California vs. Texas provides very stark job comparison (Oakland, Petaluma: 2015, foreclose)

[radiolibre99]

The LA areas has several large employers in STEM so I reckon your experience here may just be due to selection bias. Also in terms of those liberal arts majors, they tend to be some of the lower and higher income college educated folks were as STEM folks tend to have modest but consistent pay as a group.

I was mainly referring to the city government which has a lot of people retiring soon and is seeking new blood.

Those that absolutely cannot afford the COL possibly have a flawed business model starting from their foundations. Thus the argument that many businesses failed to adapt to California's higher costs which, as I pointed out before, changed rather quickly amidst economic instability. Adapting would have meant either fundamentally changing themselves to successfully sell a more expensive, better product or to simply leave if they cannot alter their own brand and product image.

I agree. The standards in CA are higher which creates for better business practices here which are more strict. The State is one of the strictest I've ever dealt with. My company back home in Texas constantly complains about every little new thing they have to pay or comply with to the city. But it's made our location one of the nicest and most efficient. The vanity of the boss to keep a location in CA is what keeps us here. He wants us here a vs will adapt to CAs rules.

So no matter what businesses will always remain in CA. And tulemutt is right, why does CA need all the latest and greatest businesses? States like Wyoming, Minnesota and such do fine without Tesla or XYZ Yuppie trendy company. It's not like we have to be the only innovators in the country.

[UB50]

For all the moaning and groaning about how California is such a bad place to start a business, it's amazing how many huge businesses have been started here. Not only Google and Apple, but things like Panda Express and Forever 21.

[dexter14]

Originally Posted by UB50

For all the moaning and groaning about how California is such a bad place to start a business, it's amazing how many huge businesses have been started here. Not only Google and Apple, but things like Panda Express and Forever 21.

Well with the exception of Google, you are talking about companies founded decades ago when CA was a much easier state on business. The biggest ones to come along lately in CA are mostly either tech or biotech corporations like Google, eBay, Facebook etc...Its a completely different business model than someone looking to start a business and open actual retail locations in CA like a restaurant, bookstore, coffeeshop...good luck with that in CA unless you have a TON of money or a very nice direct line of credit.

[UB50]

Panda Express and Forever 21 started in the mid-1980s. That's hardly eons ago. http://www.forever21.com/Company/history.aspx?br=f21

Forever 21's first store was in Highland Park.

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by UB50

Panda Express and Forever 21 started in the mid-1980s. That's hardly eons ago. http://www.forever21.com/Company/history.aspx?br=f21

Forever 21's first store was in Highland Park.

I think the main point is that things started to skyrocket around the 2000s. I remember my dad saying he was thinking about moving us to CA and finding homes that were reasonable. Now, no way.

The economic bubble and crash really hurt CA.

[UB50]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

I think the main point is that things started to skyrocket around the 2000s. I remember my dad saying he was thinking about moving us to CA and finding homes that were reasonable. Now, no way.

The economic bubble and crash really hurt CA.

Huh? California housing prices have been bubbling and crashing for decades now! The last crash was around 2006/2007!

When I moved here (1982) I could have bought a house in Burbank for $100K. My uncle thought that was a boom price because the neighbor bought hers for $76K. Then a few years later, the neighbors across the street paid $144K for a house. Everyone thought that was insane!

In 2007, the house I was living in sold for around $400K (crash price because it was appraised at over $500K just a couple of years earlier). Now it's worth over $600K.

Part of what has caused this real estate madness is Prop 13. People just don't want to sell houses that have a low tax basis. Where this really hurts is in areas like where I live now. Many of the older homes around here were bought by one man in the 1930s through the 1970s. He put them all in a trust. They all have tax basis that are unbelievably low (many under $500 a year). He died. The houses remain in the trust. The heirs now pay that low low tax. There are very few homes for sale around here and they are all very expensive -- and a significant number of homes will never come up for sale.

[dexter14]

Originally Posted by UB50

Panda Express and Forever 21 started in the mid-1980s. That's hardly eons ago. http://www.forever21.com/Company/history.aspx?br=f21

Forever 21's first store was in Highland Park.

Ummm yea, the mid 80s CA under Reagan is NOTHING like the CA of today. I said "decades", not eons. You know how long a decade is right? Forever 21 was founded in 1984. You DO realize that was 31 years ago right? CA was still actually quite affordable for the middle-class to live and do business in back then. Not anymore.

[UB50]

Originally Posted by mbell75

Ummm yea, the mid 80s CA under Reagan is NOTHING like the CA of today. I said "decades", not eons. You know how long a decade is right? Forever 21 was founded in 1984. You DO realize that was 31 years ago right? CA was still actually quite affordable for the middle-class to live and do business in back then. Not anymore.

Look at Nasty Gal: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/25/te...pagewanted=all Started in 2006.

Pinkberry, founded in 2005: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinkberry

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by UB50

Huh? California housing prices have been bubbling and crashing for decades now! The last crash was around 2006/2007!

When I moved here (1982) I could have bought a house in Burbank for $100K. My uncle thought that was a boom price because the neighbor bought hers for $76K. Then a few years later, the neighbors across the street paid $144K for a house. Everyone thought that was insane!

In 2007, the house I was living in sold for around $400K (crash price because it was appraised at over $500K just a couple of years earlier). Now it's worth over $600K.

Part of what has caused this real estate madness is Prop 13. People just don't want to sell houses that have a low tax basis. Where this really hurts is in areas like where I live now. Many of the older homes around here were bought by one man in the 1930s through the 1970s. He put them all in a trust. They all have tax basis that are unbelievably low (many under $500 a year). He died. The houses remain in the trust. The heirs now pay that low low tax. There are very few homes for sale around here and they are all very expensive -- and a significant number of homes will never come up for sale.

Real Estate has always been cyclical... all Prop 13 did was add some stability when it comes to future property tax and takes the guess work out of the equation... voters can at any time approve additional taxes and in my city it has happened more than 25 times...

Buying a home in the 1930's or 1970 has no effect on Prop 13 which became law in 1978.

Many parts of the State were hard hit... I can document 500k homes that lost 80% in value around 2009... every block had foreclosed homes here... other areas were down 50%...

2009 through 2012 were golden buy opportunities... and many bought and in the SF Bay Area up to 40% bought with cash.

[dalparadise]

Originally Posted by mbell75

Well with the exception of Google, you are talking about companies founded decades ago when CA was a much easier state on business. The biggest ones to come along lately in CA are mostly either tech or biotech corporations like Google, eBay, Facebook etc...Its a completely different business model than someone looking to start a business and open actual retail locations in CA like a restaurant, bookstore, coffeeshop...good luck with that in CA unless you have a TON of money or a very nice direct line of credit.

I'll give you bookstores, because nobody opens those anymore, but what about (off the top of my head) Blue Bottle Coffee, Super Duper Burger, Umami Burger, Extreme Pizza, TCHO Chocolates, Jamba Juice, It's a Grind, Kashi, Rasta Taco, The Republic of Tea, Scharffen Berger Chocolates, Clif Bars, Lagunitas Brewing, Bear Republic Brewery, The Melt, Belcampo Meat Co., Cowgirl Creamery--all are restaurant/food/retail focused and have opened within about 20 years in California, with very little start-up money. Most started as mom-and-pop operations.There are many more. These are ones I could think of immediately.