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Old 01-02-2011, 05:12 PM
 
Location: San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara Counties
6,390 posts, read 3,264,557 times
Reputation: 2622
Well, you didn't skip over this one, now didja?

The right posts from belief not fact, I have a serious problem with people who put their emotions and their beliefs above data. Do your homework post factually, and you won't have to be reminded to do so.
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:28 PM
 
2,090 posts, read 2,167,117 times
Reputation: 1065
Quote:
Well, you didn't skip over this one, now didja?
The only exception from my last post was because *YOU* replied directly to me.

Quote:
The right posts from belief not fact, I have a serious problem with people who put their emotions and their beliefs above data. Do your homework post factually, and you won't have to be reminded to do so.
What emotion? What beliefs? Where's *your* data? Is it because I don't agree with you or I don't worship at your feet, the Most Holy High, that I must be a conservative? Or is it because *I* am concerned about the financial crisis in California when you have *explicitly* stated in another thread that you're not concerned because it doesn't affect you?

You seem to be repeating this same and tired old mantra instead of having a civil discussion about the topic at hand. As usual, it's more of the same unsubstantiated partisan rant coming from you.
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:35 PM
 
4,815 posts, read 5,469,116 times
Reputation: 2653
Some things that bothered me about this past election were the people on the extremes of each side.

The extreme right has no problem shutting out everything Jerry Borwn wants to do and what baffles me is that they thought Meg Whitman was a good choice. HA!

The extreme left people (we know who they are on this site) did nothing but ignore the problems we are facing and brushed it off while bashing all GOP candidates. It's like these people are drinking the same kool aid and won't vote for some one on the other side because their republican.

I am moderately liberal (for gay rights, unions, some social services etc) but I wanted Carly Fiorina to win because I'm just tired of Barbara Boxer and seeing her old aged up face all the time. Carly wasn't the greatest canidate (far from it) but she had potential and I wanted to see her make a difference.

I like Jerry because he is honest and straight forward with his plans and our state's condition unlike Meg Whitman who seemed to lie about her plans and whatnot. I also like that Jerry seems like a moderate liberal. He isn't too far to the left like Gavin Pukesome but he's not too far right like John Mccain or Sarah Palin. He knows what needs to be done and can work with both sides as that is how he is politically.

Those far leftisits need to be open minded. They claim they are yet relentlessly bash all republicans or anyone not in their belief.

The far right wingers need to stop the bickering and give the guy a chance.

Being open minded is accepting both side's points of view and voting against your beliefs is part of being open minded. Shunning one whole side because they are the exact opposite and ignoring all problems is not open minded.
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Old 01-02-2011, 08:35 PM
 
Location: San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara Counties
6,390 posts, read 3,264,557 times
Reputation: 2622
...
Quote:
what emotion? What beliefs? Where's *your* data?

The problem does not lie with me, it is your lack of data on the pensions, Here, let me help you here is your sentence
Quote:
he problem is, no public employee wants to make concession. Were this happening in the private sector, businesses would go out of business in paying the same pension rates and these employees would be out of the job.
You have a belief that state pensions are out of line, that is a belief held by political conservatives, not borne out by the data. As I demonstrated with my statement on the average pension, which is fact, not opinion. These are not difficult concepts.

Is it because I don't agree with you or I don't worship at your feet, the Most Holy High, that I must be a conservative? Or is it because *I* am concerned about the financial crisis in California when you have *explicitly* stated in another thread that you're not concerned because it doesn't affect you?

I generally find apples in apple trees, and oranges in orange trees, most folks identify trees by the fruit they bear. I am sorry you are concerned about the political crisis in California, you should go for a hike, or go surfing, or buy a dirt bike and head for the desert, fresh air is good for people.

You seem to be repeating this same and tired old mantra instead of having a civil discussion about the topic at hand. As usual, it's more of the same unsubstantiated partisan rant coming from you.

I don't have civil discussions with people who "believe" rather than "know", it would be and is fruitless. I fervently wish Abraham Lincoln had let the Confederacy go.

"Partisan" you apparently pay no attention to what I post, I have no partisanship except reasonable rational thinking. I bet you "believe" I have advocated some "liberal" position. There, you see what "belief" will do for you

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Old 01-02-2011, 08:54 PM
 
2,090 posts, read 2,167,117 times
Reputation: 1065
Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
...

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Old 01-02-2011, 09:37 PM
 
253 posts, read 158,640 times
Reputation: 155
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimC2462 View Post

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Old 01-02-2011, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Dublin, CA
3,814 posts, read 1,806,627 times
Reputation: 3884
Yeah, funny. Lets balance this budget on the backs of police, fire, and other public service employees. Yes, the ones who have paid taxes, etc for the past 25+ years of their careers (yes, I digress). However, let us not cut from the welfare recepients; you know, the persons who have been getting money, straight up money, and have not paid one dime into the system? Yes, folks, lets screw over the men/women who have fought and died for their pensions, to ensure some low life, piece of ****, welfare recepient gets their money.

