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Old 01-27-2012, 01:30 PM
 
281 posts, read 254,326 times
Reputation: 95

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueTimbers View Post
I am quite up on history, thank you...... SO what are you saying... Because something was deemed correct in "the past" it should be deemed correct today?

I would imagine you can think of a few embarrassing atrocities societies of the past have committed that are not accepted today.. yes?

It is highly probable one day in the future humanity will look back at this time, and say "boy what closed minded neanderthals our ancestors were"..

Please tell me one way gay marriage harms you?

Causing harm to others would be the only legitimate argument, for imposing restrictions on an individual or group.
Ah yes, the "atrocities card". Please try to keep it real without going off the deep end.

Do you see a COMPELLING REASON that for the benefit of SOCIETY AS A WHOLE to start meddling with the definition of marriage?

Bear in mind, once the definition falls to some new different standard, others will knock, knock on the door say "what about our "alternative lifestyle". Why can me and my mom (sister, brother, father, dog, cat, great grandpa) marry each other"?. Once you open the door to one perversion of the definition, especially for no good reason whatsoever, you have no justifiable standing to say "No" to any other perversion.

I say NO, leave it as it is.

Recall that great guiding bit of wisdom,

It it isn't broken, don't fix it.

IMHO the DEFINTION of marriage is perfectly in order.

 
Old 01-27-2012, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,190 posts, read 6,831,675 times
Reputation: 2076
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
been covered, been said, point made over and over.
what's left?
anything original?
 
Old 01-27-2012, 01:54 PM
 
Location: Quimper Peninsula
1,981 posts, read 3,137,399 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame Angel View Post
Ah yes, the "atrocities card". Please try to keep it real without going off the deep end.

Do you see a COMPELLING REASON that for the benefit of SOCIETY AS A WHOLE to start meddling with the definition of marriage?

Bear in mind, once the definition falls to some new different standard, others will knock, knock on the door say "what about our "alternative lifestyle". Why can me and my mom (sister, brother, father, dog, cat, great grandpa) marry each other"?. Once you open the door to one perversion of the definition, especially for no good reason whatsoever, you have no justifiable standing to say "No" to any other perversion.

I say NO, leave it as it is.

Recall that great guiding bit of wisdom,

It it isn't broken, don't fix it.

IMHO the DEFINTION of marriage is perfectly in order.
You did not answer my question!!!!!!! Please tell me one way gay marriage harms YOU?

Are you saying it does not harm you but you just do not approve? That is a slippery slope of judgement is it not..

I will answer your question..
"Do you see a COMPELLING REASON that for the benefit of SOCIETY AS A WHOLE to start meddling with the definition of marriage?"

Yes I do. Allowing two humans that love each other the simple legal right to visit each other in the hospital after hours, to form a union to become "next of Kin" and all the stabilizing society building rewards and benefits that go along with that... It teaches our children to love all people not just the ones from the same clan, sect, race or religion... It teaches acceptance and tolerance of diversity.... Ultimately it is a step to world peace and stability.... As your mindset and those like you are often filled with fear and hate of anything different, which leads to tension and the wars of our history...
 
Old 01-27-2012, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,190 posts, read 6,831,675 times
Reputation: 2076
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueTimbers View Post
You did not answer my question!!!!!!! Please tell me one way gay marriage harms YOU?

Are you saying it does not harm you but you just do not approve? That is a slippery slope of judgement is it not..

I will answer your question..
"Do you see a COMPELLING REASON that for the benefit of SOCIETY AS A WHOLE to start meddling with the definition of marriage?"

Yes I do. Allowing two humans that love each other the simple legal right to visit each other in the hospital after hours, to form a union to become "next of Kin" and all the stabilizing society building rewards and benefits that go along with that... It teaches our children to love all people not just the ones from the same clan, sect, race or religion... It teaches acceptance and tolerance of diversity.... Ultimately it is a step to world peace and stability.... As your mindset and those like you are often filled with fear and hate of anything different, which leads to tension and the wars of our history...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 
Old 01-27-2012, 03:20 PM
 
281 posts, read 254,326 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueTimbers View Post
You did not answer my question!!!!!!! Please tell me one way gay marriage harms YOU?..
Your question is irrelevant because it is NOT about me or you or the same-sex couples. Not in the least.

It IS about what is BEST FOR SOCIETY as a whole.

If you have a relevant question, I'll be happy to answer it for you.
 
Old 01-27-2012, 03:25 PM
 
281 posts, read 254,326 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaijai View Post
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Those benefits are trivial compared to the risk to society damage to the institution poses. You have to look at all sides.

Society needs the institution, and it needs it for very good, reasons that have been acknowledged by wise and experienced elders over hundreds of generations. It is a proven reality.

Your reasons, in comparison, are trifling s.
 
Old 01-27-2012, 04:48 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,190 posts, read 6,831,675 times
Reputation: 2076
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame Angel View Post
Those benefits are trivial compared to the risk to society damage to the institution poses. You have to look at all sides.

Society needs the institution, and it needs it for very good, reasons that have been acknowledged by wise and experienced elders over hundreds of generations. It is a proven reality.

Your reasons, in comparison, are trifling s.
My reasons trifling? hardly.
My responses and a number of other insightful responses to you have been anything but "trifling".

