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Unread 07-10-2011, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Portlandia "burbs"
7,315 posts, read 6,695,019 times
Reputation: 14964
Since so many people on this thread are so in favor of cutting services, and positions ~ then where are you during election time????? Because the two major metropolitans ~ LA and SF ~ do not necessarily represent the rest of the state, and if you want better budget-management in California then you will have to bear down and vote for someone (governor) who is NOT concerned with reaching No 1 in the popularity list. And, yes, that could very well mean a ~ gasp! ~ conservative!

But think about something else, too. Do you complain about long waits at DMV? Do you complain about long turn-around times for your building permits? Do you complain that you need more Fire & Life Safety in your area?

Public jobs are no picnic ~ especially when it's understaffed and slave to ever-increasing bureaucrazy (yes, I misspelled it on purpose). Without good compensation those jobs would suffer continual job turnover, and you'd REALLY complain about the services then. (And I suspect that this is what goes on with health insurance companies.)

You may want to probe more into the California school systems to see what all consumes the pyramid of hierarchy. Where I live, it's common for some schools to have TWO principals ~ what the Hell for??? New schools here are constructed to look like palaces ~ are yours? And, again, what the Hell for??? A plain industrial-looking school was good enough for us when we were kids.

By the way, while I'm a resident of Oregon, much of my time and investment is in California.
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Unread 07-10-2011, 06:55 PM
 
Location: Dublin, CA
3,566 posts, read 1,447,846 times
Reputation: 3512
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Tell that to my fireman neighbor who makes well over $150K per year and lives in a million dollar house. Our city is trying to negotiate with the firefighters union, because the city is in the red, and they are unwilling to give. Matter of fact they want an iron clad contract for the next several years to garentee pay and benefits.
For every negative issue you can bring up, I can bring one to combat it.

I told I took a 24 % pay cut. The city I work for told us: Take the pay cut, or we will lay off 24 police officers. We gave in, like fools, and took the pay cut. Less then TWO WEEKS, after signing the side letter, the city turned around and hired 11 more police officers. So, some cities have money, some cities don't.

You are being a typical angry, "I didn't get mine," person and painting everyone with a broadbrush. Not ALL public employees live the life of riley and have unlimited incomes.
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Unread 07-10-2011, 07:33 PM
 
4,322 posts, read 1,955,003 times
Reputation: 1385
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil306 View Post
For every negative issue you can bring up, I can bring one to combat it.

I told I took a 24 % pay cut. The city I work for told us: Take the pay cut, or we will lay off 24 police officers. We gave in, like fools, and took the pay cut. Less then TWO WEEKS, after signing the side letter, the city turned around and hired 11 more police officers. So, some cities have money, some cities don't.

You are being a typical angry, "I didn't get mine," person and painting everyone with a broadbrush. Not ALL public employees live the life of riley and have unlimited incomes.
I'm not angry at the employee's or my neighbor. I'm angry at the corrupt system including the public unions and the public managers that approve such unrealistic compensation and benefits. A firefighter making over 150K is totally outrageous. A public servant like police or firefighters compensation should be in median income range for the area they work in.
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Unread 07-11-2011, 08:09 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
15,904 posts, read 10,757,971 times
Reputation: 7657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
You can't be serious ...

Calpers Wears a Party, or Union, Label

''The flavor of the board is changing,'' said James McRitchie, a state auditor who has run unsuccessfully several times for a seat on the Calpers board. ''You're going to see a board that's increasingly tied to labor.''
Driving the change is a new alignment in the fund's boardroom. Calpers trustees have far more power than directors have over companies, and now, for the first time in memory, all 13 represent either labor or the Democratic Party.
Yes but at the time of the crises the Board consisted of Money Lender Parasites who were busy taking care of themselves at the expense of the taxpayers
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Unread 07-11-2011, 08:33 AM
 
Location: Hills & Hollers of SW MO
17,735 posts, read 13,392,046 times
Reputation: 15076
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
Yes but at the time of the crises the Board consisted of Money Lender Parasites who were busy taking care of themselves at the expense of the taxpayers
Who were democrat appointees and many of whom came straight from unions. It's been that way for years during which most of the malfeasance and corruption has occurred.
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Unread 07-11-2011, 08:54 AM
 
