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View Poll Results: You complain about the state of the state.
and you are right of center politically. 33 56.90%
and you are left of center politically 25 43.10%
Voters: 58. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-13-2010, 11:18 AM
 
Location: West Coast Wanderer
12,933 posts, read 11,160,348 times
Reputation: 6215

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
I wish he would too and here is why. the whole thing is rediculous. I don't know if other Pres have or have not, but certainly it should not be required, but because of all the hullabaluu, he could put this to rest. Not doing so is adding flames to the fire. At first I didn't think much of it and could have cared less, now I too wish he would. If nothing else, he is showing plain sutbborness and the inablitlity to compromise. As for Palin's high school diploma, I don't think that is an issue.

Nita
It's an issue if you're on my side of this. Look, Obama isn't adding any fuel to any fire. That fire was started and maintained entirely by the birthers. They keep spewing off and the only ones listening to them are those who think like them. 27% think he wasn't born in the US. That means 73% don't share that view. He cannot and should not cater to the dumbest common denominator in this country.
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Old 08-13-2010, 11:24 AM
 
Location: SW MO Aux Arcs
19,273 posts, read 16,632,559 times
Reputation: 17399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highnlite View Post
Course, curmudgeon thinks Obama was born in Kenya and is a Socialist
And the outright lies, butt sharkings and misrepresentations continue from someone with no cred at all.

The only truth is that I do think he is a socialist. Blatant government forced redistribition of wealth from the haves to the have-nots as he championed during his campaign is a socialist ideal. We give but it's because we want to, not because we have to, although the welfare structure is, admittedly, a form of forced compliance but not nearly as profound as he's said he wants.

In this case, Joe the Plumber was right in questioning him!

I guess it's easy to be magnanimous with others' money when yours is derived from family connections or questionable politics.
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Old 08-13-2010, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Santa Barbara
514 posts, read 139,041 times
Reputation: 175
So, no one yet, is willing to tell us why the birth certificate released by the State of Hawaii [to Obama, and then released to the public by the campaign, there, that should please Voyageur (one of my favorite all time hiking boots)] is not his actual birth certificate.
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:05 PM
 
2,031 posts, read 1,339,969 times
Reputation: 1358
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
And the outright lies, butt sharkings and misrepresentations continue from someone with no cred at all.

The only truth is that I do think he is a socialist. Blatant government forced redistribition of wealth from the haves to the have-nots as he championed during his campaign is a socialist ideal. We give but it's because we want to, not because we have to, although the welfare structure is, admittedly, a form of forced compliance but not nearly as profound as he's said he wants.

In this case, Joe the Plumber was right in questioning him!

I guess it's easy to be magnanimous with others' money when yours is derived from family connections or questionable politics.
Redistribution of wealth is practiced by every President and every Congress, regardless of party. When Bill Gates funds a vastly larger portion of shared resources such as the construction of an F-18, the annual maintenance of Death Valley National Park, or any other federal expense than do I, it's wealth redistribution.

When expert practitioners of the art of pork - such as the recently demised Senators Byrd and Stevens - haul in epic amounts of pork, it's wealth redistribution.

When bills like this (passed with large bipartisan majorities, mind you) send $300 in cash to people paying no taxes, with a cap of $1200 even for people paying millions in taxes, it's wealth redistribution.
Bush signs bill giving $300-$1,200 tax rebates | Front page | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5537421.html - broken link)

When the Earned Income Tax Credit, enacted in 1975 and significantly expanded in 1986 by a Democratic House, a Republican Senate, and President Ronald Reagan, gives tax "refunds" to people who paid no taxes, it's wealth redistribution.

These are all examples of "forced redistribution of wealth". So if these make one a socialist, then President Obama is taking his place alongside everyone who every voted for one of the items listed above or signed such a bill into law in the pantheon of American "socialists" - which by that definition pretty much includes virtually every American officeholder above the level of dog-catcher.
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:17 PM
 
Location: SW MO Aux Arcs
19,273 posts, read 16,632,559 times
Reputation: 17399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyageur View Post
These are all examples of "forced redistribution of wealth". So if these make one a socialist, then President Obama is taking his place alongside everyone who every voted for one of the items listed above or signed such a bill into law in the pantheon of American "socialists" - which by that definition pretty much includes virtually every American officeholder above the level of dog-catcher.
I acknowleged that reality. Given his proclivities, I think the President and others would rather do much more of it to blend the middle class and the lower classes into one group very dependent upon government.

Just a personal opinion. Nothing more nor less.
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Pasadena
7,413 posts, read 3,495,895 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highnlite View Post
This is a bit off the topic of discontent with California, but it is illustrative of those who complain about the state.

Let me ask you one question, the birth certificate from the State of Hawaii that shows Obama to have been born in the state, the one that is easily found on the internet. What is it about that birth certificate that would make you and the other birthers think it is not valid?
Please answer that.
That we would even be entertaining the ludicrous notions of "birthers" on the California forum is an insult to the intelligence of our posters. How did this bit of asinine nonsense even enter the discussion? Oh, hey someone from Arkansas!
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:26 PM
 
Location: GLAMA
16,585 posts, read 20,566,351 times
Reputation: 16144
Or the natural ebb and flow of civil conversation? When you're at a party, do you patrol the various knots of conversation making sure everyone stays rigidly on topic?
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Simi Valley
2,625 posts, read 3,393,292 times
Reputation: 1027
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
I wish he would too and here is why. the whole thing is rediculous. I don't know if other Pres have or have not, but certainly it should not be required, but because of all the hullabaluu, he could put this to rest. Not doing so is adding flames to the fire. At first I didn't think much of it and could have cared less, now I too wish he would. If nothing else, he is showing plain sutbborness and the inablitlity to compromise. As for Palin's high school diploma, I don't think that is an issue.

Nita
The problem is in the wording of the supposed authentic document of birth for Obama. The image which has been released to the public is what is known as a CERTIFICATION of Live Birth. Anyone in Hawaii can get this YEARS after they were born, no matter WHERE they were born. Its only real purpose is to show that at some time and some place this person was born alive. The publically released document also has two main features missing...the signature of an official registrar and a Seal.

What the public needs to see for actual proof is a CERTIFICATE of Live Birth.

For a certification of live birth document to be legal, it must be from a State Registrar with a stamp, seal and signed by a person commissioned by the government, preferably the registrar. While having a certificate of live birth is important, it is not proof alone of a person's identity. For identification purposes, a person must also have a government issued ID, social security number and a BIRTH CERTIFICATE.
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Old 08-13-2010, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Northridge, Los Angeles, CA
2,685 posts, read 3,905,051 times
Reputation: 2264

YouTube - Arizona Lawmaker Explains Need For Birth Certificate Laws

Bill of Attainders are unconstitutional. Good work guys! You can believe whatever you want, but you can't force someone to show something if no one else has been forced to. This is solely aimed at Barack Obama himself!

The United States Constitution - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net
Quote:
Article I - The Legislative Branch


Section 9 - Limits on Congress
No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.
If this is the BEST thing we can talk about in United States politics, then there is something seriously wrong with Americans nowadays. There are BIGGER issues than Obama's birth certificate.

But what this shows that it's not just California that's screwed up right now. It's all of America. What will it take for us to be happy?
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Old 08-13-2010, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Simi Valley
2,625 posts, read 3,393,292 times
Reputation: 1027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshadower View Post

But what this shows that it's not just California that's screwed up right now. It's all of America. What will it take for us to be happy?
More jobs, better wages, less government
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