You've already demonstrated in another post on another thread that you don't have a broad perspective and that your concern for out culture (not to mention the planet) is disingenuous.
Either that or you're totally lacking in awareness about how you and the selfish, self-centered, materialistic, greed driven attitude of you and your "ilk" are negatively impacting society and the world at large ... and the planet.
So arguing with you about how gay marriage has a negative effect on society is silly.
And the relevant question is yet to be addressed.
You can't or won't say how exactly gay marriage damages the "institution" and/or the culture and your expressions are repetitive and totally lacking in insight of any depth.
Which "wise and experienced elders over hundreds of generations" are you referring to and what do they have to say and how is it relevant to a time in history that is radically and rapidly changing and in most ways not for the better in large part because people are unable to let go of their attachment to outmoded and outdated social paradigms that cannot be sustained in any viable way for much longer?
And what "proven reality"?
What the h are you talking about?
If you want to engage in a conversation with intelligent and insightful people, then engage and express something of substance and intelligence instead of just repeating the same inane s over and over.

Look around ... the culture and planet are in dire straights and you and people with similar attitude(s) want to preserve the old order because y'all are totally lacking in creative, future forward thinking and are afraid of change. It's all fear based regardless of how it is justified / rationalized.

The shaman seers of the Fourth World generally agree that those who tenaciously cling to the past will fall into mass insanity. - John Hogue-


Change or die out. Cling to the past if you choose. The future is now and will continue to unfold with or without you and you can either get with it or petrify.


Marriage is fine but it's not sacred to most and (as has been stated a number of times on this thread) it's not respected, a relative few take the marriage vows seriously and there's a divorce rate in this country that exceeds 50% and gay marriage has absolutely nothing to do with it or the general degradation of the culture and the destruction of the planet.
 
Old 01-27-2012, 05:23 PM
 
281 posts, read 254,326 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaijai View Post
My reasons trifling? hardly.
My responses and a number of other insightful responses to you have been anything but "trifling".

You've already demonstrated in another post on another thread that you don't have a broad perspective and that your concern for out culture (not to mention the planet) is disingenuous.
Either that or you're totally lacking in awareness about how you and the selfish, self-centered, materialistic, greed driven attitude of you and your "ilk" are negatively impacting society and the world at large ... and the planet.
So arguing with you about how gay marriage has a negative effect on society is silly.
And the relevant question is yet to be addressed.
You can't or won't say how exactly gay marriage damages the "institution" and/or the culture and your expressions are repetitive and totally lacking in insight of any depth.
Which "wise and experienced elders over hundreds of generations" are you referring to and what do they have to say and how is it relevant to a time in history that is radically and rapidly changing and in most ways not for the better in large part because people are unable to let go of their attachment to outmoded and outdated social paradigms that cannot be sustained in any viable way for much longer?
And what "proven reality"?
What the h are you talking about?
If you want to engage in a conversation with intelligent and insightful people, then engage and express something of substance and intelligence instead of just repeating the same inane s over and over.

Look around ... the culture and planet are in dire straights and you and people with similar attitude(s) want to preserve the old order because y'all are totally lacking in creative, future forward thinking and are afraid of change. It's all fear based regardless of how it is justified / rationalized.

The shaman seers of the Fourth World generally agree that those who tenaciously cling to the past will fall into mass insanity. - John Hogue-


Change or die out. Cling to the past if you choose. The future is now and will continue to unfold with or without you and you can either get with it or petrify.


Marriage is fine but it's not sacred to most and (as has been stated a number of times on this thread) it's not respected, a relative few take the marriage vows seriously and there's a divorce rate in this country that exceeds 50% and gay marriage has absolutely nothing to do with it or the general degradation of the culture and the destruction of the planet.
So since the Institution has been weakened, you want to go ahead and put it out of its misery? That's what you call logic- that's what you call logical - that's what you call rational???

Your Answer, once again:
It dilutes it, it trivializes it.

Re: same-sex marriage (which is not legal for either hetero- or Homosexuals):

If I thought it was in the best interest of America, I would support it

If YOU thought it was damaging to society, would you OPPOSE it?

Your assertion about the legitimacy of my concern for society is as vapid and vacuous as your posts are.

I saw in a previous posts you made that YOU are disingenuous, duplicitous and mealy mouthed, so really, what is the point in discussing this further with you.

Boy, that is easy - no wonder you used it.
 
Old 01-27-2012, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,190 posts, read 6,831,675 times
Reputation: 2076
Huh?
Mealy mouthed? moi? oy! > mealymouthed: hesitant to state facts or opinions simply and directly.
Your insight and comprehension skills are minimal at best.
And me? vapid and vacuous? oy again.
But i will agree with just one point ... there is no point in continuing a discussion with you.
peaceout
 
Old 01-27-2012, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Quimper Peninsula
1,981 posts, read 3,137,399 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame Angel View Post
Your question is irrelevant because it is NOT about me or you or the same-sex couples. Not in the least.

It IS about what is BEST FOR SOCIETY as a whole.

If you have a relevant question, I'll be happy to answer it for you.

Wow you are a piece of work, the poorest example of your viewpoint to date on this thread.... Yes, I respect the view points made by many posters against gay marriage.... They opened up and were HONEST about their feelings... YOU on the other hand...


SO please tell me what is society??? If it is irrelevant to me and you...
LOL...... Who are they? Who is society? Last I checked you and I are representatives of society... SO why not tell me how gay marriage is not good for YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How does it hurt you

Just open up would ya...Who cares it is a forum, be honest tell us what the problem is.. I will respect your opinion then and only then...

"society" geeez....
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