Why is the Central Valley have alot of poverty and why is agriculture the primary industry? (Los Angeles: neighborhood, gated)

[the city]

Originally Posted by FresnoFacts

Isn't that one of the things you asked: "why is agriculture the primary industry?". Besides geography, no one has addressed climate, the railroads selling land to settlers for farming in the late 1800s, and other factors.

Population growth on the coast forced farmers out of other areas: Citrus growers were forced out of Orange County due to subdivisions; dairy farmers were forced out of the Chino area due to growth; the San Jose area used to be the the Prune Capital covered with apricot, cherry, peach and pear orchards. You attended Northridge State, that campus used to be walnuts, oranges, beans and wheat.

All of those crops have moved to the Central Valley due to development. Usually housing in those coastal areas started out as "affordable housing" for those who could not get closer to LA or SF or could not get better jobs in those cities.

The sprawl and development on the coast you say makes areas undesirable is what pushed many farmers inland.

So you are saying you feel that Southern California and Bay Area suburbs are undesirable due to "sprawl" or "traffic"? Yet their residents seem to disagree.

As already stated, federal labor camps grew out of the Dust Bowl and Depression. There were labor camps built all over California. Dorothea Lange's famous migrant pictures such as this one were taken at a Dust Bowl migrant camp in San Luis Obispo County in 1936 (not the SJV).
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/service/pnp/pp...000/03054r.jpg


You mean like the sprawl or traffic in the Bay Area, San Diego and Southern California? Suburbs in those areas were originally considered more affordable housing.


Taxes are withheld from payroll checks and employers send that to the state.

The bigger problem is with the underground economy, people working for cash not paying taxes (nearly all at jobs outside of ag). Has your family or friends ever paid someone in cash for some work like painting, a car repair, some yard work, etc?

Taxes from a lot of cash work never get paid, its a big problem that no one talks about. Instead people just wink, wink, nudge, nudge and call it working under the table or getting a deal.


So inmates released from the California Mens Colony stay in SLO? Can't be safe for all of those college students.

Or do those released from San Quentin stay in Marin County?

Inmates usually return to where they came from and still have family/friends, they don't stay near the prison.
Its about the jobs and paychecks. Lowest unemployment states recently have been places like North Dakota which is below 4%, lowest in the US. You might not move there but many are for good paying jobs in oil.
New Boom Reshapes Oil World, Rocks North Dakota : NPR

John Muir described the Central Valley as "The valley of the San Joaquin is the floweriest piece of world I ever walked, one vast level, even flower-bed, a sheet of flowers, a smooth sea ruffled a little by the tree fringing of the river and here and there of smaller cross streams from the mountains."

And also Muir said "At my feet lay the Great Central Valley of California, level and flowery, like a lake of pure sunshine, forty or fifty miles wide, five hundred miles long, one rich furred garden of yellow Compositae."

There is a lot of beauty in the Valley when people take the time to see it.

And yet Bakersfield, Visalia, Fresno, Modesto, Stockton, etc already have Macys stores and San Luis Obispo is still waiting for one.

The labor farming camp was in Nipomo which is a farming community. And yes there is vinticulture in SLO county and it's creating poverty in Templeton, Paso Robles, San Luis Obispo, and Atascadero. One part of downtown Paso has become very run down. But most of SLO is still nice and same for Templeton.

SLO doesnt have a Macy's yet because our mall was re-developed into a big box center and the largest department store became Forever 21 because they didn't have any space else where available. And now there is another spot for Forever 21 with Borders gone....

Farming places still create poverty because undocumented workers aren't paying taxes, so cities and counties spend money on them and don't have money coming in for needed services to fix up downtowns and such. And also some governments don't address the issue of poverty. They ignore it and focus on the nicer areas.

We shouldn't send the workers here back, but we can start making people become citizens and actually follow our nation's immigration laws.

[KC6ZLV]

Poverty in the San Joaquin Valley is primarily due to low-wage agricultural work. Most ag related work is seasonal. This is one of the factors behind the high unemployment rates in that, and other ag-dominant areas.

The cities that have Macy's have them because they are cities. Few people in cities work in the agricultural sector. Even those cities located in agricultural regions. People with higher incomes tend to reside in or near cities.

[.highnlite]

Originally Posted by KC6ZLV

The cities that have Macy's have them because they are cities. Few people in cities work in the agricultural sector. Even those cities located in agricultural regions. People with higher incomes tend to reside in or near cities.

