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Old 01-09-2012, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Metro Phoenix
11,048 posts, read 16,766,666 times
Reputation: 12944

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Nooooo!

Man, if all it would have taken was wearing dress and calling girls "girlfriend" to get access to the girl's locker room in Junior High...

Seriously though, I am somewhat glad this got defeated. Not because I believe that transgendered people are "wrong" or anything; quite the contrary. I just don't think it's appropriate to invite sexualization and gender identity to kids before it would have happened; this would have done that.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:10 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,585,045 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
Seriously though, I am somewhat glad this got defeated. Not because I believe that transgendered people are "wrong" or anything; quite the contrary. I just don't think it's appropriate to invite sexualization and gender identity to kids before it would have happened; this would have done that.
I'm glad you're glad, but I have a question: if there's nothing wrong with transgendered people, then what could possibly be inappropriate about introducing kids to the idea? I mean, transvestites can already teach in the schools and, as of Jan 1, cannot be dismissed or removed from the classroom. So what's the big deal?
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Metro Phoenix
11,048 posts, read 16,766,666 times
Reputation: 12944
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
I'm glad you're glad, but I have a question: if there's nothing wrong with transgendered people, then what could possibly be inappropriate about introducing kids to the idea? I mean, transvestites can already teach in the schools and, as of Jan 1, cannot be dismissed or removed from the classroom. So what's the big deal?
I don't feel like getting into this. Sorry.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:28 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,585,045 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
I don't feel like getting into this. Sorry.
No problem. The fact is that you don't have an answer. You know, intuitively, that transgenderism is morally wrong, or at least harmful, and that's why you're uncomfortable with kids being exposed to it. But you have been conditioned since 1st grade not to condemn or criticize anyone's sexual preferences, and so rather than think about it all you can really do is emote.
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:36 PM
 
Location: San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara Counties
6,390 posts, read 9,635,072 times
Reputation: 2622
Quote:
I'm glad you're glad, but I have a question: if there's nothing wrong with transgendered people, then what could possibly be inappropriate about introducing kids to the idea? I mean, transvestites can already teach in the schools and, as of Jan 1, cannot be dismissed or removed from the classroom. So what's the big deal?
Don't you think it is wrong that flaming heterosexuals flaunt their heterosexuality in front of children every day?

Your basic problem is this; Jesus said, love one another. He did not say "love those who believe as you do"
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:52 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,585,045 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
Don't you think it is wrong that flaming heterosexuals flaunt their heterosexuality in front of children every day?
Perhaps "flaunting" is a bad idea, depending on what you mean by that. But heterosexuality is healthy, normal, and naturally human. Teachers should talk about their husbands, wives, fiancees, and parents in order to establish and foster a sense of normal in the lives of their students.

Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
Your basic problem is this; Jesus said, love one another. He did not say "love those who believe as you do"
True. Hence, I love transvestites and want them to be happy.

Jesus also said:

"Have ye not read, that he who made man from the beginning, Made them male and female? For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they two shall be in one flesh."
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:54 PM
 
Location: San Jose
68 posts, read 166,556 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
No problem. The fact is that you don't have an answer. You know, intuitively, that transgenderism is morally wrong, or at least harmful, and that's why you're uncomfortable with kids being exposed to it. But you have been conditioned since 1st grade not to condemn or criticize anyone's sexual preferences, and so rather than think about it all you can really do is emote.
WesternPilgrim, you sound like you have a solid understanding why "transgenderism is morally wrong, or at least harmful", can you please enlighten me, and perhaps others, on why is it so?
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Old 01-09-2012, 07:54 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,585,045 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by .highnlite View Post
Your basic problem is this; Jesus said, love one another. He did not say "love those who believe as you do"
P.S. Don't be a fundie bible-thumper.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:07 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,585,045 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilushka View Post
WesternPilgrim, you sound like you have a solid understanding why "transgenderism is morally wrong, or at least harmful", can you please enlighten me, and perhaps others, on why is it so?
Transgenderism is morally wrong because it is a rejection of a gift of God. To be male or female is fundamentally good. It is a matter of God's choosing, not ours. To reject one's given sex is the sin of ingratitude. It is also wrong because it is a sin against one's family, neighbors, and society, all of whom have a right to treat every other person according to their given sex.

Transgenderism is harmful because it makes people miserable and perverts normal, healthy sexuality. It also sends a false, godless message: that man is his own creator, the author of his own life.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Metro Phoenix
11,048 posts, read 16,766,666 times
Reputation: 12944
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
No problem. The fact is that you don't have an answer. You know, intuitively, that transgenderism is morally wrong, or at least harmful, and that's why you're uncomfortable with kids being exposed to it. But you have been conditioned since 1st grade not to condemn or criticize anyone's sexual preferences, and so rather than think about it all you can really do is emote.
....mmno. I really, sincerely don't have anything wrong with people who are transgendered, nor do I have an issue with the thought of my child being taught by someone who's transgendered who is a good teacher who's genuinely interested in fostering a child's intellectual curiosity. I've known, worked with, and befriended a few different TG people... I've had TG coworkers who functioned totally normally as people in society. I also have a friend who's brother now wears cocktail dresses and acts like he's a 12 year old girl. I've met and gotten to know people all across the spectrum.

I think it's totally appropriate for people to live life as they see fit, and I think that it's the school's legal obligation to protect the rights of a child who has a penis but feels that he's a girl. I just don't feel that it's appropriate for that little boy who feels that he's a girl to be the lone penis in a locker room full of vaginas, or vice versa.

At my school, there were handicapped bathrooms/changing rooms that were unattached to the main locker rooms. If a kid had a note from a doctor or psych that said that, for whatever reason, they didn't feel comfortable in the changing room with people of the same gender, and that was that. Problem solved. Psych says that Tommy really feels that he's Tammy and doesn't feel comfortable changing around other biological males, To/ammy can quickly change in the other bathroom and then comes out to gym with everyone else. I don't recall any of the guys having an issue, but I know a few girls had notes about it and changed alone; no one ever gave them crap about it.
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