Clearlake (Fremont, Santa Rosa, Santa Barbara: middle-class, rental, crime)

[biogal]

I've seen auctions to buy land in Clearlake. Is it worth it? I can imagine waking up and seeing a lake one day, but all I hear are dirty, meth labs, ex-cons and so on. Any advice? What's this area really like??
thanks

[deeptrance]

Clearlake has a horrible history and the rumors you're hearing are accurate. But it's a beautiful area and eventually it HAS to improve, at least that's what I would guess. People want to live in Cali, it's unaffordable in most places, Clearlake is in the mountains (sort of) and it's bound to improve eventually. But the summers are very hot and dry, the roads to access the area are HORRIBLE, and Clearlake itself isn't a very pretty lake IMO. So..... I guess I'm not being very helpful.... I have mixed feelings about it. Other areas around the lake are much nicer than Clearlake.

[grimstuff]

I grew up about 40 miles from Clearlake and I also worked a delivery route around the lake for years. Here's my impression:
The actual lake itself is beautiful, I can't deny that. However, it is heavily polluted by mine tailings (poisonous minerals left in heaps of soil, draining into streams and waterbodies, most notably mercury) which renders the fish unsafe to eat on a regular basis. It is also polluted by antiquated sewage systems and leech fields from nearby housing. One year, there was a flood (the lake overfills regularly as there is only one natural outlet) and the City of Clearlakes sewers ruptured and the downtown area was flooded waist-high by sewage-contaminated water.

However, the lake is beautiful, making some fantastic views for sunsets. It is a big recreational lake, with lots of boats and jet-skis. It is actually the second largest natural lake in Northern California (behind Tahoe). The entire area is an active volcanic region, as Mt. Konocti is a dormant volcano. Little earthquakes can be felt regularly by residents living on or near the volcano. This is actually one of the few places in the world where the magma comes very close to the surface through the continental plate's crust. They make use of this geothermal process with energy-producing plants south of this area, on the mountain ridge near Middletown. They actually built a large pipeline pumping water from Clearlake up to these geothermal energy plants in order to inject into the deep fissures to produce the steam. Anyway, that's off topic. But what I am getting at are just the interesting things about this area.

With that said, the towns around Clearlake are mostly severely economically depressed. The City of Clearlake is probably the most depressed, and depressing. There is a lack of basic infrastructure; some streets within the city limits consist of 3-foot-deep rutts in the dirt... more like an arroyo than a street. Where the streets are paved, they are ridden with potholes. Most of the housing consists of mobile trailers with overgrown yards, cars on cinderblocks, roaming dogs... you get the picture. WHy is it like this? I'm sure there are myriad of reasons, but the main one is drugs and its associated crime. The drugs and crime are pretty bad over there. And I may be understating it, because I want to give them the benefit of the doubt. But I have a lot of experience in this area, had a bunch of friends who lived in the area, and heard their stories. Basically the area is so depressing for young kids they get involved with drugs real quick. It is also an attractive area for ex-cons or (I'm completely serious) escaped cons to hide out and blend in. There is also a preponderance of welfare recipients (based on personal research I did, not just my opinion).

On the north side of the lake are a bunch of little communities and hamlets which have little resort-style motels which have seen better days. A lot of drive-in mobile parks for people staying the night or a week or so. On the east side, is the City of Clearlake, referred to above. On the south side are more small communities and towns, a little better, I would say, than the north or east. I would attribute this to a healthy wine and orchard industry in the area with some nice tasting rooms and restaurants. THe towns though, are still nothing to brag about. On the west side is the City of Lakeport, which would be the only town up there that I would even consider living in. The downtown is actually fairly nice with some intersting local businesses. But still, Lake County is very economically depressed.

I know/knew a lot of people moving to Clearlake (when people say that they usually refer to the area east of the lake) from Santa Rosa area or Middletown. They were mostly in the trades, and commuted long distances to their places of employment. It is only a matter of time before some very large subdivisions come into the area, I believe, as the area is ripe to be walked on. The only problem is attracting middle-class families to the depressed area. So to go along with what another commenter said on this thread, its bound to get better in the future, but I don't think by much. It will always be geographically secluded from more vibrant areas, and there are strong ties to trans-generational poverty and drug addiction. It's sad, because it's a very beautiful area, with pronounced seasonal changes. Springtime among the orchards south of the lake is very nice, as I recall.

