California attitude: Is it like this in the entire state? (San Diego: how much, purchase)

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by DriveNotCommute

You either come from a very different social culture than what's common in the pseudo-urban suburbs or you yourself may be pretty self-absorbed, maybe even with a chip on your shoulder because:

In the first example, the owner may well have been trying to be helpful by asking if you wanted to know what the views outside were of. As for introductions, you don't need his name because you either already know from doing research on his house as a prospective buyer or you don't need to know because if you have no interest in proceeding with the purchase, you'll never see him again anyway. He probably sees a lot of people visiting his open house.

In the second example, it sounded like you got a matter-of-fact reply that doesn't waste anybody's time. Do you expect everyone to be a spokesperson for ESPN? What exactly did you want from someone who doesn't subscribe to ESPN because they never wanted it?

For the third example, that encounter was just plain oddball from my point of view so at first I would agree that's unfriendly and unwelcome. But then there's your inconsistency: You wanted cozy neighbors who are friendly with each other and now you're protesting that they borrowed your hose for what had to be less than a minute. You didn't mention if you ended up defusing that attitude with a smile and the same verbal engagement that you're seeking.

Making eye contact and greeting a person by saying hello and introducing yourself before you engage a stranger (or customer, or patient, anyone really, but especially a stranger) in conversation is just common courtesy. It's called good manners and displaying social intelligence. It's how people behave in a civil society to smooth tensions between humans who do not know each other well. Speaking to a person without the appropriate lead-ins is too intimate and therefore a sign of disrespect because it isn't appropriate to interact with strangers as though they are our intimates.

In social interactions where one person is the customer and the other is providing a service, curt communications in the interest of not wasting time is a good way to lose customers. It's rude. It's send the message that the speaker isn't as important as the listener; certainly not important enough to bother taking the time to spend on genuinely hearing the speaker and attempting to help with his or her concerns. That's an insulting message whether or not it was the intent. The person providing the service needs to match the needs of the customers, which takes being sensitive to how individual customers want to communicate.

Speaking to coworkers and friends that way is a good way to be unpopular, and at least some of that person's friends and co-workers will talk about what a d**ck that person is behind his or her back even if there are other things about the individual they do like. Most won't like that person though.

The appropriate behavior for the neighbor would have been to ask if her new neighbors minded if she borrowed their hose. Common courtesy dictates that one doesn't just help oneself to what belongs to someone else. Good manners and good social skills require asking permission first, otherwise, once again the rude person is sending the message that he or she is so important that he or she is entitled to helping him or herself to what belongs to others and that's because those others are too insignificant to have feelings about it or for the borrower to consider their feelings.

If she'd asked in a friendly way, they likely would have said, "Certainly. Help yourself." That's how people become friends instead of offending each other.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

I agree with this.

As for the sarcasm bit, Californians don't get it or view it negatively. I grew up on the East Coast so I understand you don't mean any harm, but sarcasm actually comes from anger, so it's really not a good vibe to put out. It's just that it's so common on the East Coast it seems like the natural order of things--but not here.

It's the same in the PNW. PNW residents are put off by people from cultures that are too direct or use sarcasm with strangers. At least they understand and find humor in irony, though. I found irony goes right over the heads of most Alaskans. They tend to just look confused.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by vdy1985

There is less of a social pleasantries in CA compared to other places in the country. Just small talk, it doesn't happen as much in CA as it is not the norm here. When I lived in the Midwest, you would say hi and smile to people just passing by while walking through your neighborhood. Have a small pleasant conversation with the cashier ringing you up at the grocery store, etc. I've heard this is common in the south too. One of my theories is the large number of immigrants in CA, so there is less of a comfort with doing this small talk stuff, and over time it has kind of faded from the culture in CA, even among native english speakers. I don't know, my theory could be and probably is way off.

I've noticed that, too. Where large populations exist together, with many newcomers steadily arriving, the less people talk to anyone they don't know. Eventually, it becomes the cultural norm.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

It depends in part on the neighborhood, as far as the friendly "Hi" goes. That's one thing I've always loved about Berkeley and parts of Oakland. Chatting with people in the cashier line, or with the cashier, is also fairly common, though maybe less so where there are a lot of transplants.

Where there are actual neighborhood centers with people on foot passing each other, sitting next to each other in coffee shops, going into the same bookstores and little movie theaters or stage theaters, and shopping next to each other on regular basis, residents feel like actual neighbors of a community and treat each other as such.

Big cities with nothing but sprawl instead of well-developed, core, walkable, hanging-out-in centers don't foster that same sense of community. Strangers just pass by each other without feeling the need to even acknowledge each other. The Phoenix Valley was my first experience with that and it was a major culture shock for me after growing up in the PNW with small towns and cities with well-developed neighborhoods. It's been like that in every city I've lived in that didn't have those neighborhoods. If areas/neighborhoods aren't walkable, people feel little to no connection to their fellow residents.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by expatCA

What makes you think fewer in CA?? People are people and so many of the people in CA are from elsewhere there is little likelihood that CA is really any different than any other State in this regard. usually ego is the reason behind such claims as "--" is better or has fewer or has more, etc. A state is a natural area with "State" boundaries drawn by man, and has nothing to do with the intelligence or behavior of people, ......... until you get too many together, then we know from science it makes people worse.That is not a "State" issue but a people issue.

But regions do have their own overarching cultures.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by David Aguilar

Hmmm....then why don't you go back?

Inviting people to leave a place because they would like an aspect or aspects of it to be different is just so...tiresome.

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

I grew up in Berkeley and Oakland. It is NOT AT ALL like Atlanta, Little Rock, Tuscaloosa or Lake Charles. Not even close!

I didn't say it was. But it's a lot better than the Pacific NW, and even the SW, with the possible exception of Colorado. It's still pretty friendly.

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by pgrdr

Where there are actual neighborhood centers with people on foot passing each other, sitting next to each other in coffee shops, going into the same bookstores and little movie theaters or stage theaters, and shopping next to each other on regular basis, residents feel like actual neighbors of a community and treat each other as such.

Big cities with nothing but sprawl instead of well-developed, core, walkable, hanging-out-in centers don't foster that same sense of community. Strangers just pass by each other without feeling the need to even acknowledge each other. The Phoenix Valley was my first experience with that and it was a major culture shock for me after growing up in the PNW with small towns and cities with well-developed neighborhoods. It's been like that in every city I've lived in that didn't have those neighborhoods. If areas/neighborhoods aren't walkable, people feel little to no connection to their fellow residents.

This is where Berkeley and parts of Oakland excel. The city councils have done a lot to preserve the old neighborhoods, the locally-owned shops. the gathering places and the old-fashioned feel.

[pgrdr]

Originally Posted by sacite

Transplants always seem to characterize "Californians" based upon the region that they are living in, Maybe the vibe is different.

Native Californians do the same thing. In fact, every region on the planet has an attitude, stereotypes, and criticisms about neighboring regions. In Europe, where their countries are the size of our states, they do it between countries, and do it between the smaller regions of their countries. We do it between our states, and then between regions within our states. The entire world does it. It's how the human brain works.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

I didn't say it was. But it's a lot better than the Pacific NW, and even the SW, with the possible exception of Colorado. It's still pretty friendly.

Then why did you make the comparison?