Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-27-2017, 05:34 PM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,392,470 times
Reputation: 9328

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
22 -25% is a pretty significant amount and its share is only going to get larger.

A mass exodus to electric cars is highly unlikely. I think you're really reaching here is the whole power generation angle.
That percentage includes hybrids (Gas/Electric) not just electric cars. I have no problem with hybrids other than costs associated long term with them. My next Family car may very well be a hybrid.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-28-2017, 09:19 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,644,089 times
Reputation: 13630
Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
That percentage includes hybrids (Gas/Electric) not just electric cars. I have no problem with hybrids other than costs associated long term with them. My next Family car may very well be a hybrid.
That percentage is the amount of CA's electricity that come from renewable sources, not the % of cars. You claimed "not that much" electricity came from clean/renewable sources.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 11:33 AM
 
17,400 posts, read 11,972,033 times
Reputation: 16152
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
CA has the worst air quality in the nation as it, why on earth would you want make that worse? That's "common sense" to you? Relaxing smog/air quality restrictions in the state with the worst air pollution in the nation?
So, it has the strictest standards, yet has the worst air quality. It looks to me as if the strictest standards don't lead the best air quality. Do I have that about right?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 11:41 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,644,089 times
Reputation: 13630
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
So, it has the strictest standards, yet has the worst air quality. It looks to me as if the strictest standards don't lead the best air quality. Do I have that about right?
No not really. Air quality would be even worse without these standards as it was in the past. Air quality is better today than it was 30-40 years ago despite millions of more people. Ca's bad air quality is largely a result of it's climate and geography.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 11:45 AM
 
911 posts, read 590,743 times
Reputation: 561
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
So, it has the strictest standards, yet has the worst air quality. It looks to me as if the strictest standards don't lead the best air quality. Do I have that about right?
Yes, you do, but no, you don't. Your inference is that strict standards are meaningless to the problem addressed. But, without them the problem would be, and was, much worse.

The air quality problem in California struggles due to geographic features unique to certain areas of our state not present in most other metro areas nationally.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 11:46 AM
 
911 posts, read 590,743 times
Reputation: 561
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
No not really. Air quality would be even worse without these standards as it was in the past. Air quality is better today than it was 30-40 years ago despite millions of more people. Ca's bad air quality is largely a result of it's climate and geography.
Beat me to it as I was typing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 01:07 PM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,392,470 times
Reputation: 9328
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleysOwl View Post
Yes, you do, but no, you don't. Your inference is that strict standards are meaningless to the problem addressed. But, without them the problem would be, and was, much worse.

The air quality problem in California struggles due to geographic features unique to certain areas of our state not present in most other metro areas nationally.
That is correct as the LA basin is really bad for it, the Coastal range, The Sierra's and the other Mountains in the State all slow air flow allowing pollution to accumulate. Then the large number of people, cars, trucks, slow traffic on freeways, etc aggravate it. The saving grace for a few areas is the ocean breeze. Now automotive pollution has dropped to 2% of what it was in the late 60's, a 98% improvement, so aside from getting rid of gas and diesel there are not too many options. Natural gas, and a few other options exist but again they have problems as well. The problem usually come when changes are forced too fast and the technology is not there to keep up and that leads to increased costs and the sales are not where they should be. Doing something about aircraft would also be a big help. Balance is needed.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 04:01 PM
509
 
6,321 posts, read 7,042,755 times
Reputation: 9444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flovis View Post
Air has improved a lot in the central San Joaquin valley(merced, Fresno)
Going to be pissed if trump gets his way and things get worse.
We NEED to get rid of California agriculture to improve air quality in the valley.

Why Does California's Central Valley Have Such Bad Air Pollution? - CityLab

I am ALL for this....AG in a desert...really??
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2017, 09:42 PM
 
266 posts, read 334,338 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by 509 View Post
We NEED to get rid of California agriculture to improve air quality in the valley.

Why Does California's Central Valley Have Such Bad Air Pollution? - CityLab

I am ALL for this....AG in a desert...really??
An Article from 2011, lol, and it brings up ag burns, lol

There's hardly any ag burns anymore. The counties give ppl just a few select days a year to burn. Ag companies get fined deeply if they disobey the law.
Smog is the biggest producer of air problems and those problems will go away once we move to hybrid and electric vehicles. The valley air is improving, deal with it.

Last edited by Flovis; 03-28-2017 at 10:00 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-29-2017, 06:04 AM
 
Location: Sacramento, Placerville
2,511 posts, read 6,297,853 times
Reputation: 2260
Quote:
Originally Posted by 509 View Post
We NEED to get rid of California agriculture to improve air quality in the valley.


Why Does California's Central Valley Have Such Bad Air Pollution? - CityLab

I am ALL for this....AG in a desert...really??
There are different types of air pollution the article doesn't address properly which makes me believe the author is either ignorant or intentionally leaving out information to persuade readers to place most of the blame on agriculture. PM10 is largely made up from dust. Agriculture activities probably contribute the overwhelming majority to this category. Construction also contributes to it, as does leaf blowers or anything that lifts dust into the air. The majority of PM2.5 (the fine stuff) is unlikely to come from agricultural activities, but ag burning would certainly contribute to it, as does running internal combustion engines. Transportation probably makes up the single largest mobile source of PM2.5. So, all those trucks and cars running around the San Joaquin Valley share much of the blame. Different reports come up with different numbers in regards to the sources of pollution on both depending on weather and other variables. Air quality regulations also require ag related activities to reduce emissions.

The table on pg 6 lists sources of NOx and VOC, which are primarily PM2.5. There are two columns for each showing estimates in 2005 and 2015. A significant reduction from most sources has been made from 10 years of progress. The sources that show and increase are a result of growth, such as more livestock and more consumer products being sold.

https://www.fresnostate.edu/chhs/cvh...y-report07.pdf

Also, the San Joaquin Valley is mostly steppe. A small portion of the valley in Kern County is desert. The north of about Modesto the climate transitions to Mediterranean.

There is a nice climate map for you on the last page of this link:

https://nrm.dfg.ca.gov/FileHandler.a...16547&inline=1
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:09 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top