Does southern Cali feel American? (Los Angeles, San Diego: neighborhood, living, shop)

[user_id]

Originally Posted by workaholics

With California's diversity, I think it's important that all races and ethnicities know a common language, English. I guess that's my main question.

Why exactly is this important? There are numerous countries that have more than one spoken language.

Regardless, even with a large Hispanic population Spanish has not even come close to rooting itself as a second language in Southern California. All the popular TV shows, music, movies, etc are in English. The schools are in English...and so on.

[workaholics]

So, it seems like most immigrants in socal speak English, as is true with immigrants throughout American history.

Yet California is just a few miles from the Mexican border. Does proximity to Mexico lessen the need for Mexican immigrants to learn English?

[Fontucky]

Originally Posted by workaholics

Yet California is just a few miles from the Mexican border.

No, it butts rhat up agin it.

[bouncethelight]

workaholics, why not just come out here and see for yourself? We don't bite!

[user_id]

Originally Posted by workaholics

So, it seems like most immigrants in socal speak English, as is true with immigrants throughout American history.

But immigrants in the past didn't all speak English, before modern media it was easier for ethnic communities to insulate themselves from the mainstream culture.

Originally Posted by workaholics

Does proximity to Mexico lessen the need for Mexican immigrants to learn English?

No, why would it? Hispanics tend to matriculate into mainstream culture faster than other groups, despite being more numerous, because their culture is rather similar to American culture to began with...

But there is no homogeneous "American culture" to began with, the dominate immigrant groups in California have changed the mainstream culture in California. Just as the Italians, Irish, etc changed mainstream culture in NY many years ago. The most obvious sign of this is with food, where things like burritos, tacos, etc are standard meals regardless of race. I'm not Hispanic, yet the most common family meals in my household were enchiladas, tacos, taco salad, etc.

[Juelle]

Originally Posted by workaholics

I've been thinking about this for a while. With such a large concentration of Hispanics so close to Mexico, does SoCal feel like America- at least the way you see it portrayed in the media?
Do most Hispanic people speak Spanish? And how important is it to be bilingual down there nowadays?

I guess what I'm really wondering is that- are the immigrants assimilating as they typically have, or have they reached enough of a critical mass to retain their home culturewithout feeling the need to assimilate?

Let's put it this way, I went on one of those cheap cruises to Ensenada, and when we left the ship I swear I was still in Los Angeles... there was no difference, I was very disappointed. I'm like... I spent all this money to crawl across the water to go to Downtown Los Angeles. LOL In fact, the shopping was the same stuff you get downtown in the fashion district or on any freeway off-ramp.

As for assimilating, no there is no assimilation and because of it, immigrants basically treat you as if you do not exist and as if you are the foreigner. They totally do not acknowledge you unless they are selling something. Sometimes I wonder if this is not the reason why so many people who lived in Los Angeles Proper have left in search of sense of community.

I lived in Central California and the Bay Area, and the majority of my closet friends are Latin and we were all one big happy family, but of course they have more of an American culture. So to answer your question, yes... assimilation is much more prevalent once you head north over the Grapevine... in South of the Grapevine, no the majority are not assimilating... they don't have to anymore. Just about every public and government establishment has materials and signs written in Spanish.

I'll never forget going into the DMV and not one form or the test was in English. Lady told me they order more Spanish forms, so I sarcastically said, Well... I guess I'm just going to have to take my test in Spanish and for every answer I get wrong, I want credit for it because you discriminated against English speaking customers by not providing forms in English. It worked too! LOL

[Fontucky]

Originally Posted by Juelle

Let's put it this way, I went on one of those cheap cruises to Ensenada, and when we left the ship I swear I was still in Los Angeles... there was no difference, I was very disappointed. I'm like... I spent all this money to crawl across the water to go to Downtown Los Angeles. LOL In fact, the shopping was the same stuff you get downtown in the fashion district or on any freeway off-ramp.

Keywords highlighted. You need to get farther away from the border than Ensenada, which is basically Tijuana Sur.

[uptown_urbanist]

have never lived in San Diego or closer to the border, but while living in LA I thought it was the epitome of modern America. Southern California isn't just Hispanic -- you'll find lots of immigrants from all over the world. I had never met an Armenian before moving to LA, for example. The San Gabriel Valley is very heavily Chinese. Parts of Orange County have lots of Vietnamese residents. The list goes on. And, of course, you also have the people who were born and raised in this country. It's a very diverse blend of lots of immigrants from everywhere as well as people who have potentially had their ancestors in this country for generations. I think that blend of people, and the feeling that the region is really an active gateway into the American dream, is extremely "American." Not that areas where there are few immigrants is NOT American (there is no one single United States!), but in many ways I think it's exactly that influx of newer immigrants that, to me, gives southern CA it's "American" flavor, as it reflects the continuation of this country's long tradition of being an international melting pot. (when we lived in Hollywood I loved it that there was a nearby Thai restaurant with a huge hot dog sculpture on the top -- a remnant of some former business, I assume -- and signs in Thai, Spanish, and English, for example, or that "Thai tacos" were readily available.)

All that said, there were plenty of times when I was somewhere where everyone around me was speaking another language, where most of the signs were in other languages (although usually also with some English) and where I, as a native-born, native English speaker, was in the definite minority, so if that's your measuring stick of whether or not something feels "American," then yes, there are lots of places in southern California that won't feel very American to you.

Also FWIW, at one local meeting I attended parents were discussing the languages they felt it important that their children learn. Most of these parents were Chinese in background, although not necessarily first, or even second, generation. In any case, the general consensus seemed to be that, after English (obviously), the kids should know at least conversational Spanish, Chinese (Mandarin), and if time, then Korean. I do think that basic Spanish would be extremely useful in many parts of southern California.

[Juelle]

Originally Posted by Fontucky

Keywords highlighted. You need to get farther away from the border than Ensenada, which is basically Tijuana Sur.

Well, I know that now! LOL

[Trimac20]

Originally Posted by aajn1983

um, what other states have you visited?

ca, nv, az, nm, tx, la, ms, tn, va, dc, md, de, nj, pa, ny, ct, ma