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Old 07-22-2013, 03:43 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
841 posts, read 1,703,433 times
Reputation: 1123

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
They can do what private sector employees have had to do - find another job. Or move. Or do one of a number of things that unemployed people do. I'm not sure why public sector jobs should be immune from the realities of NO MORE MONEY.
Got it. So when 3% of working aged Californians who were previously gainfully employed are suddenly unemployed because, as you put it, there is no more money to pay them, you want for that additional 3% to have to try to find a job that doesn't exist because, as you put it, there is no more money to pay them (which I can only assume means that since the tax dollars are no longer there, there's no refund or lack of paying said taxes, which means the money is no longer in California) so those jobs will not be replaced in California, meaning that because you are spiteful and would rather cross your arms while making a pouty face, instead of SOLVING a problem of massive unemployment and homelessness, you'd rather be a direct cause of it because, in your words, those jobs SHOULD (my favorite word) not be immune.

Because, who cares about living in a first world country when we can have unregulated, unabated free market capitalism uber alles, right? The important thing here is the theory behind society, not the actual practice.

Look, I know it just feels so good to tell everyone else how they should be productive and magically find jobs or they can go to hell, but eventually you'll get tired of being kidnapped by the poor for ransom, or walking over homeless families on every corner begging you for change, or being held up in your driveway by someone who didn't used to be a drug addict but is now because let's face it, it's all they have left to get through the day ever since Prince Ringwise took away all the jobs in the name of Employment Theory. And when that happens, you'll wish like hell you had spent just a little more time thinking out your policies and opinions and realizing that people DON'T do what they're supposed to and almost no one will do what you think they SHOULD. So, either pull your head out of the sanctimonious sand and be a part of the solution or find another scapegoat to blame your own dislike for California on.


Thinking is hard.
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:46 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
841 posts, read 1,703,433 times
Reputation: 1123
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
Out of the jobs on that HUGE list, I'm pretty sure very few of them are "vital". Easily 1/3 to 1/2 could be cut, with little or no impact on the public.
Please provide a list of the agencies you would cut, the number of jobs lost, the economic impact of those jobs now and after your cuts, and proof that these agencies would have little to no impact on the economy.

Or were you just using histrionics and hyperbole?
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Old 07-22-2013, 06:53 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,605 posts, read 31,383,208 times
Reputation: 29064
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
Out of the jobs on that HUGE list, I'm pretty sure very few of them are "vital". Easily 1/3 to 1/2 could be cut, with little or no impact on the public.
You missed the point of my post but there's probably no point in trying to explain it to you.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Boulder Creek, CA
9,197 posts, read 13,972,255 times
Reputation: 6327
Quote:
Originally Posted by zdg View Post
Please provide a list of the agencies you would cut, the number of jobs lost, the economic impact of those jobs now and after your cuts, and proof that these agencies would have little to no impact on the economy.

Or were you just using histrionics and hyperbole?
Again, we're heading into the No Government At All zone with this stuff. And again, for the guvm'nt = evil people, there is always Somalia.

Turn off the AM radio and Faux News, people. It's not trying to educate you, it's pointing and laughing at you while taking your money.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:28 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,605 posts, read 31,383,208 times
Reputation: 29064
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdumbgod View Post
Again, we're heading into the No Government At All zone with this stuff. And again, for the guvm'nt = evil people, there is always Somalia.

Turn off the AM radio and Faux News, people. It's not trying to educate you, it's pointing and laughing at you while taking your money.
What's really dumb are groundless assumptions.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:41 PM
 
17,445 posts, read 10,514,899 times
Reputation: 8334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
What's really dumb are groundless assumptions.
For some it is all they have.

PBS of course is completely free of any bias, especially when listened to in CA.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:49 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
841 posts, read 1,703,433 times
Reputation: 1123
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
PBS of course is completely free of any bias, especially when listened to in CA.
Are you suggesting PBS is the liberal equivalent of Fox News?
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:50 PM
 
17,445 posts, read 10,514,899 times
Reputation: 8334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
A 25% "economy of scale" against the national average is unbelievably huge, user ... and you know it ... but how could we continue the entertainment without you being obtuse, eh?

Regardless, what it shows at the very least is that California is not out of line -- which is the implication of Sporty's list and Expat's protestations. With other states being all over the board in relative number of personnel-to-population management, there is no real benchmark to use to analyze economy of scale anyway.

The other reality overlooked here is that the number of agencies in any state's government is an entirely meaningless concern. The only legitimate concern is the number of employees, and their cost, to run the ship on a worthy cost / benefits basis. Here, the attack against California would be that it's payrolls are higher than average for other states -- not the number of agencies or even personnel.

Now let the argument alter course to why California pays higher than average wages. But, right off the bat, be sure to establish what the difference really is. Being highest when the difference is a few percent isn't a very meaningful position -- especially when the regional COL is factored, as it must be.

California is not out of line with it's personnel or budget. It is at least relatively normal -- or somewhat more efficient, whatever the reasons.
The issue isn't the pay scale, it is the number of unnecessary employees and departments. CA wages generally will be higher so employees can live in CA, but the number in each dept, setting aside depts like Police and Fire, can be trimmed.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:51 PM
zdg
 
Location: Sonoma County
841 posts, read 1,703,433 times
Reputation: 1123
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
The issue isn't the pay scale, it is the number of unnecessary employees and departments. CA wages generally will be higher so employees can live in CA, but the number in each dept, setting aside depts like Police and Fire, can be trimmed.
For the sixth time in a week, please list the agencies that can be trimmed.
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Old 07-22-2013, 07:55 PM
 
Location: southern california
55,507 posts, read 74,405,087 times
Reputation: 47896
they cant. many are police and it would endanger them. we will see a strong court challenge.
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