Yes on 32... It is pay back time! (apartment, to buy)

[EscapeCalifornia]

Originally Posted by EdJS

I'm not a teacher but this post explains exactly why teachers need a union. So many people have no idea what they do. "Last I heard school starts late in the morning and finishes long before my day ever ends." That's school. Teachers start work before school and finish work many hours after school. I mean, they have to grade those tests and papers sometime, you know?

Boo hoo. They have to grade tests and read papers. Maybe they could do some of that work between 3 and 5pm when everyone else is still at work. I'm sure lots of people would enjoy the option of getting off at 3, then doing a couple hours of work after dinner in front of the TV.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by TVC15

Unions suck for sure!

Certainly one of the biggest problems of this state.

Actually, I don't think unions are a problem. I think public sector unions are a problem.

Unlike the private sector, in the public sector union leadership has unique power - unions literally elect the people who will be on the other side of the bargaining table. Unlike the private sector, in the public sector union leadership says in effect "give us what we want or we will pull our support for you and then support your opponent in the next election. Give us what we want or we will marshal our considerable resources to donate to your opponent. Give us what we want or we will back your opponent & engage in a massive get-out-the-vote effort in support of defeating you."
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
The elected officials come to office wanting to do a good job, yet they quickly become corrupted by this interchange. They can stand their ground & face a huge uphill battle, or they can give in to the public sector union and live to fight another day.

Moreover, for the past 3 decades, public sector unions have successfully made the argument as follows: "Support us by giving us increases in pensions. After all, the bill won't come due for decades, and by then you will either be retired yourself or you will have moved on to bigger & better elected positions. Either way, you, too, will benefit from increases in pensions. Someone else will have to pay."

[TVC15]

How California Unions Hijacked the Golden State

[Everest209]

Originally Posted by kgbnsf

Unions exist because the majority of the workers want their support and protection. They offer a counter to businesses that only have their interests in mind. Don't negate the benefits of unions and government regulations. The business climate would be much more self served without them. If they could get away with a smaller payroll and more productivity for less it would happen in a minute. That's evident every day even now.

Who do you think is supporting this proposition? Who do you really think is going to benefit from this? Honestly.

Do unions need to be kept in check, of course. But,it would be a disservice to eliminate them.

No on 32. It's a ploy by business to further their pockets.

Exactly. Employees without protection are at the mercy of the whims of the company. Everyone talks about how great businesses are, and they are, if kept honest. A lot of them will put one over on you if given the opportunity. Unions have got out of hand, but they are necessary.

[Everest209]

Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer

Isn't it odd how most in the private sector don't need this crutch? How do we all survive? I really think that the reputation of Teachers would vastly improve without the unions.

How do we all survive? Yea, because things are going so well on the job front. A lot of us aren't surviving, that's the problem.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Everest209

Exactly. Employees without protection are at the mercy of the whims of the company. Everyone talks about how great businesses are, and they are, if kept honest. A lot of them will put one over on you if given the opportunity. Unions have got out of hand, but they are necessary.

I hate to be the one to tell you this but in the old days before the public employee unions were allowed by Jerry Brown to take over the state, workers received more consistent and better raises and benefits then they have since the union's began to pick the workers' pockets for ever-increasing dues.

[ZhugeLiang]

Definite "yes" vote from me. Could you imagine a private corporation doing what unions are allowed to get away with? There would be screams of protest. No employer should have the right to take a cut of a worker's wages and use them to support political causes that work against their interests.

[TVC15]

Originally Posted by ZhugeLiang

Definite "yes" vote from me. Could you imagine a private corporation doing what unions are allowed to get away with? There would be screams of protest. No employer should have the right to take a cut of a worker's wages and use them to support political causes that work against their interests.

Forced Unionism State...what a concept

[SOON2BNSURPRISE]

Originally Posted by EdJS

I'm not a teacher but this post explains exactly why teachers need a union. So many people have no idea what they do. "Last I heard school starts late in the morning and finishes long before my day ever ends." That's school. Teachers start work before school and finish work many hours after school. I mean, they have to grade those tests and papers sometime, you know?

That is funny. I have not seen any cars at my kids school after 5pm. I have not seen any teachers at work before 8am. (Our kids start at 8:30) Just wondering where these teachers are doing all this extra work. I doubt that you would find a teacher at school after 4 in my area. The last I heard people in that profession understood that they would have to grade papers, even if they are taking them home with them. Maybe that is what is happening, they take the papers and work all night grading them. But wait, I guess the dozen or so teachers that hang out in our group of friends is slacking off as they have plenty of time for other activities during the day, after school.

[Think4Yourself]

I'm still completely amazed how totally clueless the OP is. Property tax rates and values are both capped and set in stone plus are among the lowest in the country (in terms of rates) so how exactly does he think property tax payers are getting screwed? Next he claims we're spending to much on education when California's education spending per pupil is 49th out of 50 states. The guy seems completely delusional to me but then again most right wingers do.