Prop 8 - Judge rules to put marriages on hold (crime, living in)

[.highnlite]

Society does not declare, society does not a voice, it is not a sentient being, unlike yourself. Society is in a constant state of flux, Western Society has been moving away from reliance on superstition toward reason and science, this is not a movement without fits and starts, Heck, 40 % of Americans believe in the Christian theory of Creation, and yet, today Gays were given the right to serve their country openly, fits and starts.
Wrong depends on your culture and your society. You want to think there are absolutes, but, humans are mammals, mammals have no absolutes, they have reactions to stimuli.

If society doesn't decide? One's society and culture decide, everything, if it is not part of the culture and society, it isn't part of the society and culture.

I have to admit, I am so tired of Christians thinking they are entitled to make decisions for this nation, or the people in this nation. Christianity is just a creation of people, just like every other religion, and should not make decisions that affect anyone but those who wish to participate in what ever religion they want to participate in.

Most Christians who claim to speak for god are just full of selfish power seeking BS, and I would like them to all go away.

[Fontucky]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

Society does not declare, society does not a voice, it is not a sentient being, unlike yourself. Society is in a constant state of flux, Western Society has been moving away from reliance on superstition toward reason and science, this is not a movement without fits and starts... etc etc

[Ritchie_az]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

Society does not declare, society does not a voice, it is not a sentient being, unlike yourself. Society is in a constant state of flux, Western Society has been moving away from reliance on superstition toward reason and science, this is not a movement without fits and starts, Heck, 40 % of Americans believe in the Christian theory of Creation, and yet, today Gays were given the right to serve their country openly, fits and starts.
Wrong depends on your culture and your society. You want to think there are absolutes, but, humans are mammals, mammals have no absolutes, they have reactions to stimuli.

If society doesn't decide? One's society and culture decide, everything, if it is not part of the culture and society, it isn't part of the society and culture.

I have to admit, I am so tired of Christians thinking they are entitled to make decisions for this nation, or the people in this nation. Christianity is just a creation of people, just like every other religion, and should not make decisions that affect anyone but those who wish to participate in what ever religion they want to participate in.

Most Christians who claim to speak for god are just full of selfish power seeking BS, and I would like them to all go away.

Ah, I see. So society decides. But society decided and you are unhappy with that decision. Why? Did society "get it wrong" by saying homosexual marriage is "wrong"? If society "got it wrong", does that not mean that society--at least in your mind--does not decide what is "right" and "wrong". Who does? You? Shouldn't you be happy with what society chose, since society chooses?

As far as the "Christianity" stuff, you are entitled to your opinions about it. Others are entitled to theirs. Has it never occured to you that "science and reason" have actually made "believers" out of some folks? Ever seen the documentary "Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed"? Why do you assume that if someone believes in God they are stupid "sheep"? Does puffing out your chest and looking down your nose make you feel better about yourself?

[.highnlite]

But society decided and you are unhappy with that decision

Duh, I have told you several times that I am not a proponent of gay marriage, I am a proponent of equality among men, and women,...

You are welcome to your beliefs, just as the animists in the deepest jungles of amazonia are, they at least have the courtesy not to try to inflict their beliefs on society as some sort of "ultimate truth".

Do I look down my nose at Christians? No, just at Conservatives, but if you are a Conservative Christian, stand by for heavy seas. Or at least, rationality.

I have not seen a pro Christian film since "The Cross and the Switchblade" before your time, I imagine. Oh, and yes, I was a "saved" born again Christian, but then I started thinking about bullsh*t and how humans have suffered from religion, yes, I know that ya'll think religion is good for people, but, as we see, it just brings out the worst in them.

[Ritchie_az]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

Do I look down my nose at Christians? No, just at Conservatives, but if you are a Conservative Christian, stand by for heavy seas. Or at least, rationality.

I have not seen a pro Christian film since "The Cross and the Switchblade" before your time, I imagine. Oh, and yes, I was a "saved" born again Christian, but then I started thinking about bullsh*t and how humans have suffered from religion, yes, I know that ya'll think religion is good for people, but, as we see, it just brings out the worst in them.

This explains a lot (and a lot that I have suspected). You seem to think you know a lot, and a lot more than those who disagree with you. I can't argue further. Good luck!

[californio sur]

Christianity is also rejecting the bigotry of it's own teachings. Two of the largest and historic Christian denominations: Lutherans and Episcopalians not only perform marriages for gay couples but also allow their clergy\ bishops to be gay and in a gay marriage. Ironically the Christian denominations most opposed to homosexuality [namely the Roman Catholic, Mormon, Baptists, evangelicals] have pedophile priests\ overtly prejudice histories, hypocritical ministers caught in gay & drug sex What rationale person would ever view these perverted so-called Christians as authorities on anything? Ever read the book of Mormon or study the sex lives of the popes?

[fivefingers]

Originally Posted by BacktoBlue

My thoughts exactly

I agree with your point of view, this ruling was fair

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by californio sur

Ever read the book of Mormon or study the sex lives of the popes?

I have no idea what the Book of Mormon and the sex lives of the popes have in common. Evidently, neither do you or you would not have made such a ridiculous statement. If you personally have ever read the Book of Mormon (which I highly doubt to be the case), I challenge you to post one statement from it which has anything remotely to do with the topic of the OP. If you're just trying to make the point that religious people are sometimes hypocrites, there is a better way to do it than to ask, "Have you ever read the Book of Mormon?" Stick to the topic when presenting your arguments and they will be taken more seriously.

[.highnlite]

What they have in common? Well, the popes had sex lives in spite of their vows. The Book of Mormon was written by a guy who figured it ok for him to have bunches of wives, of course, his real wife did not agree with that, which is why we have, in addition to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and, The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Incidentally, that "guy" was not killed by a mob, but by a man whose daughter was appropriated by the guy.

I think, that hypocrisy and perversion among the religious was what Californio Sur had in mind.

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

The Book of Mormon was written by a guy who figured it ok for him to have bunches of wives, of course, his real wife did not agree with that, which is why we have, in addition to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and, The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Emma Smith stayed with Joseph from the time they were married until his death. She never left him. She remained behind at the time the Reorganized Church split because she did not like Brigham Young, the new leader of the her husband had founded. Polygamy was not, at that time, illegal anywhere in the United States. There is absolutely no point to anything you are saying. Your personal opinion of Joseph Smith has nothing to do with the OP and you failed to post anything from the Book of Mormon that supports your point of view.

Incidentally, that "guy" was not killed by a mob, but by a man whose daughter was appropriated by the guy.

That is absolutely ridiculous. It is a well-doumented fact that Joseph Smith and his brother were murdered by a mob. Any legitimate historian, LDS or otherwise, would attest to that, and the actual individual who was responsible for organizing the mob was never identified. You're entitled to your own opinion about Joseph Smith, the Book of Mormon and Mormonism, but you are not entitled to your own "facts."

Keep this up, and I can guarantee that this thread will end up getting closed. Is that what you really want out of this discussion?