The only nice place I can think of at the moment is an area called Buckingham, on the south side of the lake, at the picturesque base of Mt. Konocti. There are some nice homes, nice neighborhoods, and a fun little English pub I used to enjoy a pint at with friends. However, its a small area, and I doubt it would be easy to find a place to rent or buy.

[deeptrance]

Grim, where were you based? I didn't know the lake to be as beautiful as you say it is, because I never traversed around it the way you did. I owned property on Cobb Mountain for a while, which I thought was a pretty area though it's even more isolated than the rest of the area.

I've got friends who live in Kelseyville now, that's one of the nicer towns around the lake and they generally like it but are sick of the isolation. Like we've both said, the roads in and out are a major problem. It raises the question of what would happen to the area economically if a major highway cut through the mountains and connected it to the outside world. I doubt this will happen, but some people I know in Sonoma County say they've heard rumors of Disney putting in a big resort by the lake! I find that hard to believe, and I'm sure that rumor could be easily confirmed or denied with some web research that I'm too lazy to conduct at the moment... YOU do it!

[grimstuff]

Originally Posted by deeptrance

Grim, where were you based? I didn't know the lake to be as beautiful as you say it is, because I never traversed around it the way you did. I owned property on Cobb Mountain for a while, which I thought was a pretty area though it's even more isolated than the rest of the area.

I've got friends who live in Kelseyville now, that's one of the nicer towns around the lake and they generally like it but are sick of the isolation. Like we've both said, the roads in and out are a major problem. It raises the question of what would happen to the area economically if a major highway cut through the mountains and connected it to the outside world. I doubt this will happen, but some people I know in Sonoma County say they've heard rumors of Disney putting in a big resort by the lake! I find that hard to believe, and I'm sure that rumor could be easily confirmed or denied with some web research that I'm too lazy to conduct at the moment... YOU do it!

I remember rumors like this milling around about the time they built the Worldmark resort near Lucerne and Nice - people thoughts it was the harbringer of big-time resorts and outside money and jobs. Well, that was like 10 years ago and I have yet to see any sign of anything else coming. Of course, I'm out of the loop up there as far as development goes, but I remain skeptical. THe place has a lot of potential, there's no doubt, but its in the long-long term, like 20 years or more before significant changes are seen. The City of Clearlake's planning dept. is very understaffed and burdened with paper-shuffling permits around and not long-range planning. There is very little social capital to build on, as the drugs, poverty, and crime keep everyone in their own worlds.

I grew up in Ukiah, as I mentioned in another thread. I drove a delivery truck to all the towns around the lake and saw them all in their different conditions and spoke with the locals about their problems. Many firiends I had were also from that area. Kelseyville is one of the nicer towns there, I do remember that. But its all relative, you know.

[deeptrance]

Originally Posted by grimstuff

I grew up in Ukiah, as I mentioned in another thread. I drove a delivery truck to all the towns around the lake and saw them all in their different conditions and spoke with the locals about their problems.

Interesting, and I have to assume more recent than I was around there because I moved from Sebastopol to Austin in 1990 and you're an undergrad. Not that one can't go to school at any point in life, but I'm just curious about our time frames.

You seem to have a very similar geographical range of experience in Cali as mine, though you tend to be north of my places. I spent my first 20 years in Santa Barbara, then moved to Sonoma County from 1976 to 1990 with a 2 year break for grad school at U Mass (BRRRR!!!!) I absolutely LOVE the changes that have happened in central SLO and maybe that's an area our friend Iriegirl would like. Not too far from hyper-artsy Carmel but not quite as expensive and much more connected to the real world. I could easily live in downtown SLO, and the climate is dreamy! Better, for my tastes, than Santa Barbara cuz it's slightly more varied and has easier access to wildly differing weather if you just hop in your car and point toward the ocean or over the mountain pass.

