How far south in the Central Valley can you claim NorCal? (San Diego: insurance, wages)

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by mateo45

^ ^ No offense, but "proud" of what exactly, an accident of birth? And what does such "pride" entitle one to? Greater 'authority', 'expert' status, the right to 'censor' how others talk, or what….?

Because one may be proud of who they are, or where they come from, or what they value does not entitle them to anything in particular.

Often the way one perceives or interprets a statement says more about them then what the statement may be saying, in psychology, I think they call this "projection".

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by Majin

Everybody knows that Fresno is some kind of DMZ. Some unknown status which neither norcal or socal claims... but do people in say, Modesto, claim norcal? Where are the borders?

Regarding the Great Central Valley:

Sacramento is clearly NorCal; its north of all the other major metros on the coast, and in the Central Valley. 1/4 to 1/3 of the Sacramento metro isn't even in the Central Valley.

I personally think the line for NorCal is south of Modesto. Modesto has 1/3 of it's new residents from the Bay Area which identifies as NorCal.

Regarding NorCal and SoCal: North and South doesn't only apply to the Coast. The Central Valley has a north and south, too like how we have the Northern and Southern Sierra.

Regarding east and west, San Diego is further east than Reno! LA is further east than Sacramento!

[04kL4nD]

Wikipedia calls Northern CA everything north of the San Luis Obispo/Kern/San Bernardino County lines. I don't agree with that at all.

This is the definition I use pretty loosely to define Northern/Southern CA. The reality is that the state has lots of different boundaries, in terms of weather, topography, culture, politics, etc.

[Jay100]

Originally Posted by Majin

Everybody knows that Fresno is some kind of DMZ. Some unknown status which neither norcal or socal claims... but do people in say, Modesto, claim norcal? Where are the borders?

Unofficially, Norcal used to start at Bakersfield. Now it has moved up to around Merced.
If you were to just point it out on map, probably Fresno.

[mateo45]

A Day in the Life of a Narcissist | Psychology Today

Originally Posted by Chimérique

Because one may be proud of who they are, or where they come from, or what they value does not entitle them to anything in particular.

Often the way one perceives or interprets a statement says more about them then what the statement may be saying, in psychology, I think they call this "projection".

You have to live here, use the surf the ocean waters, ski the mountains, live the culture regularly in order to have strong opinions on how we identify ourselves.

Perhaps, I make no claims to perfection. But I certainly don't go around proclaiming who's 'allowed' to have "strong opinions" here (although at least you've now edited out the part about needing to be a 'native'…lol)! And BTW, if we're gonna get all "psychological", isn't that kinda grandiosity and self-proclaimed "specialness" the very definition of "narcissistic entitlement"?

[TheDragonslayer]

Originally Posted by Jay100

Unofficially, Norcal used to start at Bakersfield. Now it has moved up to around Merced.
If you were to just point it out on map, probably Fresno.

Even by Google search, Fresno is almost center geographically. Fresno to Yreka and Fresno to Mexicali are close enough to be center or Monterey/Salinas on the coast with again Mexicali/San Diego south and Crescent City/ Smith River north on the coast. The distance from the Oregon border to the Mexico border is about the same as from New York City to Jacksonville Florida and takes less time.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

No matter how much folks on the North Coast claim Northern Californian as there own, you will have to deal with the 8 million Bay Areans, 2.5 million Sacramentans, and 1.5 million NorCal Central Valley folks who have always identified with being Northern Californians. We claim our Northern Californian identity has much as folks on the north coast.

For 30 years, the largest Sacramento media station's, slogan is "Where the News Comes First in Northern California"

There are hundreds of businesses in the Bay Area and Sacramento that have "NorCal" either in their name, logo, or businesses description.

Thank you! The Bay Area and Sacramento is, have and will always be Northern California, whether the far northern separatists like it or not.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

I remember learning that in elementary and middle school in California public schools (in San Diego and Sacramento) It makes sense because there is a substantial shift in climate using those boundaries.

On the coast this fits with dividing California into the warmer ocean temps of the south from the colder ocean temps of the north.

San Luis Obispo, although very much a NorCal like town, has Avila Beach which is a south facing beach which means warmer water, and its the first beach where you can consistently find warmer waters.

The real dividing line on the coast between North and South is Pont Conception where the Cold California Current "sort of" bypasses Southern California. This is where you find the warmest beaches down to San Diego with Newport and Long Beach being the warmest overall on average.

You have to live here, use the surf the ocean waters, ski the mountains, live the culture regularly in order to have strong opinions on how we identify ourselves.

Exactly!!! The differences in climate have shaped the culture of the regions. Problem is, people like to draw straight neat lines on maps but natural boundaries are irregular.

[BeauCharles]

There's a spot in the middle of Hwy 99 between Fresno and Madera where there is a palm tree and a pine tree planted side by side. The palm is on the south, the pine on the north. Some kind of myth has grown up around it saying that's the dividing line between NorCal and SoCal.

A Geographer's Scrapbook: Where the Palm Meets the Pine

I noticed it for years as we'd drive to Fresno and thought it odd, but Huell Howser finally did a little piece on it during one of his California's Gold episodes.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

I have lived in California my whole life. All over the state, educated in both SoCal and NorCal. Dare I say how many decades.

Bakersifeld - Traditionally is Southern Cal, no matter what people in LA tell you. Yes it's in the Central Valley but it has a long history of self-identifiying as being Southern Californian. It's history/culture has way more ties with Southern Cal oil wells, and the ranch life of LA's San Fernando Valley back when there were ranches in the San Fernando Valley.

The Central Valley identifies with being North and South as well. It's almost 500 miles long. It's not all the same despite what San Franciscans or San Deigns tell you. Redding is NorCal. Chico is NorCal. Sacramento is NorCal. Yes, Modesto is NorCal, I repeat Modesto is NorCal.

For the last 50-75 years, Modesto is and has been part of Sacramento's Media Market and Sacramento is definitely NorCal. Modesto has a ton of Bay Areans who never ever ever say that they are anything other than Northern Californias, period. If anything Bay Areans claim the "NorCal" name for themselves despite us in Sacramento, Tahoe, the North Coast, or the Northern part of the Central Valley.

I used to spend summers in Modesto when I lived in Oakland, at least a few summers. Modesto is Norcal all day. like you said, it media is from Sacramento and the people there identify with Norcal. The only people who doubt this are those who think it should be elsewhere and haven't spent any time there.