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Old 09-25-2012, 09:19 AM
 
11,715 posts, read 40,385,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Funny, I know quite a few successful people who have left.
Yeah the people I know who've left were actually doing quite well for themselves and left for quality of life issues.
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Old 09-25-2012, 09:47 AM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,324,110 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
See what happens when you think for yourself. You post nonsense! Better to let the gubmint do your thinking for you and just sit back and enjoy the kool-aid.

We moved out of state a year after we both retired on an income quite a bit higher than the median in CA. We could easily have stayed but elected not to. There was somewhere else we wished to live and had discussed for years. Now we're there, enjoying the lifestyle and coincidentally, the tax structure, home costs and overall COL also helps us maximize our retirement dollars. But it's the lifestyle that counts most.

I doubt that we're alone in this.
I think that this is part of the issue.

When we were young CA was all we knew and we enjoyed every bit of it, as well as our youth.

As we aged and took on responsibility and saw the State change, we changed. Other things than just playing and having a good time took precedence. We saw and lived the "Glory days" of CA. Now we see the problems that we either did not pay attention to, or did not exist, then.

Newer residents or those still chasing the CA dream of constant Sun and Surf and partying, don't care. Young families are interested in the children and do not have time or resources to explore outside CA. Those who fled blighted areas of the US do not see the difference that time has brought. With age and financial ability we can see the problems and have the resources to change where we live for a better place for "us". Some may wish to stay and others wish to go. generally from my experience it is the older and more financially stable who leave. They can FIND better places for their desires and life style, where others can't until they reach that age. I would never leave CA if it was the same as in my youth, but it isn't and I am not.

Those who chose to stay had better be active in changing the stupidity of the elected officials or it will go down hill even faster. Wealth does not mean any real value to life as we see with sooo many young (and even old) wealthy people, who just live a life of plain stupidity. Big companies with high paying jobs are not a genuine measure of State's real value. The COL and pressures related to living in a State do mean a great deal however. My brother left CA for the South and while the amenities are fewer, the COL, pace and quality of life are far beyond what he saw in OC as an adult, where we grew up.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:06 AM
 
11,715 posts, read 40,385,082 times
Reputation: 7585
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
generally from my experience it is the older and more financially stable who leave. They can FIND better places for their desires and life style, where others can't until they reach that age.
This is an important point. Look at what it takes to make a successful out of state. You'll either need a lot of money in the bank, an income that doesn't depend on location, a good job waiting for you, or enough equity in your current home to buy a home in your new state. How many 30 something's with a couple of kids have those things?

At the other end of the spectrum are the poor and the very young, who will either be taken care of by the government or don't mind sleeping on strangers' couches until they can find a job. Its the people in the middle of the spectrum that have the hardest time picking up and leaving.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:17 AM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,866,083 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
...Those who chose to stay had better be active in changing the stupidity of the elected officials or it will go down hill even faster. Wealth does not mean any real value to life as we see with sooo many young (and even old) wealthy people, who just live a life of plain stupidity. ...
You and so many others on this board continue your mantra of "fight the evil empire of the elected officials and stop the downhill slide of California ... return the state to its glory days ... restore its business friendliness ... make it the leader again ... rant rant rant" ...

Speaking of "living a life of stupidity". You can't see that the open, business-friendly, development-easy, opportunity for all, environment of the past -- is precisely what created the California of today that you condemn? The more you solve the "problems" the less you can ever have any semblance of the great old days ...

People leaving? Jiminy Cricket, folks, they came in "droves" and "droves" for decades and decades -- more than doubling the population in less than 50 years -- and created a sh8tpot of disgusting, intrusive, overwhelming, choking development, infrastructure, and economic woes ... but y'all want to remove those pesky barriers to more of the same.

Damn right "they" should leave in "droves". Can't happen fast enough.
What's that great quote about learning the lessons of history?
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Where they serve real ale.
7,242 posts, read 7,892,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
For some it is easier to denigrate those who leave than actually deal with the problems.
The "problem" is very simple. Far more people want to live here then there is space for them so prices get bid up. The people who can't afford the good life end up moving some where less desirable where they actually can afford to own a home. Yes, they're the economic losers who got out competed for space by more successful people. It's capitalism in action.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:26 AM
 
2,370 posts, read 2,735,075 times
Reputation: 505
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw335xi View Post
Californians flee for better-run states, study finds | Fox News

"Californians are fleeing in droves to live in better-managed states"

... I guess that explains why home prices in California are the cheapest in the country sigh

*** In all seriousness, I find it funny that Fox News would actually post this kind of article with a full color picture on their front page... I think they are getting desperate now.

