California Budget and Pension Liabilities (2014, public school, salary)

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

Here's the deal...you don't have to live in California, we have too many people already, almost 40 million, and it is in the best interest of all residents of the state if malcontents live elsewhere...

... because it is important to denounce all dissenting views and purge the non-believers so California can have ideological purity.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

And yet... the largest donors:

1. Service Employees International Union -- an extreme left-wing union
2. National Education Association -- an extreme left-wing militant public sector union
3. American Federation of State, County & Municipal Employees -- a left-wing public sector union
4. FAHR -- a wealthy hedge fund manager who is an extreme left wing militant progressive individual
5. Carpenter & Joiners Union -- a left wing union
6. American Federation of Teachers -- an extreme left wing militant public sector union
7. National Association of Realtors -- they will bribe anyone to protect their 6% commissions
8. International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers -- an extreme left-wing union
9. Las Vegas Sands -- a public corporation that supports the Israeli lobby and Republicans who are pro-Israel
10. Laborers Union -- a left-wing union
11. United Food & Commercial Workers Union -- An extreme left-wing union

What exactly do you think that proved? Why aren't you interested in the contributions Tom Price received? "In the latest cycle, he received $396,000 from health professionals, $181,900 from people who work for drug and other health-product companies, and more than $157,000 from people in the insurance business" Do you know what the quid pro quo is for that? As HHS secretary he wants to make significant changes to how we receive our healthcare and what we pay for it, and none of his changes will benefit the consumer. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/29/us...secretary.html

Unions use a small part of dues to try to elect representatives who will support workers in this Country, not big business interests who try to rape the working person to benefit themselves.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

The average public employee pension is something like $27,000.

That is highly misleading and you know it.

Please list the average pension for a public sector employee who retires at least at the age of 62 having worked in the public sector since they were, say, 22 years of age -- that is someone with at least 40 years working.

[tikkasf]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

And yet... the largest donors:



1. Service Employees International Union -- an extreme left-wing union
2. National Education Association -- an extreme left-wing militant public sector union
3. American Federation of State, County & Municipal Employees -- a left-wing public sector union
4. FAHR -- a wealthy hedge fund manager who is an extreme left wing militant progressive individual
5. Carpenter & Joiners Union -- a left wing union
6. American Federation of Teachers -- an extreme left wing militant public sector union
7. National Association of Realtors -- they will bribe anyone to protect their 6% commissions
8. International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers -- an extreme left-wing union
9. Las Vegas Sands -- a public corporation that supports the Israeli lobby and Republicans who are pro-Israel
10. Laborers Union -- a left-wing union
11. United Food & Commercial Workers Union -- An extreme left-wing union

Are those contributions legal ? I think we both know the answer. I think it would be a good thing to greatly reduce the effects of money in politics.....but, it has to be across the board, not just groups or organizations, individuals you don't like or I don't like.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by tikkasf

Then your argument is with those elected officials.

It isn't that simple: just as with illegal prostitution, there are both johns and whores; you can't focus on just one of the crime breakers.

In order to achieve arms-length negotiations of total compensation for public sector employees, public sector employees must be prevented from bribing elected officials. There must be a total ban on public sector employees political campaigns and operations.

"Give us massive massive increases in pensions," say the Union Bosses, "and we will donate huge $$$ to your re-election campaign. Fail to give us what we want and we will ensure you are voted out of office by massively supporting your political opponent. And what do you care? By the time the bill comes due in far-off 2017, you'll already be retired."

Even better: 100% of public sector pension payments should come from deductions from the paychecks of currently working public sector employees. That way, if the union wants a raise in pensions, the currently working union employees could vote on it.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

That is highly misleading and you know it.

Please list the average pension for a public sector employee who retires at least at the age of 62 having worked in the public sector since they were, say, 22 years of age -- that is someone with at least 40 years working.

Sure as soon as you do the math on a pension for a similar employee working for a private firm with a pension plan

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

In order to achieve arms-length negotiations of total compensation for public sector employees, public sector employees must be prevented from bribing elected officials. There must be a total ban on public sector employees political campaigns and operations.

Would you apply that same 'arms-length' rule to private businesses making campaign negotiations? They make contributions to influence votes that will benefit them, that's how the system works, why do you continue to try to make this only about pubic sector employees?

For the record, I think we should take all money out of politics and publicly fund campaigns, but for you to try to claim that public sector unions are the only ones that deserve blame is just illogical.

[tikkasf]

So, all of what you call "bribing" of legislators comes from public unions? Money and other forms of pressure from others on legislators I guess is not bribery ?
I find it rather interesting that your list, wherever you got it from, seems to be littered with the phrase "left wing". That added term, for me, weakens your argument a bit (BTW, I have voted R more often then D) If you think a total "ban" on public unions political operations can pass legal muster, then get involved in a organization that has a workable plan to enact such a plan. I think steps have been recently taken my the Legislature to address some pension issues and if it becomes necessary, members may have to increase the amount of deduction from their paycheck going toward their retirement/pension.......as could end up being needed in the case with other programs that have underfunded liability such as Medicare, SSI, Federal pensions

[honobob]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

Here's the deal...you don't have to live in California, we have too many people already, almost 40 million, and it is in the best interest of all residents of the state if malcontents live elsewhere, perhaps Oklahoma which faces it's second straight one billion (with a B) dollar budget deficit

They'd just migrateback to CA to enjoy being miserable in the better climate. If there was only a way to keep them out. Maybe a Wall along our border. And we could make Oklahoma pay for it. Let's make California Great Again!

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by tikkasf

I find it rather interesting that your list, wherever you got it from

opensecrets.org