It's too bad about the financial constraint on Irie, but that's the story of California. The place is just ridiculously expensive and I'd recommend that she open her mind to other states if she's concerned about costs. I've spent the last 2 summers road-tripping the USA and have been amazed by how many truly great places there are, though all have their negative sides. And the places that have no negatives (Sausalito comes to mind) are so expensive as to be absurd. Alas..... 'tis a pity not to be fabulously wealthy, eternally youthful, gorgeous, brilliant, and in excellent health...

By the way, if I lived anywhere near SLO, I'd want to meet for coffee and grill you for information about planning and related topics. Your posts are all very interesting to me.

[grimstuff]

Originally Posted by deeptrance

Interesting, and I have to assume more recent than I was around there because I moved from Sebastopol to Austin in 1990 and you're an undergrad. Not that one can't go to school at any point in life, but I'm just curious about our time frames.

You seem to have a very similar geographical range of experience in Cali as mine, though you tend to be north of my places. I spent my first 20 years in Santa Barbara, then moved to Sonoma County from 1976 to 1990 with a 2 year break for grad school at U Mass (BRRRR!!!!) I absolutely LOVE the changes that have happened in central SLO and maybe that's an area our friend Iriegirl would like. Not too far from hyper-artsy Carmel but not quite as expensive and much more connected to the real world. I could easily live in downtown SLO, and the climate is dreamy! Better, for my tastes, than Santa Barbara cuz it's slightly more varied and has easier access to wildly differing weather if you just hop in your car and point toward the ocean or over the mountain pass.

It's too bad about the financial constraint on Irie, but that's the story of California. The place is just ridiculously expensive and I'd recommend that she open her mind to other states if she's concerned about costs. I've spent the last 2 summers road-tripping the USA and have been amazed by how many truly great places there are, though all have their negative sides. And the places that have no negatives (Sausalito comes to mind) are so expensive as to be absurd. Alas..... 'tis a pity not to be fabulously wealthy, eternally youthful, gorgeous, brilliant, and in excellent health...

By the way, if I lived anywhere near SLO, I'd want to meet for coffee and grill you for information about planning and related topics. Your posts are all very interesting to me.

Let me know when you plan on coming through SLO again and we'll meet for coffee. About the time frame, driving that delivery truck was my first job till I left that area and moved to NY. My father drove the route before me, so I sort of grew up riding along with him and helpinghim out before I took over and he retired. After living in upstate NY, FL, Ventura, then Ukiah again, I decided to go back to school. So here I am at Cal Poly getting my degree in planning. I never felt like Ukiah was "home" to me, so I always wanted to find some place where my wife and I could settle down. I've driven across the U.S. twice (once through the south and once through the north) and the only place that has ever really called out to me was New England. Marin County is great, but like you said its for the wealthy and I would just feel like a fish out of water there. We have a relative in Mill Valley and I think they pay something like 3,500+ for the house they rent (it has a view of SF). They do pretty well with their own business so it isnt a strain, but I don't think we'd ever be able to cough up that much dough every month on a single payment without questioning our sanity - regardless of how much I made.

I agree, SLO might be a nice place for Iriegirl, although if she isn't a student it might be a little awkward since 35% of SLO's population are students. I think there is a silly stigma attached to young adults who arn't in school or who have never been to college. The social disparities are more pronounced, I'd say. But hell, pretty much any place on the coast in CA is nice and artsy to a degree... I'm sure she'll do fine.

[digdug]

I'd have to agree with everything grimstuff said. I grew up in Santa Rosa and am now living in Windsor and commuting to SF...that's another story though.

As a kid I used to hate hearing that we were going camping at Clear Lake State Park or similar. HOT and very little shade back in the 70's. The water always made me itch too. I haven't set foot in that area in many many years.

