Passage of Proposition 47 (2015, violent crime, buy)

[bigdumbgod]

Originally Posted by V8 Vega

The incomprehensible stupidity of this law is the reason why I keep posting on it.
Los Angeles city council is considering a law and will undoubtedly pass it where you have to keep all guns in your house unloaded and locked up in a container or a trigger lock.
So now when a prop, 47 thug is in your house at night in the dark you have to find the key to unlock your gun, do that and then fumble to load it, all the while before the prop.47 thug realizes what your doing.
Great work Democrats, oh how I love having to live in under the stupidity of liberals or the extreme left.

Well, then quit letting prop. 47 thugs in your house at night!

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by V8 Vega

The incomprehensible stupidity of this law is the reason why I keep posting on it.
Los Angeles city council is considering a law and will undoubtedly pass it where you have to keep all guns in your house unloaded and locked up in a container or a trigger lock.
So now when a prop, 47 thug is in your house at night in the dark you have to find the key to unlock your gun, do that and then fumble to load it, all the while before the prop.47 thug realizes what your doing.
Great work Democrats, oh how I love having to live in under the stupidity of liberals or the extreme left.

then move.

[CA4Now]

"Drug court, long backed by legal experts as a cheaper and more effective alternative to prison sentences for people with addictions, provides substance abuse treatment for defendants who face low-level felony drug or theft cases. The program relies upon collaboration among addicts, their lawyers, prosecutors and judges. But at the heart of the program is the threat of a felony sentence if participants flunk out. That threat was sharply reduced last month when California voters approved Proposition 47."
Prop. 47 may keep addicts from using drug court's treatment program - LA Times

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

"Drug court, long backed by legal experts as a cheaper and more effective alternative to prison sentences for people with addictions, provides substance abuse treatment for defendants who face low-level felony drug or theft cases. The program relies upon collaboration among addicts, their lawyers, prosecutors and judges. But at the heart of the program is the threat of a felony sentence if participants flunk out. That threat was sharply reduced last month when California voters approved Proposition 47."
Prop. 47 may keep addicts from using drug court's treatment program - LA Times

Courts get hundreds of millions in federal grants for 'drug courts', so of course they are upset that they no longer will have a steady stream of clients for their programs. In my experience, the population who could most benefit from rehab are screened out of drug court because they have prior criminal offenses, those who are eligible are generally younger and have used drugs for a far shorter time, or in a more 'recreational' manner than those who are ineligible; it is easier for those folks to avoid drug use at least during the time they are participating in the program.

In my opinion addiction is a chronic disease requiring long term management, and recovery is usually full of relapses along the way. Drug courts view a relapse as a failure and send those folks off to prison, something that I think is patently absurd, a person whose only crime is drug possession is now going to spend at least a year or two with truly dangerous people and in order to survive in prison will have to resort to at least some form of gang allegiance - chances are that they will not only be released with the same problems they had when entering the system but they will now have achieved quite an education in criminality.

The other thing to consider is that outside of some kind of court imposed jail time, drug court 'treatment' usually consists of a requirement to attend NA meetings, which unfortunately have an abysmal success rate and are termed "dope-athon's" by addicts because the meetings frequently devolve into long stories about copping dope and getting high.

[bigdumbgod]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

Courts get hundreds of millions in federal grants for 'drug courts', so of course they are upset that they no longer will have a steady stream of clients for their programs. In my experience, the population who could most benefit from rehab are screened out of drug court because they have prior criminal offenses, those who are eligible are generally younger and have used drugs for a far shorter time, or in a more 'recreational' manner than those who are ineligible; it is easier for those folks to avoid drug use at least during the time they are participating in the program.

In my opinion addiction is a chronic disease requiring long term management, and recovery is usually full of relapses along the way. Drug courts view a relapse as a failure and send those folks off to prison, something that I think is patently absurd, a person whose only crime is drug possession is now going to spend at least a year or two with truly dangerous people and in order to survive in prison will have to resort to at least some form of gang allegiance - chances are that they will not only be released with the same problems they had when entering the system but they will now have achieved quite an education in criminality.

The other thing to consider is that outside of some kind of court imposed jail time, drug court 'treatment' usually consists of a requirement to attend NA meetings, which unfortunately have an abysmal success rate and are termed "dope-athon's" by addicts because the meetings frequently devolve into long stories about copping dope and getting high.

^^^Yes.

In the kneejerk reactive attempt to remove icky people from one's environs, it so often occurs that what was once merely someone who acted weird and might even have resorted to petty crimes, is then turned into a hardened, sophisticated criminal by our thirst for "justice".

[V8 Vega]

The LA Times has had several articles where drug addicts before 47 went to a court ordered AA type program or go to jail. Now with no threat of jail there is no incenative for them to go to the drug program.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by V8 Vega

The LA Times has had several articles where drug addicts before 47 went to a court ordered AA type program or go to jail. Now with no threat of jail there is no incenative for them to go to the drug program.

so, what is your point? Are you saying it is rational to send people to prison if they don't go to AA meetings, or are you an advocate for AA/NA which, by the way has about a 5% success rate? Or are you trying to say something else altogether?

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

AA/NA which, by the way has about a 5% success rate?

You sure it's even that high?

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

You sure it's even that high?

no, it's probably more like < 1% but I did talk to someone who works for SAMSHA and she threw out the 5% number so I went with that.

[Beardown91737]

Originally Posted by cb73

• Theft of a vehicle (under $950 value)
.

Many of those who deperately wish their car would get stolen will be closer to getting their wish. Our daughter had a beater and the family joke was that whoever takes it should be charged with Petty Theft Auto.