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Unread 05-10-2012, 10:11 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
1,467 posts, read 1,435,399 times
Reputation: 1486
I agree that the legacy of Spanish colonialism and the Catholic Church in Coastal California is pretty shameful, but that was then, this is now. Vandalism of any property is despicable.

 
Unread 05-10-2012, 10:48 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
1,294 posts, read 657,064 times
Reputation: 1055
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffredo View Post
I agree that the legacy of Spanish colonialism and the Catholic Church in Coastal California is pretty shameful, but that was then, this is now. Vandalism of any property is despicable.
I will agree with that 100%
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 11:03 AM
 
1,374 posts, read 1,758,792 times
Reputation: 1163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
I don't think multiculturalism has a thing to do with it. I think it's simply symptomatic of the increasing lack of civility, respect and consideration infecting society as a whole in some places.
Isn't that the true. I am not sure why civility went out the door. Perhaps, it is lack of consequences. Back in the day, disrespect was met with pushback. Good manners got praises. Now, breathing gets you a little trophy.
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:02 PM
 
2,228 posts, read 1,748,420 times
Reputation: 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
I think it's simply symptomatic of the increasing lack of civility, respect and consideration infecting society as a whole in some places.
What do you believe causes those symptoms?
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:07 PM
 
2,228 posts, read 1,748,420 times
Reputation: 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffredo View Post
I agree that the legacy of Spanish colonialism and the Catholic Church in Coastal California is pretty shameful, but that was then, this is now. Vandalism of any property is despicable.
I do not understand how dissuading people from tearing out the hearts of captives and sacrificing them to the sun is shameful.
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:09 PM
 
2,228 posts, read 1,748,420 times
Reputation: 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Trails View Post
I am not sure why civility went out the door. P
It went out the door because the inhabitants of this country, with some exceptions, no longer feel a kinship with others around them. This country is a patchwork quilt of peoples -- an empire -- rather than a nation.
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:16 PM
 
7,155 posts, read 3,674,416 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Trails View Post
... I am not sure why civility went out the door ...
Are you sure humans used to be more civil? I disagree. History is as ugly as can be with regard to human affairs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Visit a Library View Post
It went out the door because the inhabitants of this country, with some exceptions, no longer feel a kinship with others around them. This country is a patchwork quilt of peoples -- an empire -- rather than a nation.
Here, if you want to know ... But I doubt you really do:
Dunbar's number - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:35 PM
 
40 posts, read 32,464 times
Reputation: 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Visit a Library View Post
I do not understand how dissuading people from tearing out the hearts of captives and sacrificing them to the sun is shameful.
What? No California natives were said to practice human sacrifice, as reported by those who ran the missions. You might be thinking of Aztecs in what is now Mexico.

In this country a few decades ago, black churches were burned and bombed, sometimes with people inside. So I would say that makes this look insignificant... although I'm not condoning graffiti or vandalism.
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:39 PM
 
Location: San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara Counties
6,390 posts, read 2,809,774 times
Reputation: 2622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Visit a Library View Post
I do not understand how dissuading people from tearing out the hearts of captives and sacrificing them to the sun is shameful.
This is interesting, a common but false idea that the Euros were less murderous than the Aztecs (you do know human sacrifice did not occur with frequency among the California indians, right?).

Give this book a read 1491

The author compared the human sacrifice per thousand population in Mexico with the Capital punishment rate per thousand in England.

Turns out that the Crown, killed a larger number of subjects per capita than the priests of Mexico killed. Death penalty for stealing a slice of bread, for instance.

Priests killed for the glory of their gods. The Crown killed for the glory of the Crown.


Since England was much more liberal and kind than France, which was much more liberal and kind than Spain, one can project that the slaughter of Spanish subjects by the King of Spain, was far far greater than the slaughter of war captives by the Aztec priests.

Now, read the book, I just summarized for you.

Now, toss in the death rate of Californian indians after the arrival of the padres, nearly 90%, and you can see that the effect of the Euros in the new world was far more murderous than the effect of the Aztec priests.

Them facts, they be sumpin eh?
 
Unread 05-10-2012, 08:09 PM
 
Location: GLAMA
16,591 posts, read 17,366,131 times
Reputation: 15918
Some destructive vandalism occurs at a church, and suddenly we've lost the veneer of civility? I agree, everything was better back in the good old days... the Holy Inquisition, Malleus Maleficarum, the Crusades, the oppression of science and knowledge.

Ooops, did I just mention of bunch of Church crimes? I don't know how that happened.
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