[indy-pooh]

I'm a 37 yr old (feel 25, tho) single mom w/ 2 boys - 11 & 13. I've been going

to Clearlake (the town) since I was about 12. My gma's husband, after surviving Pearl

Harbor & the war, came home, bought 2 plots across the lake from & w/a view of Mt

Konocti. Its up a hill @ the end of the street, at the base of a Mtn. On the property are 4

buildings he built himself; the 'cabin' set way back from the road which he lived in while

building the 2 bdrm house (fireplace, huge bdrms, huge family ktch, picture window, big

frnt prch & screened-in back prch/extra bdrm), behind that is the work shed (cute)

w/lrg cncrt patio btween, and last is the det 2 car gar at the end of a long drvwy. All 4

bldngs match - all stucco painted the same color w/white trim, The cabin even has the

same frnt prch, ptched roof, & brick chimney. Even the shed & garage look like little

houses & all look like they could've been built last week - in style & preservation. It was

vacation home/fishing retreat until they finally made it home. My gma was diagnosed

w/dimentia, & he cared for her until his death, but she didnt want to leave so my mom

(who lives in Fremont, 2 hrs away) hired care, & went up every couple weeks also until

gma was too sick & has to go w/my mom until her death a few yrs ago. There are 6 kids

btwn them, plus spouses, kids, grandkids, & all wanted to sell (even tho' there was no

mrtge), except my mom. She now proudly owns all of it & still drives 2x a mo to care for

it.
In june the rental (in So Cal) we've shared w/my dad for 5 yrs was sold, &

not having $2500 to move, no other options, me & the kids were about 3 days from a

shelter (I had a decent job, car, good friends). i called my mom & she offered me the

Clearlake house free, as long as I needed or wanted, as our own home. It was just an

option - for about 30 min, for me to realize it was the only one & I had to take it, & make

the decision. We've moved A LOT, but never away, & i dreaded telling them. They were

awesome & said 'let's go for it' (after seeing the skate park online).
We've never really had or own place, either living w/people, or people w/us.

We not only have our own house (not apt), we have property in a resort area, 'guest

quarters' & 2 other buildings. We actually lose eachother (I 'escape'). I can smell the

water, the good lakey smell, & hear the boats from the house & can walk till my toes are

wet in 8 min.
The areas that are bad as a whole aren't bad in the way of other cities, tho.

And drugs are everywhere, meth is EVERYWHERE (been there, I know), & honestly have

yet to cross it's path here so far, even tho' i've not ventured much, if it was as bad as

rumored, I would have at least one story for you. the rumors about the crime are a bit

much, i think. There's mostly drunk in pub, drunk couple fights, & the occasional stolen

bike in the police blotter every day. And all crimes must be in daylight cause from 9pm to

6am its dead quiet - no cars, sirens, music, or voices. my kids make all the night noise I

ever hear.
The mobile home thing is a fact. I hopped on the bus (a little bored) just to

see parts i never would, & across the hwy is very different. Dirt raods, Not 'woodsy'

and all mobiles - every variation possible from brand new house-like, to corugated metal,

& not uniformly placed at all. they're every angle, north to south, east to west, & all

combos. willy-nilly, no rhyme or reason. My first thought was 'how ghetto & depressing'

but was soon smiling, & realizing Clearlake is its own world, & 'Quirky Quaint', & very

Mayberry, where 6 figure homes sit next to dilapidated fishing shacks & it looks normal

here & works. Theres a lot of new homes going up all over, but only 1 -4 in a spot so its

not bad, & funding from Santa Rosa to rebuild & improve Lakeshore Dr. A lot of the

lakesite cottages/resorts have been fixed up 7 now house tourists instead of the riff

raff that lived in them.
The Best Thing thats happened? My oldest son had a friend from the skate

park over the other day, & instead of straight to his room & online he was leading him

allover. When i asked 'what's up?' he said (tears) 'nothin, just showin my friend where i

live' He's never showed anything but the computer & trampoline. He's proud of where we

live, & what we have, & they're happy.
I know it's not for everyone, but if you're around again, look differently, see

it's charm, drive around new areas.
If anyone's interested, i did the scenic drive & have photos that might

surprise you, or would like to see my home we're all so proud of, email me at

indy.pooh.1@gmail.com, & will get them to you. If anyone's still reading, Thank you, &

God Bless

[grimstuff]

Indy-pooh, glad to here you are fortunate enough to live in the only nice area of Clearlake.