Why are California schools so bad ? (Orange, Roseville: home, rent, income)

[Don Vito]

Originally Posted by albinoazian

I teach in a CA high school. Have any of you considered the fact that students have no incentive to do well on the tests? They know that it doesn't affect their grades or admittance to college. Some will take it seriously, many will not.

In addition, I have to agree with a previous poster. If parents were less adversarial and instead supportive of the teachers and the schools things may change. For example, we are not allowed to have students pick up trash during Saturday School. "It is degrading" or some other nonsense, parents sued. The student screwed up, but is too good for picking trash? Seriously? The reason many students have a lack of respect for teachers is because their parents do.

I dont know if I could teach my kid to respect EVERY teacher. I had some horrible, pathetic, and down right psycopathic teachers. A lot of these teachers clearly became teachers because thats all they could think of doing after getting a degree. I had teachers have emotional breakdowns, ive had teachers stop teaching and literally offer me the chance to teach the class, i had teachers trying to get in my face to pervoke me to fight them, LOL its a miracle i graduated... and this was pretty much an all white school we are talking about here folks this wasnt one of californias lesser income schools.

[Fat Freddy]

Originally Posted by Don Vito

...I had some horrible, pathetic, and down right psycopathic teachers...

When my daughter was a sophomore in HS, her alcoholic Guidance Counselor told her that the only future for stupid girls like her was to get pregnant, drop out, and end up on welfare.

So she dropped out of High School, took the HS equivalency test and registered in college. She got her BA, with High Honors, from Berkeley and went on to get her MA.

She now teaches at a major university while she works on her PhD.

I don't know what became of the Guidance Counselor.

[SoCalMomma]

Originally Posted by Fat Freddy

When my daughter was a sophomore in HS, her alcoholic Guidance Counselor told her that the only future for stupid girls like her was to get pregnant, drop out, and end up on welfare.

So she dropped out of High School, took the HS equivalency test and registered in college. She got her BA, with High Honors, from Berkeley and went on to get her MA.

She now teaches at a major university while she works on her PhD.

I don't know what became of the Guidance Counselor.

Oh my gosh, that's horrible!
Well, good for her - she succeeded & she can now influence young lives (in positive ways, Im sure).

[John23]

The difference between schools and neighborhoods is shocking.

In west la (not even beverly hills, brentwood, malibu), houses top $2.5, $3 million, and literally 3 or 4 miles away, the schools are horrible, I wouldn't send anyone there. It's just amazing.

You've also got stratospheric cost of living and the school system hasn't adjusted at all to that. Kids are spending all this time taking tests, when they should be out getting more real world experience, saving money. It takes alot more strategy to live now....than just go to school, do well, graduate, get a job, settle down. That doesn't work anymore. The way it did 20 years ago.

[Milliano]

Originally Posted by Fat Freddy

It may not be politically correct to speak in these terms, but any educator with experience in California urban areas with ethnically mixed populations will recognize the reality of these facts.

Ranked from best to worst on overall achievement, classroom discipline, and parent cooperation, Asians are always on top. Whites are next, followed by Mexicans, and Blacks are at the bottom.

These are just analyses of the statistics and do not make any judgement, theories, nor conclusions as to the causes and reasons for them.

It's the same for IQ tests and SAT/ACT scores.

And anyway, IQ has been shown to be quite heritable (average estimate is IQ is around 50% genetically influenced). And it's quite variable amongst a population. So people should get out of this myth that all children are equal in potential. If a child is dumb, they're not going to do well in school - doesn't matter if it's the best funded school in the world. If a child is really smart, they're going to excel even if the school sucks.

IQ and school performance seems to be most influenced by environment (like influence of parents) at young ages but diminishes by high school and disappears by adulthood. There have even been studies that showed adopted children, as adults, average IQ completely unrelated to their parents and their parents biological children.

So basically, blaming schools for low test scores is mostly the wrong way to look at things (although it is the politically correct way of looking at things, and in our society PC seems to be more important than reality).

The lack of first language English probably doesn't help either. Only about 60% of California's population over age 5 speaks English as a first language now. Over 40% of the population is black or Hispanic... the percentage for K-12 students is probably even higher... and blacks and Hispanics on average do poorly in school. This is a fact, and has been true ever since they've had reliable stats on this, and is true throughout the whole country rather than varying much from one state to another (individual school districts are going to vary a lot more because upper class families, including blacks and Hispanics, obviously are going to tend to have above average IQ children).

I wonder how bad California's scores would be if it wasn't for the East Asian immigrants and descendants. In the USA and their home countries these ethnic groups tend to score better academically and on IQ tests than whites/Americans/Europeans.

Social influences are obviously a factor - like some mention about parents being overworked and not having enough time for their children. But that's not just a California thing - it's more of a nationwide effect of a rat race mentality.

[Roaddog]

I don't think it's the schools fault as much as the parents, they think it's the schools job and not thiers to educate thier children and thats not so. parents need to check up on thier childrens progress, they need to over see that the homework is complete and that the childs grades are on the right track and that is not happening.
Schools get a bad record because the kids don't care and thier parents don't either. Little freddy is out running with his friends or sitting playing video and mom and Dad are right there in the next room not performing thier duties as a parent.
It's just easier to blame the schools than yourself.

[bibit612]

I have friends (Asians) who live in Baldwin Park, a predominantly Hispanic community, and raised their daughter in the public school system over there. Last I heard was she got a full scholarship to Stamford. I believe parents' motivation levels to have their kids rise above whatever the educational system is around them plays a big part on how their kids turn out. Most Asians understand that in their native countries, you have to mortgage your soul to have your children get the education you want for them and cannot easily comprehend that many born here take for granted that for the most part, elementary and secondary education is free, if people took advantage of it. It takes the involvement of all (legislators, teachers and the community) to make education as success, but if all else fails, it is up to the individual to pull him-/herself up with the help and (hopefully) good example set by the parents.

[cobmw]

Yes even in California's school system where 50% of the kids fail to reach proficiency in core subjects there are those who do well. What do we say to the rest of the kids? Too bad, blame your parents? I think a good school system sets high stendards, finds ways to get the kids motivated and does not waste time on PC fluff.

[Roaddog]

One problem with Ca. grade schools is that there are so many hispanics who can't speak or can speak only very little english, many of the parents don't speak english and don't allow thier children while at home, it really hurts the school system.
About 10 year after I had gotten out of the eith grade I ran into one of my teachers, the guy remembered me but not my name, he told me how tuff it had become because children wouldn't complete thier homework and the parents just didn't care, they blamed it on the teachers, this guy was a great teacher, his classes were always my favorite because he kept them interesting. It was sad to see him seem so let down.
If parents would just step up to the plate there would be less dropouts and uneducated children.

[Don Vito]

I agree one hundred percent road dog.