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Old 02-19-2011, 10:25 AM
 
5,113 posts, read 5,954,421 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
Again, it's all here say. I was simply throwing out something I had heard to see if anyone had heard this. According to yours and highnlites responses from opposite sides, it's like just a rumor.
Do a Google search on this ... you get nothing but liberal rhetoric but no specific facts ... this speaks volumes! This is the coordinated liberal talking point to counter what’s going on in Wisconsin and demonize the Governor who is leading the charge.

 
Old 02-19-2011, 10:44 AM
 
Location: San Diego, California Republic
16,583 posts, read 27,308,309 times
Reputation: 9043
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Do a Google search on this ... you get nothing but liberal rhetoric but no specific facts ... this speaks volumes! This is the coordinated liberal talking point to counter what’s going on in Wisconsin and demonize the Governor who is leading the charge.
Well, if that's true then the conservatives must have little to offer.
 
Old 02-19-2011, 10:56 AM
 
5,113 posts, read 5,954,421 times
Reputation: 1748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
Well, if that's true then the conservatives must have little to offer.
Not sure what you’re talking about ... how does a republican offer or defend an accusation that is fabricated for the intent to demonize? People watching the media only hears the mudslinging attacks and usually don't hear if it was a lie or not.
 
Old 02-19-2011, 11:02 AM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,859,442 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Not sure what you’re talking about ... how does a republican offer or defend an accusation that is fabricated for the intent to demonize? People watching the media only hears the mudslinging attacks and usually don't hear if it was a lie or not.
Now how would you know if the truth bit you in your rear? If it did, you'd accuse it of being a liberal dog (with rabies) -- no matter what the evidence.

There is no evidence that will convince a closed mind. For instance, you will now respond that I am liberal, spewing a liberal agenda ... when in fact there is nothing liberal stated in this post.

Go get your shots.
 
Old 02-19-2011, 11:11 AM
 
Location: San Diego, California Republic
16,583 posts, read 27,308,309 times
Reputation: 9043
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Not sure what you’re talking about ... how does a republican offer or defend an accusation that is fabricated for the intent to demonize? People watching the media only hears the mudslinging attacks and usually don't hear if it was a lie or not.
My point was, I simply stated a rumor to anyone who cared to answer it and at no time did I claim that what I posted was a fact. it was just rumor. If the first response or responses I get have the tone of "liberal this" or "liberal that", that's tells me that those who are conservative have little to contribute and back their side up. All they can do is complain about liberals, even when faced with a simple statement.
 
Old 02-19-2011, 12:03 PM
 
5,113 posts, read 5,954,421 times
Reputation: 1748
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
Now how would you know if the truth bit you in your rear? If it did, you'd accuse it of being a liberal dog (with rabies) -- no matter what the evidence.

There is no evidence that will convince a closed mind. For instance, you will now respond that I am liberal, spewing a liberal agenda ... when in fact there is nothing liberal stated in this post.

Go get your shots.
It would take evidence for someone to make up their mind.

You like putting your words in peoples mouth .... and you are frequently dead wrong .... but pointing out that fact won't stop you ...
 
Old 02-19-2011, 01:31 PM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,859,442 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
From what I've also heard it makes sense until you factor in what Bill didn't tell you: Wisconsin has a $137 [million] budget deficit, but in January, the Governor pushed through $140 million in new spending to special interests.
Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
I do not think the deficit is 137 Billion, but only 3.3 billion in worst case. Can you document your data, and the 140 million in new spending?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Do a Google search on this ... you get nothing but liberal rhetoric but no specific facts ... this speaks volumes! This is the coordinated liberal talking point to counter what’s going on in Wisconsin and demonize the Governor who is leading the charge.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
Well, if that's true then the conservatives must have little to offer.
Here's some news updates -- with various quotes that Don9 will attack as being liberal-manufactured propaganda:

Wisconsin Governor Threatens To Replace Union Workers With National Guard

from the article:
"Citing a $137 million budget deficit, [Governor] Walker announced a plan last week which would essentially take away the public union's collective bargaining rights and slash benefits for state employees. Meanwhile, the share of corporate tax revenue funding the state government has fallen by half since 1981 and, according to Wisconsin Department of Revenue, two-thirds of corporations pay no taxes."

""If it had simply to do with the budget there doesn't seem to be a need to eliminate collective bargaining," said Joseph McCartin, a labor historian at Georgetown University. "In other states where state's municipalities have faced difficult times, unions have helped negotiate the way forward."

""none of the unions involved in this have said that they would not be willing to make sacrifices. They have said that they are, and they will." Public and private sector labor leaders in Wisconsin and around the country are joined in opposition of the bill. On a conference call on Monday, conservative and Republican employees across the state spoke out against Walker's plan. "The right to join a union and collectively bargain is a freedom that people have died to protect. To have anyone threaten to wipe it away with minimal public debate, deliberation or discussion is unconscionable," said Janice Bobholz, an employee with the Dodge County Sheriff's Department and a resident of Beaver Dam. The governor's proposal is especially painful given Wisconsin's long history of collective bargaining."

""Maybe the new governor doesn't understand yet - but the National Guard is not his own personal intimidation force to be mobilized to quash political dissent," said Robin Eckstein, a former Wisconsin National Guard member, Iraq War Veteran from Appleton, WI, and member of VoteVets.org. "The Guard is to be used in case of true emergencies and disasters, to help the people of Wisconsin, not to bully political opponents."

All said, however, Curmudgeon's observations a ways back regards to this happening in California (http://www.city-data.com/forum/17923931-post2.html) are very likely correct: like comparing oranges to cheese -- California is not a cheese state

Last edited by observer53; 02-19-2011 at 05:16 PM..
 
Old 02-19-2011, 01:53 PM
 
Location: San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara Counties
6,390 posts, read 9,648,758 times
Reputation: 2622
Ok, let me see if I understand, California has at max a 30 billion deficit, Wisconsin has 137 billion?

True?
 
Old 02-19-2011, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,460 posts, read 20,024,761 times
Reputation: 4365
Wisconsin doesn't have a 137 billion deficit. There are two issues here, outstanding debt and one's budget deficit. The latter obviously contributes to the former. Anyhow, here is a nice graphic of state debt:

50 State-By-State Comparison of Debt | The Big Picture

As you can see, although California has a lot of debt (the red area) its debt in relation to GDP (black area) isn't particularly bad. Wisconsin is worse off, but their situation isn't dire.

Anyhow, sensibly address budget issues is going to have better results than the sort of political drama occurring in Wisconsin.
 
Old 02-19-2011, 03:44 PM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,859,442 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
Ok, let me see if I understand, California has at max a 30 billion deficit, Wisconsin has 137 billion?

True?
The quote is: "Citing a $137 million budget deficit, [Governor]Walker announced" ... so, "million" NOT "billion" ...

(Typo on my brackets in Gentoo's original quote in which he omitted the word altogether ... will try to edit. But the article quote is accurate.)
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