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Unread 03-09-2008, 02:54 PM
 
1,831 posts, read 3,357,415 times
Reputation: 634
The only reason I think conservatives should leave California is because you guys are obviously so miserable here ... just as I was miserable in Texas, which is why I left that state.

As far as the credentialing requirement ... that's mandated by state law and has been for some time. So I doubt that this decision will be overturned by the courts.

Nevertheless ... for the sake of argument ... there's got to be SOME requirements here. Maybe even a test to demonstrate that parents can, in fact, teach under these circumstances ...

But, as it stands now, there's NOTHING .... which is why I think the whole thing is so absurd.
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Unread 03-09-2008, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Full time R V ier," everywere"
91 posts, read 190,066 times
Reputation: 27
Default Please Wake up Ca.lifornia and all of America!!!!!

Yes this will be appealed and overturned Why ? Because of one simple fact that i have used with success. Their actions ( the judges) are a direct violation of all our Rights to Due process . I need only to ask one question? where and when did any of the people home schooling their children , get the required NOTICE and chance to appear and oppose their ruling. Whithout this they (the Judges) have Violated every ones Constitutional Rights to Due process , which is citeable under a TITLE 42, 1983 Action in a superior court action .I used it against a So Calif. City and won. It is that simple , so instead of getting up set , start orginazing . You have the power in your hands, use it, Also they have never proven that they home schooling was sub-standarded. And also it is correct they (the schools loose money from the state for each child that does not go to public school , it's MONEY. Make them prove that the kidk will be safer, better educated, a simple test will anser that question.
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Unread 03-09-2008, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Full time R V ier," everywere"
91 posts, read 190,066 times
Reputation: 27
Default Please Wake up Cailifornia and all of America!!!!!

Yes it has to be appealed , and it will be reversed for several reasons. One is that the judges have Violated all of our Constitutional garrented rights to due process> It's that simple Ask did they give NOTICE to all the people that home school their children ? did the have an oppertunity to oppose this action? Did they show proof that their teaching were sub- standared, and the children were less educated than ones that went to public school?A simple test can settle this. All this can and must be . responded to thru a TITLE 42, 1983 Action in any Superior Court , in any county They can not refute the fact that they by their action have violated our rights and must reverse their ruling. and if they are force to obay the constitution , which they swore an oath to uphold . Then those who choose to home school , will forever be allowed to continue . DON'T give up there is a way to correct their wrong , and we must.
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Unread 03-09-2008, 05:51 PM
 
566 posts, read 1,173,055 times
Reputation: 303
This whole argument about home schoolers being deprived of a good education is simply rubbish. Those making the argument should be ashamed. It's no secret that home schooled kids do better on academic tests. They average 30-37 percentile points above public school kids. In California, public school kids score 21.3 on the ACT composite. Home school kids in CA score 22.5.

The issue is money for the teachers and control over the future generation of kids and how they think. The legislature (dominated by Democrats) guards the interests of the teachers union. That is their where there loyalty lies plain and simple. And both the teachers union and the Democrats are wanting to plant the right thoughts in the minds of young children. Why do you suppose the legislature has directed the DOE to change California school textbooks to include alternative lifestyle learning and global warming studies? There's so much more these young minds will be taught that has nothing to do with education. No wonder California ranks down at the bottom, near Louisiana and Mississippi in student performance.
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Unread 03-09-2008, 06:30 PM
 
2,011 posts, read 2,999,073 times
Reputation: 1713
I'd like to see the lesson plan of a crack-addicted mother who is undereducated and lives in poverty with a boyfriend or two, one that might not have graduated high school herself, one that is struggling to survive, much less have the ability to school anyone. Her kids are probably lucky if they get one good meal a day at home, much less have access to books and other materials.

Our country is mandated by law to provide a FREE education to all students, not just a priviledged few. When some homeschoolers step outside their hermetically
sealed "Monk zones", and dare walk with the lepers of our society (the undereducated, the impoverished, the ones that no one gives a rat's behind for), then, and only then will I think that they are part of the solution.


Kids that have parents who (1) care and are involved and (2) have access to resources are going to do well whether this is in a homeschooling environment or a public or private school environment.

Test scores do not tell the whole story, not when you have one kid with a full belly, warm house, caring and loving parents, and another kid who is hungry, lives in poverty, has little or no security, is barely surviving, much less thriving. What do you think the "test scores" will be???

