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Old 02-02-2012, 06:32 PM
 
Location: Glendale, CA
1,299 posts, read 2,531,044 times
Reputation: 1395

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How can there be any "facts" about the longevity of "gay marriages", when gay marriages have only been legal (and only in a couple of states) for a very short time?

 
Old 02-02-2012, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,190 posts, read 6,836,438 times
Reputation: 2076
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame Angel View Post
I understand your sentiments, but I will say here, what i tell a guy at work who talks abut a new age, a new way.

There isn't really anything new, it is just new to YOU.

Society has been around a long time, and these sorts of issues are not new. Homosexuality is not new. Neither Acceptance nor Rejection of it at whatever level are NOT new.

Society, based on the collected wisdom of thousands of years has concluded that one man and one woman is best. That is their "been there, don't that" answer. Neither you or I or any poster or group of poster here has but a tiny percentage of that collected wisdom.

Accordingly, in the absence of strong and convincing evidence of the most robust kind, I would say, with all sincerely, and concern for all parties, same-sex, opposite-sex, singles, etc., don't fix what isn't broken, and again, in my analysis, the definition of marriage is not broken.

Fads, lifestyles etc., wax and wane, come and go, but our institutions must endure intact these "tidal ebbs and flows".

I have an open mind. I have changed my mind on abortion (from pro-choice to pro-life, however), so it is possible my opinion, if faced with such evidence as I describe above, will change,

Regards,
I don't think that you do understand what i'm saying.
That's o.k..
I appreciate that you're at least being somewhat civil in your responses and have let down your guard a bit and retracted your talons.

Which "collective wisdom" are you referring to?
The collective wisdom that has brought us to where we are now?
You must speak for yourself regarding wisdom and not assume or presume about my degree of wisdom and awareness.
If you don't agree and/or resonate with my perceptions that's fine.

You say, "don't fix what isn't broken" but so many of the conventional institutions and approaches that you cherish are not only broken but they have brought us to a critical point in human history and, imo, we must change antiquated paradigms.
Institutions that are no longer viable must not endure.
Despite what you think, the back bone of society is not its institutions!
That's where you're kind of stuck.
And i'm not speaking about marriage. I love horses so i disdain the expression but at this point, the discussion regarding it is like flogging a dead horse.
Marriage will endure. Fear not.
And homosexuality is not a "fad" or a "lifestyle".
If you can't open and change your mind and grok that, there's no point in anyone discussing any homosexual issues with you.
 
Old 02-03-2012, 12:07 AM
 
Location: The Other California
4,254 posts, read 5,589,725 times
Reputation: 1552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercule Poirot View Post
Please let us know how far down the sliding slope do you go before you feel you should stop.
Good luck with that, HP!
 
Old 02-03-2012, 05:05 AM
 
Location: Quimper Peninsula
1,981 posts, read 3,140,598 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercule Poirot View Post
Pardon my intrusion, but a question if you please.


Where do you draw the line (please mark yes or no indicating if you do or do not support this change to marriage's definition)

1 man & 1 woman

2 men

2 women
--------------------------------
3 men

3 women

2 women and 1 man

2 men and 1 woman
-----------------------------------------------------
mother/father and daughter/son

brother and brother

sister and sister

brother and sister


Please let us know how far down the sliding slope do you go before you feel you should stop.
Again what is the point? This is about homosexual marriage... The rights of a long term couple.... I do not think their are many gay polygamist in the world, since polygamy is generally about procreating at a more rapid rate.. You only need one bull or one rooster to breed a large number of hen or cow..

How many times do we need to repeat this is not about incest either....

I drew my own personal lines of "comfort" but the POINT is this is not about MY or YOUR personal feelings... Imposing your personal dreams or fears on others is a selfish act..
 
Old 02-03-2012, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Quimper Peninsula
1,981 posts, read 3,140,598 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame Angel View Post
So, reading between the lines, if it wasn't for the tax, etc., bennies of marriage, you couldn't care less!!!

Do you have any info on the longevity of same-sex marriages. I means facts, not spin!!!
Hey flame..!! I have a smile on my face and warmth in my heart... Reading your posts since I last posted... Thanks for the effort... Your tone is open...It is deeply appreciated.. I will try hard too..

I suppose for me yes, I could care less about moral, tradition or religious aspects.. What the issue is for me is civil rights and the next of kin rights and legal recognition civil union or marriage offers. I get uptight when I see others/society imposing morals on others.... IMO this country went to heck in a hand basket, when politicians started campaigning on "family values"... It crossed a line between church and state IMO...

No no hard numbers, as others stated kinda hard to have the data, just anecdotal from life experience knowing gay couples and what I have read by gay couples on this thread or other places.... If anything I suspect they may have better longevity.... Because their is less of a dating pool, more holding the relationship together because they are "different".

Other points: * Of course I pass judgement on others who hurt others... big time... I am not "gutless" in that sense.. I consider my self a life long supporter of the underdog or oppressed.

* I am OK with my civics... Just trying to simplify points..

Anyways... Peace be with you... Flame..
 
Old 02-03-2012, 09:47 AM
 
281 posts, read 254,875 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercule Poirot View Post
We shall see.
Let's hop we never have to.
 
Old 02-03-2012, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Quimper Peninsula
1,981 posts, read 3,140,598 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercule Poirot View Post
Oh no sir, it is most assuredly not about homosexual marriage. They have complete rights as, I think, we all know.

More to the point, it is about altering marriage to encompass two members of the same sex - a difference most significant.

My point, kind sir, is once you say Yes to the sex of those whose union is being legally and formally recognized and commissioned by the state, on what foot do you stand on to dare say "No" to those who want to alter the other side of the equation, more specifically, the numbers of people involved. And again, my friend, how can you deny others historically prevented from marrying due to familial relationship.

True, it is not about incest, it is bigger than that, and bigger than your issue, of same sex. Yes, bigger.

It is about the legal-recognition and endorsement of a unions of peoples under the legal structure called "marriage".

It is most-tempting to demonstrate "tolerance" by saying yes to same-sex marriages, but I fear and suspect calamity. We shall see.
You are correct.. It is bigger... I think even bigger yet than the definition of marriage...... Much bigger.. a Marco mindset if you will..

I personally believe the world would be a wonderful place without that word fear..

I personally have a strong disdain for that word/emotion, and attempt to live my life without fear..

Be well.. Peace and love..
 
Old 02-03-2012, 12:25 PM
 
2,093 posts, read 4,680,779 times
Reputation: 1121
I don't know about gay marriage, but I'm all for civil unions where gay/lesbian couples can have equal rights as married couples.

Proposition 8 was overturned and rightly so. Civil rights cannot have its fate tied to bigotry and ignorance, no matter if they stem from the minority or the majority.
 
Old 02-03-2012, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Glendale, CA
1,299 posts, read 2,531,044 times
Reputation: 1395
Yeah we need more posters who equate gay marriage to getting married to a warehouse.
 
Old 02-03-2012, 02:06 PM
 
281 posts, read 254,875 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by DynamoLA View Post
Yeah we need more posters who equate gay marriage to getting married to a warehouse.
It seems to me that there is no more rational debate to be had on this thread.
BTW, did you know (well obviously of this you are ignorant) that homosexuals can marry under exactly the same set of circumstances that hetero's can?

I, as a hetero, am also prohibited from marrying another man, so there is NOT discrimination whatsoever.

Spittle Lickers use "gay-marriage" as a sanitized euphemism for same-sex marriage.

Anyway, gotto go 'cause you folks, with a few exceptions, are insane.
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