MCC of the Spirit an all inclusive church that you will quickly dismiss as faulty, dangerous and non God like.

It's alright, most in my congregation will still offer love and support to you and so will I.

It's a new day, remember to be inclusive of others in all things or fade into mediocrity.

The choice is yours.

God bless you.
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Old 12-24-2012, 07:16 AM
 
348 posts, read 358,675 times
Reputation: 318
Bottom line, our society is broken. If you cant see that it is because a lack of values, then you are in denial.
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Old 12-24-2012, 05:59 PM
 
24,511 posts, read 34,150,388 times
Reputation: 12779
Quote:
Originally Posted by proverbs23and7 View Post
Bottom line, our society is broken. If you cant see that it is because a lack of values, then you are in denial.
Agreed! It's certainly broken when there is an expectation of molding society around religion.
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Old 12-25-2012, 12:54 AM
 
10,720 posts, read 16,848,438 times
Reputation: 9878
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyAZ View Post
So to illustrate your point, you select every liberal source you can find? Obviously your judgement is clouded with liberal propaganda. Here's an interesting article from a REPUTABLE source about the debate over Christianity in America:

Was America Founded As A Christian Nation? - Forbes

You can spout off all of your nonsense but truth is, American IS a Christian nation whether you deny that is your problem.

Personally, if you want to deny the existence of the true creator of man, that's entirely your business. I'm not going to debate beliefs with you but I do feel sorry than you haven't found God in your life. I was raised Catholic and while I'm not the most church-going person in the world, my Catholic faith is part of what drives me to be a better human being. To celebrate Christmas without the belief in Christ would be a life that seems miserable; I truly hope one day you'll find the Lord working in your life.
It was not found as a Christian nation. If you want non-liberal sources, read works by Hobbes and Locke. This country was essentially found by capitalists who did not want their wealth and trade to be limited by religion which is what they were facing in Europe at the time. They were essentially trying to create a territory where they would not be excessively taxed. They were in fact Deists.

Last edited by azriverfan.; 12-25-2012 at 01:13 AM..
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Old 12-25-2012, 01:16 AM
 
10,720 posts, read 16,848,438 times
Reputation: 9878
Quote:
Originally Posted by missik999 View Post
Many people LIKE to work to work holidays. Some people need extra money, some don't celebrate, sooner don't have families.

Where I work they asked for volunteers to work the holidays, and more people wanted to work than needed.
They don't LIKE to. They do it out of necessity because they need the money. There is a difference. And you don't have to be a Christian and celebrate Christmas to appreciate a holiday and having time off regardless if you have a family. Again, it's a matter of principle. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Of course any company can find people to work any job during any hour, that's no secret. It's just about greed. Do you really think these companies are going to hurt if they take two days off a year, of course not. It sets a bad precedent and the idea that no day is sacred any longer. This is not about religion. Human Beings are not designed to work 24/7. They need rest and days off. Now we don't even want to give them off the few protected days of the year and for what....oh that's right greed!
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Old 12-25-2012, 01:20 AM
 
10,720 posts, read 16,848,438 times
Reputation: 9878
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
but what about the people who are traveling, are they expected not to eat?
Do packed meals contain food?

And let's be realistic, the people working will be blue collar people. You are not going to see many bank presidents working that day. Even doctors with the exception of the ones on call will NOT be working those days. The President of the United States is vacationing Hawaii during the Fiscal Cliff talks. The educated white collar individuals better known as "rich people" don't work on Christmas, it's the poor who will work those shifts. Don't they deserve a day off? Or is it their job to work at McDonalds and Starbucks so the rich travelers at their airports can get a Big Mac and a latte? Oh but they want to work those days, how silly of me

Last edited by azriverfan.; 12-25-2012 at 01:31 AM..
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Old 12-25-2012, 01:33 AM
 
Location: California
29,609 posts, read 31,937,404 times
Reputation: 24747
Quote:
Originally Posted by azriverfan. View Post
Do packed meals contain food?

And let's be realistic, the people working will be blue collar people. You are not going to see many bank presidents working that day. Even doctors with the exception of the ones on call will NOT be working those days. The President of the United States is vacationing Hawaii during the Fiscal Cliff talks. The educated white collar individuals better known as "rich people" don't work on Christmas, it's the poor who will work those shifts. Don't they deserve a day off? Or is it their job to work at McDonalds and Starbucks so the rich travelers at their airports can get a Big Mac and a latte? Oh but they want to work those days, how silly of me

McDonalds was around 30 years ago, People flew on airplanes and traveled during the holidays 30 years ago and survived. What changed?
Yes it's their job to work. They know that when they take the job and with any luck they will not be in those kinds of jobs forever, but everyone pays their dues and has to do things they don't want to do at some point in their lives.
Like it or not we live in a 24/7/365 world with all sorts of people in it. That's what changed and that's not going away. And 30 years ago some places were open on Christmas and people had to work. I know, I did it myself.
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