CA is the 5th worst state in getting value for your money (house prices, job market)

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

None of that will improve the situation one bit. If California real estate became one iota more affordable more people would pour in to fill it up worse and drive the prices higher again. California's biggest problem is its own desirability.

So what was CA like in the 80s?

Sorry radio. I like a lot of your posts but on this topic you're beating a dead horse. Derek has nailed it down right in his four points. I agree with you that's frustrating. But you don't have a solution - because there isn't any other. We're not callous about it. We're simply realists. There are too many people all wanting the same limited positions.

There isn't a solution except for wages to increase and I don't buy the whole thing about prices increasing either. That theory's been debunked several times. What CA is experiencing is going on all over the country but just made worse by the high col.

One solution mentioned is become a hipster? Lol. So in other words gentrify neighborhoods further to drive lower income people out?

There are no solutions to anything these days without systemic change first so all this arguing is spurious. I could go to the Texas forum and say is the cheap COL there worth the heat, crowding, and absolute boredom and I would get similar responses; ie if changes were enacted texas wouldn't be cheap anymore making it less desirable.

My main point is that people do have it right. Their complaining doesn't make it any less true. I'm just pointing out that even in CA people can put on the blinders and adopt the same take it or leave it mentality without giving one thought to the complexity of the cons of CA.

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by MtnSurfer

Through the years I've noticed very that few people on CD are willing and able to adjust their mindset. That is why I stated it is the hardest (consider your audience). Rather they come to vent frustration as you many are here. Note that I even added a 4th option based on your input above. But you seem too wrapped around the axle to see beyond your frustrations to see any viable, real world solutions. If changing your mindset is not an option then there are are still other choices. So which will it be? Not to decide is a decision as well to remain exactly the same which I think most probably will, unfortunately.

Derek

Derek, my mind adjusted a long time ago. That's the only way to make something good out of a bad thing. My gripe is that some of you don't see this as a bad thing. That's my point.

If there was a viable solution to fix CAs problems would you guys support it or is this an issue of take it or leave it because of boosting? I only defend the complainers on here because they at least recognize the cons here.

[oldtrader]

People from New York, California, brag they have a higher household income than other states. But that income needs adjusted for cost of living, and this produces the true spendable household income, and it's ability to provide what a household needs, and wants.

The lowest cost of living adjusted median household income in the entire country is New York, and California comes in at 43rd place in early 2014, and according to the information that started this thread, California has fallen to 45th. Going down in relation to the other states, not up. Just think how many of the states that Californians look down on as being backward, are ahead of California when incomes are adjusted for Cost Of Living. Just think those people that do not have the California advantages, can live way better than Californians.

Median Household Income - Results America

That is one reason, that it is hard for a young person to own a home, in the parts of California where the good jobs are. The wages are higher, but not high enough to live as well as in many other states, where the cost of living is much lower. States like Colorado, Utah, and Texas all are in the top 10 states for highest incomes adjusted for cost of living. California falls into the bottom 10 states.

In many other states with lower incomes, the people living in the state have a much higher standard of living. Average family can own a home, and have more disposable income and a chance to save up a little money.

Remember: It is not how much money you earn, but what you can do with the money you earn.

Many of the better jobs in backward states, to attract the type of help they need for hard to fill positions due to not that many available, will pay California wages to attract the best people. Boy do those people make out. Super high wages, and low cost of living.

[sprint100]

All I can say is that my family can live comfortably off of 1 income since we moved out in comparison to living in California where 2 incomes was required just to survive from paycheck to paycheck.

[radiolibre99]

Old trader, you make too much sense! But as the rebuttals in here have stated, what about the "cowboy mentality" you might have to deal with? Or the crass materialism that might poison your soul? You know you could just adjust your mentality and live like a hipster here in LA?

[MtnSurfer]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

Derek, my mind adjusted a long time ago. That's the only way to make something good out of a bad thing. My gripe is that some of you don't see this as a bad thing. That's my point.

If there was a viable solution to fix CAs problems would you guys support it or is this an issue of take it or leave it because of boosting? I only defend the complainers on here because they at least recognize the cons here.

As Tulemutt asked, what will you do? Start a California revolution to lower housing prices across the board? Many us have lived here a long time and realize a few basic facts about CA:

1. Real estate in the highest demand areas will always be expensive no matter how much complaining people do about it. It's Economics 101: Supply and Demand.

2. If you want to live in an expensive area you rent or come up with a boat load of money. That is unless someone gifts you.

Are there other ways to work around the system, beat supply/demand economics, and find alternatives at times? Sure, affordable housing acts have come and gone throughout the years. They are really just a drop in the bucket for millions of residents, however, who want to own a home. But at least its something. I have two friends in Monterey and Santa Cruz who 'purchased' such houses in nice neighborhoods with affordable houses which are a percentage of homes in these expensive neighborhoods. But there are stiff requirements to qualify with many, many applicants who are waiting for such homes. So I see it as a bandaid for the majority.

Because we live in a capitalistic, market driven society, including our real estate market, its hard to escape that reality. So yes, I think it is simpler than what many are trying to make of it. It's just called being a realist.

Derek

[UB50]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

I don't think its an entitlement. Its the fact that people are working hard and increasing the profits and productivity of the people at the top who can afford homes. Big homes. Big giant mansions overlooking the sea. The American working family lost the battle over the American dream.

The best way you can turn this around is to start something for yourself. Start your own small business. That way, the profits go to YOU!

I realized this many years ago -- that all the selling I was doing was helping someone else, not me -- and I decided to start my own business. I was in business for about 10 years then I had some family issues that happened so I had to stop. I fully intend to restart in the near future. Contrary to popular belief, it's not hard to start a business in California.

[MtnSurfer]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

Old trader, you make too much sense! But as the rebuttals in here have stated, what about the "cowboy mentality" you might have to deal with? Or the crass materialism that might poison your soul? You know you could just adjust your mentality and live like a hipster here in LA?

Or you could simply move to TX and be done with it. End all of your frustrations in one fell swoop. That was option #2, BTW.

Derek

[jlloyd87]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

Old trader, you make too much sense! But as the rebuttals in here have stated, what about the "cowboy mentality" you might have to deal with? Or the crass materialism that might poison your soul? You know you could just adjust your mentality and live like a hipster here in LA?

Old Trader moving to a more affordable area makes great sense, but the thought of moving is still not connecting with you?

[nslander]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

Derek, my mind adjusted a long time ago. That's the only way to make something good out of a bad thing. My gripe is that some of you don't see this as a bad thing. That's my point.

If there was a viable solution to fix CAs problems would you guys support it or is this an issue of take it or leave it because of boosting? I only defend the complainers on here because they at least recognize the cons here.

We had this this discussion recently and I walked away. So chalk me up as another old head who thinks you are completely, entirely, 100% off-base on this subject.

We live in a patently unsustainable system that is assaulting our finite resources. Look no further than our snowpack. This reality is experienced more immediately when one seeks to buy land in a place perceived as highly desirable, but has a relatively small, desirable buildable footprint. Our assumptions, expectations and demands ARE the problem. So instead of making vague demands on others, what are YOU willing to do about those problems?

And NO, the complainers of which you speak do not and, apparently, cannot recognize any of this.