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Apps or kiosks that allow the customer to place their own order are not even offered in an attempt to replace employees, they are used because it has been proven that if a customer places their own order they are more apt to spend more money. I can order pizza, burgers, chinese take out and mexican food all from my phone and prepay for it. That has not had any effect on employment and is not what most people consider 'automation', which by the way will occur when it is financially feasible no matter what the minimum wage is.
I think it does both. Exactly what will the cashier do at a fast food restaurant if their job is just to bring you the food? The person in the back can do that. That's one less employee to pay for. Maybe they'll have someone to watch the kiosks, but where there may have been 2 or 3 cashiers, there will now only be 1 (like Walmart). Put it this way. We're talking fast food. I wasn't aware that pizza was lumped under fast food (unless you count Little Caesar's). Let's keep this to food that requires an in-person pickup (i.e. no delivery drivers). Now, let's say that business is booming, but because wait times are getting longer, customers are starting to complain and stop coming due to long wait times. As an owner, you could hire more people to take more orders (assuming capacity isn't at full, which I rarely see these days at a fast food place) to keep wait times down. You could also install kiosks. At some price it is worth it to install kiosks. Until that price is met, it would make more economical sense to hire more employees. We don't know, because things like regulations and minimum wages keep prices artificially inflated. With that said, In-N-Out pays higher than minimum wage, but I don't see a dollar menu at their location either. In my opinion, it's the customers that keep the wages low.
Keep in mind, I'm all for California as a state to do whatever the hell it wants. Someone asked my opinion and I gave it. I voted my opinion by leaving so I had more money in my pocket (this is directed at Tulemutt).
I do oppose the federal mandates though as I feel that should be a state issue.
With that said, In-N-Out pays higher than minimum wage, but I don't see a dollar menu at their location either. In my opinion, it's the customers that keep the wages low.
that's true but it's also true that you get what you pay for. Consider the difference between the hamburger buns of In-n-Out and McDonalds
I think it does both. Exactly what will the cashier do at a fast food restaurant if their job is just to bring you the food? The person in the back can do that. That's one less employee to pay for. Maybe they'll have someone to watch the kiosks, but where there may have been 2 or 3 cashiers, there will now only be 1 (like Walmart). Put it this way. We're talking fast food. I wasn't aware that pizza was lumped under fast food (unless you count Little Caesar's). Let's keep this to food that requires an in-person pickup (i.e. no delivery drivers). Now, let's say that business is booming, but because wait times are getting longer, customers are starting to complain and stop coming due to long wait times. As an owner, you could hire more people to take more orders (assuming capacity isn't at full, which I rarely see these days at a fast food place) to keep wait times down. You could also install kiosks. At some price it is worth it to install kiosks. Until that price is met, it would make more economical sense to hire more employees. We don't know, because things like regulations and minimum wages keep prices artificially inflated. With that said, In-N-Out pays higher than minimum wage, but I don't see a dollar menu at their location either. In my opinion, it's the customers that keep the wages low.
Keep in mind, I'm all for California as a state to do whatever the hell it wants. Someone asked my opinion and I gave it. I voted my opinion by leaving so I had more money in my pocket (this is directed at Tulemutt).
I do oppose the federal mandates though as I feel that should be a state issue.
Employers don't want ANY employees if they can help it. That's a given. But there are a couple subsets of application of employees that also make a difference. Keeping employee / customer contact to a minimum is a two-edged sword, as some businesses want to maintain a sparkling friendly personalized service image as part of their marketing shtick. But it's where a huge amount of headache is also created. Thus, encouraging automated phone selections with "push 1, push 2", and phone / internet ordering eliminates a lot of customer service problems. But those front counter meet and greet order-taking and information giving positions aren't the majority of the workforce in most cases.
Some insight on how this $15 min wage will affect high wage earners vs low wage earners in the state.
Quote:
Standard economic theory holds that when the costs of low-wage workers are raised by a higher minimum wage, employers reduce employment — for two reasons. First, employers suddenly find it economical to replace, say, two minimum-wage workers with one slightly more expensive, presumably more experienced or efficient worker. (One $25-an-hour worker may be a better deal than two $15-an-hour workers.) Second, the rising cost of salaries leads employers to raise prices, which leads to lower demand, meaning they have to lower overhead by reducing head count...
Some insight on how this $15 min wage will affect high wage earners vs low wage earners in the state.
Some more insight contradicting the insight that contradicts the other insights that contradicted the insights before that which contradicted ...
Quote:
Recent work on the economic effects of minimum wages has stressed that the standard economic model, where increases in minimum wages depress employment, is not supported by the empirical findings in some labour markets. In this paper we present a theoretical framework which is general enough to allow minimum wages to have the conventional negative impact on employment, but which also allows for the possibility of a neutral or a positive effect. The model structure is based on labour market frictions which give employers some degree of monopsony power. The formulated model has a number of empirical implications which we go on to test using data on industry-based minimum wages set by the UK Wages Councils between 1975 and 1990. Some strong results emerge: minimum wages significantly compress the distribution of earnings and, contrary to conventional economic wisdom but in line with several recent studies, do not have a negative impact on employment. If anything, the relationship between minimum wages and employment is estimated to be positive. The Effects of Minimum Wages on Employment: Theory and Evidence from the US
Some insight on how this $15 min wage will affect high wage earners vs low wage earners in the state.
Amusing because his solution is to keep the minimum wage as is and increase social service spending for the affected workers way beyond the 153 billion we are spending annually to subsidize low wages.