A quibble, Santa Maria is 80% Hispanic, most of the them ag workers, and it has a Macy's

Not much of a store, and as me mum says, "Macy's isn't a high end store".

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by the city

Why is the Central Valley have a lot of poverty and why is agriculture the primary industry?

Links and resources to sources are appreciated.

why do you think? The soil is perfect for growning and most rural communities are poor...I am surprised anyone would ask such a question?

Nita

[the city]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

A quibble, Santa Maria is 80% Hispanic, most of the them ag workers, and it has a Macy's

Not much of a store, and as me mum says, "Macy's isn't a high end store".

Some Macy's are high-end and some are low-end. You haven't been to Santa Barbara, San Francisco, or New York's Macy's so you or your mum can't say it's high end until you go to high end Macy's.

And your facts about Santa Maria are false.

Santa Maria, California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

56.2% is white and roughly 70% report that they are latino or latino mixed.

Wikipedia used results from the 2010 census.

[.highnlite]

Originally Posted by the city

Some Macy's are high-end and some are low-end. You haven't been to Santa Barbara, San Francisco, or New York's Macy's so you or your mum can't say it's high end until you go to high end Macy's.

And your facts about Santa Maria are false.

Santa Maria, California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

56.2% is white and roughly 70% report that they are latino or latino mixed.

Wikipedia used results from the 2010 census.

Too funny, While Macy's isn't my cup of tea, I have been to the Macy's in all three of those cities. Got a sport coat at Macy's in Santa Maria 40 some years ago. I helped a young woman buy some dishes at the Macy's in SF and went to the one in New York, for about the same reason.

Now, me mum, she knows her shopping. She likes to fly to Hong Kong or Paris for her clothes, Heck, I bought my last crop of dress shirts in Paris, their shirts simply look and fit better than the Chinese crap we buy here.. Me mum's shopping budget historically was a bit more than most people's

My facts about Santa Maria are false? Yeah, like I was off by 10 %. Actually my facts are accurate and understated more than likely.

Do you really think the tens of thousands of illegals in Santa Maria hang around to get counted in a Census?

Naive is one thing there me bucko, but, you gotta get out more.

[the city]

Originally Posted by .highnlite

Too funny, While Macy's isn't my cup of tea, I have been to the Macy's in all three of those cities. Got a sport coat at Macy's in Santa Maria 40 some years ago. I helped a young woman buy some dishes at the Macy's in SF and went to the one in New York, for about the same reason.

Now, me mum, she knows her shopping. She likes to fly to Hong Kong or Paris for her clothes, Heck, I bought my last crop of dress shirts in Paris, their shirts simply look and fit better than the Chinese crap we buy here.. Me mum's shopping budget historically was a bit more than most people's

My facts about Santa Maria are false? Yeah, like I was off by 10 %. Actually my facts are accurate and understated more than likely.

Do you really think the tens of thousands of illegals in Santa Maria hang around to get counted in a Census?

Naive is one thing there me bucko, but, you gotta get out more.

Census takes into account undocumented workers not in the census if I remember correctly.

Okay, if you compare Macy's to high end designer clothing stores in other nation then Macy's looks cheaper.

And maybe I meant Macy's is classy, not necessarily high end.

And ya know, SLO has a mixed-use center that has classy retailers-

Court Street Center-
Talbot's (designer clothing for females)
Chico's (petite clothing for females)
Abercrombie and Fitch (trendy youth clothing)
French Quarter (locally owned classy store)
Banana Republic (classy clothing store for men and women)
Pottery Barn (pricey houseware)
Yogurt Creations (frozen yogurt eatery)
Peet's Coffee and Tea (trendy coffee shop)
Palazzo Guiseppe (fine dining Italian restaurant)
Powell's Sweet Shoppe (candy and ice cream store)
Sephora (classy perfume and cologne)
Some art shop (sells pricey art)

And also in downtown is Gap, Uptown Jean Co., Express, Patrick James, Sunglass Hut, Papyrus, Solstice Sunglasses, Urban Outfitters, Moondoggies, Victoria Secrets, and other clothing stores.

And then there is Sear's, Kohl's, TJ'Maxx, and Ross which are discount retail clothing stores.

And if we get Macy's it's a classy department store.

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by the city

Census takes into account undocumented workers not in the census if I remember correctly.

