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Old 01-09-2012, 02:15 PM
Status: "Grains....Grains" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,312 posts, read 10,217,720 times
Reputation: 4038
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffredo View Post
"Fresh" water is Einstein.
Fresh water is Einstein? Here I thought Einstein was a person. But ignoring the ambiguity, yes, I'm perfectly aware that most of the water on the planet is salt water. But I'm also perfectly aware that converting salt water into fresh water is a simple matter, heck, you can do it at home with the sun.

Regardless, water is not a "critical issue". At some point areas like Southern California will run out and at that point they will have to start using less and ultimately get it from the ocean or some other higher cost method. The only thing that would make the situation "critical" is when you have a state controlled by Republicans (e.g., Texas) that refuses to appropriately fund infrastructure because such infrastructure spending may....god forbid...result in a tax increase.
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Old 01-09-2012, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Old Hyde Park, Kansas City,MO
1,145 posts, read 1,111,336 times
Reputation: 540
Quote:
Originally Posted by CyanideThistles View Post
Who knows, maybe in 20 years, Texas might be the largest populated state and people in say, Michigan for example, will think about taking a vacation to Texas instead of California.
Why would anyone think about taking a vacation to Texas over California? Cali has nature beauty, miles of coastline, endless sunshine, great temps, tons of good restaurants, lots of beautiful women and hollywood.

Texas is a built up mirage in the middle of the plains with flat boring scenery, hot temps, drought, tons of Fast Food places and fat people.

If Air Conditioning never existed, wonder how populated Texas would really be? In Cali, in a good majority of places have the perfect weather.
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Old 01-09-2012, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Glendale, CA
1,158 posts, read 1,010,815 times
Reputation: 1098
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Water on a planet that is mostly covered in it...is not a critical issue.

Droughts in California are relatively common, yet the vast majority of water usage in California is for luxury.......often ridiculous luxury. So much you can change before you ever think about your toilet flushing habits....
Actually most of the water in California that is used by man is used for agriculture. So, unless you consider "food" a luxury item, that's not true.

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Old 01-09-2012, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
12,568 posts, read 12,558,156 times
Reputation: 7724
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Fresh water is Einstein? Here I thought Einstein was a person. But ignoring the ambiguity, yes, I'm perfectly aware that most of the water on the planet is salt water. But I'm also perfectly aware that converting salt water into fresh water is a simple matter, heck, you can do it at home with the sun.

Regardless, water is not a "critical issue". At some point areas like Southern California will run out and at that point they will have to start using less and ultimately get it from the ocean or some other higher cost method. The only thing that would make the situation "critical" is when you have a state controlled by Republicans (e.g., Texas) that refuses to appropriately fund infrastructure because such infrastructure spending may....god forbid...result in a tax increase.
De-salination on a large scale is highly energy dependent. Not easy to do - or it would be routinely done already.

Which infrastructure in Texas is missing related to water?
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Old 01-09-2012, 03:15 PM
Status: "Grains....Grains" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,312 posts, read 10,217,720 times
Reputation: 4038
Quote:
Originally Posted by DynamoLA View Post
Actually most of the water in California that is used by man is used for agriculture. So, unless you consider "food" a luxury item, that's not true.
Except of course there are many ways California can get food, only one of which is actually growing it. Though I was speaking of urban use, this demonstrates my point as well, most water in California is not used efficiently. Growing corps with high water needs in the high desert isn't exactly an efficient use of water.....

Increased water costs or the removal of subsidies by farmers will just mean that some corps will leave California. Nothing critical about that....
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Old 01-09-2012, 03:26 PM
Status: "Grains....Grains" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,312 posts, read 10,217,720 times
Reputation: 4038
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffdano View Post
De-salination on a large scale is highly energy dependent. Not easy to do - or it would be routinely done already.
The fact that it isn't routinely used today has nothing to do with the difficulty of the process and everything to do with relative costs. There is no reason to bother with desalination so long as their are cheaper means available, but when those means get tapped out costs will increase and desalination will make sense. Hence, the only thing that would make the situation critical is a lack of foresight...

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffdano View Post
Which infrastructure in Texas is missing related to water?
I don't know, perhaps the infrastructure that would provide sufficient water to its residents? I don't know, in my world when cities start literally running out of water its a sign that someone didn't build the appropriate infrastructure...

But that is how Republicans run things, they are like short-sighted businessman that will run their factories to the ground with no continued investment and then wonder what happened when everything seems to start going wrong....
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Old 01-09-2012, 06:32 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
12,568 posts, read 12,558,156 times
Reputation: 7724
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
The fact that it isn't routinely used today has nothing to do with the difficulty of the process and everything to do with relative costs. There is no reason to bother with desalination so long as their are cheaper means available, but when those means get tapped out costs will increase and desalination will make sense. Hence, the only thing that would make the situation critical is a lack of foresight...


I don't know, perhaps the infrastructure that would provide sufficient water to its residents? I don't know, in my world when cities start literally running out of water its a sign that someone didn't build the appropriate infrastructure...

But that is how Republicans run things, they are like short-sighted businessman that will run their factories to the ground with no continued investment and then wonder what happened when everything seems to start going wrong....
You're right about de-salination. They don't do it now because it costs too much. But it is widely done in the Middle East where the water issue is more dire.

As for infrastructure in Texas - you are just guessing. No one is any less able to obtain water than anywhere else during a severe drought. About twenty years ago Austin had water rationing due to pumping capacity that hadn't kept up with population growth. They fixed it.

Somehow you extend all of that to a political party issue and poorly run factories.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:40 PM
Status: "Grains....Grains" (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,312 posts, read 10,217,720 times
Reputation: 4038
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffdano View Post
As for infrastructure in Texas - you are just guessing. No one is any less able to obtain water than anywhere else during a severe drought. About twenty years ago Austin had water rationing due to pumping capacity that hadn't kept up with population growth.
I knew this was coming..... Any water system in a drought prone area needs to be able to handle droughts. After all, the probability of a severe drought in the Austin area over say 2 decades isn't low....

Building infrastructure after severe problems occur isn't an example of good governance....and it always costs more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffdano View Post
Somehow you extend all of that to a political party issue...
Extend? It is a political party issue... Republicans fund infrastructure as little as possible, that usually means not funding spending on events that are irregular or abstract in nature. This is hardly the only example....
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Old 01-10-2012, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Bothell, Washington
2,271 posts, read 2,087,653 times
Reputation: 2875
Quote:
Originally Posted by hsw View Post
Population means nothing

China, India, FL, NY, etc are highly populated places with poor economic or intellectual productivity on any per capita basis (hell, even on any total basis)

Real question is where are smartest kids from anywhere choosing to migrate to build their careers and fortunes

Suspect answer still remains PaloAlto region for tech....and Houston (and Dallas) for oil&gas.....the world's most innovative and lucrative industries
To add to that- even if Texas becomes more populated, it doesn't mean it'll have any real attraction for people from Michigan or other states to go there on vacation. They still won't have the beaches, mountains, etc. that California has. I took a trip last year to California to see Yosemite National Park and the beautiful coastal area around Big Sur- I certainly would get nothing even remotely like that in Texas.
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Old 01-10-2012, 01:44 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
12,568 posts, read 12,558,156 times
Reputation: 7724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
Ya mean he was actually gonna start doin' it. Kinda hard ta break the outhouse habit I would think.

Lemme guess. He's from Texas too.
Born in your state (MO), and a San Francisco resident for more than twenty years.
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