I'm surprised that he isn't recommending that we lower the minimum wage to $1 an hour to encourage employers to hire more people and then we could spend 700 billion a year on subsidies to those employees
I'm a native Californian (lived there until I was 30) and currently live in the South.
I left because I found that I would have more money in my pocket if I made the same money, but lived in a low COL state.
As for this topic, I think that when costs go up, the people that don't make minimum wage are going to be the ones that are going to be losing money. Right now, I make about the equivalent to LA 88k, but I don't have the experience necessary for any company in LA to justify paying me 88k (for many if not all companies 88k is 88k regardless of COL). My level of discretionary income is the same according to COL calculators (it's probably higher since I don't have to deal with traffic keeping my gas costs down). Obviously, I don't get the LA weather, but businesses don't see it that way. So, I think you'll see business that make money on the margin leave the state when this goes up.
As for fast food, robots will replace the workers. I used to live in a town close to Nashville where Hardee's (Carl's Jr in the west) was offering discounts to people that used the touch screen to order their food instead of the worker. My guess is that this is the future in order to keep prices from rising. And guess what? I prefer the touch screen as it didn't give me any attitude when I ordered and it allowed me to order how I like my burger w/out any human errors.
No, you don't, you get horrific humidity. See I tried the South for a few years, never got used to the humidity(it's gross), got tired of hearing stranger's opinions on politics and religion when it wasn't appropriate conversation. I lost track of the number of times my mouth dropped open from shock and how people who don't know you would discuss subjects that wouldn't be discussed out here in CA. If I don't know you don't tell me your views on race, religion, and politics.
I think my favorite one was being told by a neighbor(again they brought this up out of the blue) how the Catholic church wasn't a real church, knowing I'm Irish Catholic(although not practicing). This was an older female so I let it go, I walked away half in shock and half laughing saying "this never happened in CA".
I couldn't wait to get back here. To each his own.
I do agree about the automation, that's what these whiners who think their fast food job should support the kids they shouldn't have in the first place don't get. They will be replaced by machines with only a couple of human workers, not the 10 or more you see now working.
Amusing because his solution is to keep the minimum wage as is and increase social service spending for the affected workers way beyond the 153 billion we are spending annually to subsidize low wages.
I'm surprised that he isn't recommending that we lower the minimum wage to $1 an hour to encourage employers to hire more people and then we could spend 700 billion a year on subsidies to those employees
I don't know how long this can go on, sleepy, but it certainly has been amusing. Post after post of "hair on fire" "sky is falling" "end is nigh" submissions based on nothing but pure opinions without a lick of foundational credibility. Followed by our rebuttals based on proven data.
As I've said all along: there may be unitended negative consequences in California due to as yet unidentified comorbid negative factors. But no one so far has identified any such negative factors with any provable basis.
So folks, hang on to your shorts. Go to the zoo with your kids. Have a picnic. Enjoy a boat ride and some fishing until a few years of incremental wage rises can be studied with real market conditions.
No, you don't, you get horrific humidity. See I tried the South for a few years, never got used to the humidity(it's gross), got tired of hearing stranger's opinions on politics and religion when it wasn't appropriate conversation. I lost track of the number of times my mouth dropped open from shock and how people who don't know you would discuss subjects that wouldn't be discussed out here in CA. If I don't know you don't tell me your views on race, religion, and politics.
I think my favorite one was being told by a neighbor(again they brought this up out of the blue) how the Catholic church wasn't a real church, knowing I'm Irish Catholic(although not practicing). This was an older female so I let it go, I walked away half in shock and half laughing saying "this never happened in CA".
I couldn't wait to get back here. To each his own.
I do agree about the automation, that's what these whiners who think their fast food job should support the kids they shouldn't have in the first place don't get. They will be replaced by machines with only a couple of human workers, not the 10 or more you see now working.
LOL, Seain I totally get where you're coming from, but it's like you went WAAAAAAY out of your way to mention the weather issue when that wasn't even the point of my post. My point was that businesses don't see employee salaries in terms of COL. They see it in dollar amounts only. So if I wanted to live in LA and enjoy my current standard of living, I would have to be making 88K. The problem is that no employer can justify this at my experience level because they DON'T see salaries in terms of COL, but I do.
I lived in Northern Japan for 2 years followed by 2 six month stints near Tokyo and in Kyoto respectively. Humidity is nowhere near as bad here in comparison nor is the snow (Japan has no insulated housing). I love LA, but I'm not going to get paid less than what I'm worth and for me that includes discretionary income. No point in making 150k if you're spending 140k to live as any software engineer in Silicon Valley will tell you.
If you wanna hear unsolicited views on race, religion, and politics, I suggest living in the SF Bay area. Heard them all the time. I kept saying to myself, "this never happened in LA." Let's be real Seain, when you say CA, you really mean Southern California and mainly Los Angeles.
Well with median price of an existing, single-family detached California home of $446,460. Paying $15/hr equates to a whopping $31,000 annual income before taxes, that $15/hr. isn't going to be making any more home owners!
At $15 an hour, particularly in San Francisco, you'll be able to move from renting a closet in someone's house, to a small bedroom with a closet! Let's call it Movin' on Up in the World!
And, in some houses, instead of 15 people living there, now they'll get some breathing space with only 12 people living there!
Believe me, only the idiots will flock to CA to take advantage of this increase in the minimum wage!
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