HAHAHAHA... I wondered what the rationalizations would be, given the discussions we had on this forum a couple of months back. Reality bites, doesn't it? I guess some of you still think denial is that river in
Eqypt. Maybe Moonbeam, Kammala or Pretty Boy Newsome have the solutions ROFL . The former Great State of California, a mere pittance of its former self. That truly is a shame.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:47 AM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,866,083 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by MRG Dallas View Post
HAHAHAHA... I wondered what the rationalizations would be, given the discussions we had on this forum a couple of months back. Reality bites, doesn't it? I guess some of you still think denial is that river in
Eqypt. Maybe Moonbeam, Kammala or Pretty Boy Newsome have the solutions ROFL . The former Great State of California, a mere pittance of its former self. That truly is a shame.
People leaving "bites"?

Uh, no, it doesn't.

By the way, "The former Great State of California" is, rather unfortunately, still outperforming every other state in the union -- as well as all but seven other countries in the entire world -- sad to say. Its success and desirability is its own worst enemy.

Then again, many other places have loads of folks too ignorant to have any grasp of reality, and who thus can't recognize that ridiculing leadership and desirability only serves to demonstrate their own lack of intellect. I have observed many such people writing from many places -- such as Texas, for one example.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:57 AM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,324,110 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
You and so many others on this board continue your mantra of "fight the evil empire of the elected officials and stop the downhill slide of California ... return the state to its glory days ... restore its business friendliness ... make it the leader again ... rant rant rant" ...

Speaking of "living a life of stupidity". You can't see that the open, business-friendly, development-easy, opportunity for all, environment of the past -- is precisely what created the California of today that you condemn? The more you solve the "problems" the less you can ever have any semblance of the great old days ...

People leaving? Jiminy Cricket, folks, they came in "droves" and "droves" for decades and decades -- more than doubling the population in less than 50 years -- and created a sh8tpot of disgusting, intrusive, overwhelming, choking development, infrastructure, and economic woes ... but y'all want to remove those pesky barriers to more of the same.

Damn right "they" should leave in "droves". Can't happen fast enough.
What's that great quote about learning the lessons of history?
In general you are right about what has happened. The problem is the State will NOT cut back on excessive or untimely spending, so fewer people mean higher taxes or less service and a constantly degrading standard of living.

The proverbial Catch 22.

So it stays the course and more people come in or more people leave. Either way there will continue to be problems until a Gov't that actually wants to balance things out for everyone is elected. That ain't gonna happen.

The Poor will need welfare
The unions will get what they want
The business will do what they can with ever increasing regulations and taxes by raising prices.
The Rich will change their State of residence to avoid taxes and
The struggling middle class will pay and pay and pay and pay and ...

And the State will spend more and more and more and ....

How would you fix it?
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:05 AM
 
2,370 posts, read 2,735,075 times
Reputation: 505
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
People leaving "bites"?

Uh, no, it doesn't.

By the way, "The former Great State of California" is, rather unfortunately, still outperforming every other state in the union -- as well as all but seven other countries in the entire world -- sad to say. Its success and desirability is its own worst enemy.

Then again, many other places have loads of folks too ignorant to have any grasp of reality, and who thus can't recognize that ridiculing leadership and desirability only serves to demonstrate their own lack of intellect. I have observed many such people writing from many places -- such as Texas, for one example.
LOl, you're killing me. Productive people leaving certainly "bites" at least in the real world. Ever heard of incentives? That's to get those type of people to your place. But you're obviously living in a huge world of denial and disillusion. So let's blame it on Fox News, yeah right!

Still outperforming every other state? In what, exodus of the professional class/business? Welfare ATM card manufacturing? Bullet train construction? Oh and your "ridiculing 'leadership'" "Leadership"? Laughable. With "leadership" like that, who needs the wrecking ball. Just keep on drinking that Kool-Aid.

Trends matter, too, or didn't you know that either. This has been happening for some time. Talk to any HR professional and they'll laugh and shake their heads at compliance in California. And that's just one example. I haven't even mentioned your tax and fees structure yet.

But go ahead, make it personal, that's all you've got left. The truth hurts and that's the only reaction I would expect out of you.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:07 AM
 
Location: SW MO
23,593 posts, read 37,394,969 times
Reputation: 29336
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
In general you are right about what has happened. The problem is the State will NOT cut back on excessive or untimely spending, so fewer people mean higher taxes or less service and a constantly degrading standard of living.

The proverbial Catch 22.

So it stays the course and more people come in or more people leave. Either way there will continue to be problems until a Gov't that actually wants to balance things out for everyone is elected. That ain't gonna happen.

The Poor will need welfare
The unions will get what they want
The business will do what they can with ever increasing regulations and taxes by raising prices.
The Rich will change their State of residence to avoid taxes and
The struggling middle class will pay and pay and pay and pay and ...

And the State will spend more and more and more and ....

How would you fix it?
Now come on, expatCA. You know you can't use logic with an idealogue. There are those here who are so blinded by the luster of what once was and their belief that they're right and anyone who disagrees is wrong that they refuse to see what has happened and is now or entertain any other point of view. Most unfortunately that describes the state's politicians as well. The bright, shining "Golden" State has been badly served, badly used and dulled.
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