Location: GLAMA
16,591 posts, read 17,341,901 times
Reputation: 15916
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
A firefighter making over 150K is totally outrageous.
What's his rank and how much OT is he doing?
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Unread 07-11-2011, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Paranoid State
2,267 posts, read 1,816,436 times
Reputation: 1739
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
Some long time democrats/liberals have started to take a step back and question whats really going on. They are now starting to realize the current "liberal" movement (in Government power) is far from what traditional democrats/liberals have worked for. They see a real threat to our society as we know it. They can see the direction California and the federal government is heading and its not what they want. They are actually planning major protests for this October against the Obama policies and they are calling it a "Arab Spring" type protests in Washington and around the country.
Yes, that's true.

In While America Aged: How Pension Debts Ruined General Motors, Stopped the NYC Subways, Bankrupted San Diego, and Loom as the Next Financial Crisis, Roger Lowenstein does an excellent job of quoting UAW and other major union management during the pre-WWII era. Essentially, union management agreed that government workers should not be unionized nor have collective bargaining rights due to the unique nature of government and the potential threat to society at large from a unionized governmental work force.

Lowenstein also does a great job showing the moral hazard inherent when those who decide on wages & pensions of government employees receive campaign contributions or threats of withholding campaign contributions from those same employees. The benefit to the politician is privatized, but the cost increases are socialized - everyone else pays, and specifically regarding pensions, the bill comes due years later when it is someone else's problem.
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Unread 07-11-2011, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Paranoid State
2,267 posts, read 1,816,436 times
Reputation: 1739
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil306 View Post
... Police officers, all over this state, are voting OVERWHELMINGLY to take pay cuts, revamp the pension issue, etc all in an attempt to help out the city and state. ...
There is a distinction between police officers and union management.
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Unread 07-11-2011, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Paranoid State
2,267 posts, read 1,816,436 times
Reputation: 1739
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
What was corrupt in California was the Bankers on the PERS Board who used the pension fund to buy up worthless stock so they could unload it from their clients leaving the taxpayers and the Police and Firemen screwed. ...
Can you cite a source for this claim?
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Unread 07-11-2011, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Dublin, CA
3,566 posts, read 1,447,846 times
Reputation: 3512
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don9 View Post
I'm not angry at the employee's or my neighbor. I'm angry at the corrupt system including the public unions and the public managers that approve such unrealistic compensation and benefits. A firefighter making over 150K is totally outrageous. A public servant like police or firefighters compensation should be in median income range for the area they work in.
And who are you to say that? Because you are a "taxpayer?" Your obvious hatred of someone who is a "lowly public servant" is, to be redundant, VERY OBVIOUS. I am a lowly police officer and I mkae 150K a year and I live in a million dollar home. I have NO COLLEGE education either. And? So what of it? I've been shot, thrown out of second story windows, attacked with knives, baseball bats, boards, spit on, exposed to AIDS/HIV, Hep C, and every single other disease you could think of.

I spent the first 8 yrs of my career working midnights. Christmas, 4th of July, and every other holiday. Missed kids birthdays, graduations, et al.

And yes, before you say it: I knew that going in. I also knew the pay and benefits going, which is why I did it. YOU had a chance to do it also and chose another path. Now that YOUR path sucks, you blame everyone else, who took the right path. That is on YOU.

You want people to come save you and pay NOTHING for it. You want state services, city services, and pay nothing for it. You rally against "unions" and not taking pay/benefit/pension cuts. Now that they do, its "not enough."

Its only outrageous, because YOU aren't making that kind of money and getting those types of benefits. And as another poster said: I'll bet that "firefighter" is a Battalion Chief or higher. And/or works a TON of overtime; just like I do. I work approximately 70 hours a week to make the money I do and live the lifestyle I do.

And, I don't despise ANYONE who makes more money then I do. More power to them. IF you can make it, I say make it.

And no, I am not a greedy union member. As I wrote, I agreed to take a 24% pay cut, so 24 police officers wouldn't lose their jobs AND still provide for the community. Yet, we were all screwed over, by a lying corrupt city.

There are always things you don't know, see, or even realize.
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