Okay, if you compare Macy's to high end designer clothing stores in other nation then Macy's looks cheaper.

And maybe I meant Macy's is classy, not necessarily high end.

And ya know, SLO has a mixed-use center that has classy retailers-

Court Street Center-
Talbot's (designer clothing for females)
Chico's (petite clothing for females)
Abercrombie and Fitch (trendy youth clothing)
French Quarter (locally owned classy store)
Banana Republic (classy clothing store for men and women)
Pottery Barn (pricey houseware)
Yogurt Creations (frozen yogurt eatery)
Peet's Coffee and Tea (trendy coffee shop)
Palazzo Guiseppe (fine dining Italian restaurant)
Powell's Sweet Shoppe (candy and ice cream store)
Sephora (classy perfume and cologne)
Some art shop (sells pricey art)

And also in downtown is Gap, Uptown Jean Co., Express, Patrick James, Sunglass Hut, Papyrus, Solstice Sunglasses, Urban Outfitters, Moondoggies, Victoria Secrets, and other clothing stores.

And then there is Sear's, Kohl's, TJ'Maxx, and Ross which are discount retail clothing stores.

And if we get Macy's it's a classy department store.

Just curious ... is retail consumerism some kind of passion with you? Does it represent the zenith of civilization's achievements, transcending art and philosophy even? What is your point about shopping venues? The world without retail malls would be a wilderness in hell?

That's it for now ... I have to plan my outfit for going to town tomorrow ... wouldn't do to be seen without my 'do', Ray Bans, and Gucci kicks.

[the city]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Just curious ... is retail consumerism some kind of passion with you? Does it represent the zenith of civilization's achievements, transcending art and philosophy even? What is your point about shopping venues? The world without retail malls would be a wilderness in hell?

That's it for now ... I have to plan my outfit for going to town tomorrow ... wouldn't do to be seen without my 'do', Ray Bans, and Gucci kicks.

I like modernization. Art galleries, coffee shops, play houses, fine dining restaurants, and high end clothing stores in downtown.

Dense suburban homes.

Organic grocery markets.

Hiking, running, and going to the gym.

And I don't mind traffic as long as I have a modern downtown and clothing stores that sell classy clothing.

Most cities around America have Macy's, enclosed malls, open-air malls (lifestyle centers), and high end places.

Monterey has the Del Monte Center. Santa Barbara has downtown and La Cumbre Plaza.

San Luis Obispo has downtown and the "soon-to-be" Macy's.

And more examples-
Roseville Galleria in Roseville
Village at Corte Madera in Corte Madera
Simi Valley Town Center in Simi Valley
The Oaks Mall in Thousand Oaks
San Francisco Center in Downtown San Francisco

[esmith143]

Farming is associated with poverty because farmers are among the few people in this country who compete directly with farmers from third-world countries, where wages are much lower and conditions for agriculture are better.

Central Valley is a semi-desert. It is very difficult to justify economically any kind of agriculture in Central Valley, when water has to be pumped at high cost over great distances. California specializes in a few select industries where some kind of competitive advantage can be had, such as wine grapes, because of their relatively high market value and low water requirements, or milk, which is consumed domestically, because you can't bring milk from China. But most types of produce simply don't make sense here. It costs pennies per pound to transport agricultural produce from China in a container ship. Just the cost of irrigation in southern Central Valley will contribute upwards of 25c/pound to the cost of most kinds of fruit and vegetables.

And so our agriculture survives on razor thin profit margins, some degree of mechanization, healthy government subsidies, and illegal migrant workers. In many cases, the choice is between hiring illegal migrants and going bust.

For example, why is it that Central Valley does not produce potatoes? One acre of potato field will produce around $1200 worth of potatoes at the typical yield and wholesale price today (call it 15,000 lbs/acre at $0.08/lb). These prices are essentially set by the three largest worldwide producers of potatoes - China, India and Russia.

But it will cost you $1800 to grow those potatoes, even if you do it in the Imperial Valley (which is canal-irrigated and therefore water is almost free) and you pay the minimum wage to all your workers.

http://coststudies.ucdavis.edu/files/potatoes.pdf

Move to Bakersfield, and suddenly just the water bill for 5 acre-feet of water needed to grow those potatoes is $2500.

Therefore potatoes are out, and a lot of other plants are out too, and it is only on rare occasions that you can actually afford to grow something here. And even if you do, you certainly can't afford to pay much more than the minimum wage to your workers.