You people are morons and idiots. And don't cry, when don't get what you want. Go to Shanika. Her and her 12 kids can save you; not the police and fire.
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Old 01-02-2011, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 3,554,805 times
Reputation: 1357
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
It's reality! Not enough services can be cut to make up the deficit without running afoul of both federal and state mandates. Clearly, cuts have to be made where they can but that's slim pickens'. Taxes/fees will have to be raised. Let's just hope it doesn't stifle productivity and innovation/venture capital or cause a mass exodus. It has to be a careful juggling act.


Excuse Me But it has already started Just look around.
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Old 01-03-2011, 01:06 AM
 
13,787 posts, read 25,181,931 times
Reputation: 7997
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil306 View Post
Yeah, funny. Lets balance this budget on the backs of police, fire, and other public service employees. Yes, the ones who have paid taxes, etc for the past 25+ years of their careers (yes, I digress). However, let us not cut from the welfare recepients; you know, the persons who have been getting money, straight up money, and have not paid one dime into the system? Yes, folks, lets screw over the men/women who have fought and died for their pensions, to ensure some low life, piece of ****, welfare recepient gets their money.

You people are morons and idiots. And don't cry, when don't get what you want. Go to Shanika. Her and her 12 kids can save you; not the police and fire.
I believe the key is finding a sustainable balance... I say this coming from a background of police and fire volunteers.

My uncle died in the line of duty as a reserve Deputy... he did the job out of pride and public service and made the ultimate sacrifice...

The reality is lots of private sector employees have had a tough go of it... doesn't matter if you retired as a United Airlines Pilot and saw more than half your pension disappear in the reorganization or retired from any of the many unions that promised in writing lifetime medical only to see that go away.

Career military retirees have also had to deal with cutbacks and elimination of promised benefits...

Not all cities are in such dire straights... for those that are... it will take a combined effort for any hope of solvency...

Much of what is spent on welfare programs is allocated through the Federal Government... local Police, Fire and other Public Servants for the most part are funded locally... the Feds made headlines with funding for a few positions in each community... even though the commitment came with an expiration date.

Just think of all those hundreds of thousands strategic defaults from people that promised to replay loans, have the ability to repay and choose to make a "Business" decision to walk... it's sad... but the day of reckoning has arrived and the new reality affects every aspect of our lives.
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Old 01-03-2011, 01:14 AM
 
Location: In Transition
1,304 posts, read 866,427 times
Reputation: 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil306 View Post
Yeah, funny. Lets balance this budget on the backs of police, fire, and other public service employees. Yes, the ones who have paid taxes, etc for the past 25+ years of their careers (yes, I digress). However, let us not cut from the welfare recepients; you know, the persons who have been getting money, straight up money, and have not paid one dime into the system? Yes, folks, lets screw over the men/women who have fought and died for their pensions, to ensure some low life, piece of ****, welfare recepient gets their money.

You people are morons and idiots. And don't cry, when don't get what you want. Go to Shanika. Her and her 12 kids can save you; not the police and fire.
If you look at a pie chart of the CA budget, 75% of what you've listed above is what the budget consists of. You can cut the rest of the 25% down to nothing, and we would STILL have a deficit. You can shut down all the parks, libraries, courts, and legislative offices, and you would STILL have a deficit. Why? Because the majority of the budget is on human services (ie, welfare), jails, and schools. What is the one single largest part of the school budget? Salaries and pensions. K-12 is a labor intensive service, so salaries would naturally be the largest component of that. I can also go down my local county budget, but 80% is covered by justice admin (police), health care, and human services (ie, welfare again). Biggest part of the justice admin budget? Salaries. $300 million in just one average size county alone! As for welfare, I'm going to let you guess why we have so much money allocated for that...

It's not an issue of whether we want fire or police service and education or not. It's how much can we afford. As for me, between my direct fed. / state tax paid, and the TONS of "fees" I pay, I estimate I'm paying 60% of my salary to the state. So what's it going to be, are unions not going to be happy until 100% is taken out and I'm living in a cardboard box while some state retiree is driving that 2011 toy hauler? Then what is reasonable between the current 60% and everything? That's what the average taxpayer wants to know.


And to be on topic, that's what Jerry Brown needs to address... I'm listening with an open mind, but my ground truth is with my wallet, and what's left in it.

Last edited by jkbatca; 01-03-2011 at 01:23 AM..
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