As far as this particular ruling goes, I think that some standards should be in place. I've seen too many duds who can barely spell and use correct grammar supposedly "teaching" their kids. On the other hand, I also know families who are doing an examplary job at homeschooling. What's wrong with some sort of standards? Is this some sort of threat?
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Unread 03-09-2008, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Boise, ID
1,355 posts, read 3,583,545 times
Reputation: 826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donna7 View Post
I'd like to see the lesson plan of a crack-addicted mother who is undereducated and lives in poverty with a boyfriend or two, one that might not have graduated high school herself, one that is struggling to survive, much less have the ability to school anyone. Her kids are probably lucky if they get one good meal a day at home, much less have access to books and other materials.
It's a shame the state didn't get involved sooner. The crack-addicted mother in your scenario is obviously unfit to be a parent and should have been sterilized by Big Government.

Last edited by Niners fan; 03-09-2008 at 06:59 PM..
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Unread 03-09-2008, 06:45 PM
 
2,011 posts, read 2,999,073 times
Reputation: 1713
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan View Post
It's a shame the state didn't get involved sooner. The crack-addicted mother in your scenario is obviously unfit to be a parent and should have been sterilized by Big Government.

That's interesting. You want government out of your life but have no problem with Big Brother sterilizing others. How can you have it both ways??? Sounds like some sort of nazi regime. Maybe we should have a master race of all homeschoolers now. Really, I normally agree with your posts, but good God, this is a bit scary. The fact exists that we do not live in a perfect world and sterilizing a person does not do anything for the kids that are already born.
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Unread 03-09-2008, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Boise, ID
1,355 posts, read 3,583,545 times
Reputation: 826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donna7 View Post
That's interesting. You want government out of your life but have no problem with Big Brother sterilizing others. How can you have it both ways??? Sounds like some sort of nazi regime. Maybe we should have a master race of all homeschoolers now. Really, I normally agree with your posts, but good God, this is a bit scary. The fact exists that we do not live in a perfect world and sterilizing a person does not do anything for the kids that are already born.
Tongue-in-cheek, Donna7. I would never want government sterilizing people. I guess I should have put the "sarcastic eye-roll" icon in the post. I'll edit it...

I didn't disagree with your previous post entirely either. It is not an issue of opposing standards or not. For me and many others it is an issue of 1) opposing the attitude of Big Government can solve our problems and should make our life as easy as possible; and 2) we are tired of judges who think they wear a crown instead of a robe.

Last edited by Niners fan; 03-09-2008 at 07:02 PM.. Reason: misspelling
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Unread 03-09-2008, 07:25 PM
 
385 posts, read 992,623 times
Reputation: 192
Okay, homeschoolers, now that your attention is focused here, I have heard the facts that homeschooled kids do great, get into fabulous colleges, ace all tests, etc. But, how do your kids do on average? That is, are ALL of your kids fabulously smart, talented, mulitiple disciplined? See, if I ask every good parent about their kids, whether homeschooled or not, they are all fabulous, intelligent, well adjusted, etc. Right? So, lets be real here for a moment. Do all your homeschoolers end up doing fabulous? And, if not, do you think they end up better with homeschooling anyway then they would in public school?

I guess my take on it is this: I am very well educated. I am interested in learning. I have a wide range of knowledge. There is no way I would feel competent beyond about third grade to home school my child. I really do feel that teaching is a skill and not one we can all do. I could never be a physicist, or an accountant, or a medical transcriptionist. Why is it that homeschoolers believe we all have the ability to be teachers?

I also freely admit that in my travels in New Mexico (where there are absolutely no standards), I have met some really uneducated and undereducated children. Now, maybe they are fabulously smart and just don't communicate it well. I have also been told by homeschooling parents here that there are a "lot" of subjects that they see no need to teach their children and therefore don't. Okay. Now, I wonder if those kids will ace the ACT's or SAT's, etc.?
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Unread 03-09-2008, 07:33 PM
 
61 posts, read 139,866 times
Reputation: 46
I am told weekly how wonderful my kids are, sometimes by complete strangers; how they can look an adult in the eye, and have a conversation (they are 11 and 13); how remarkable it is that they enjoy people of all ages, not just their own age, since their daily activities aren't restricted to only people of their own age.

We've fed the homeless at our church. My kids raised almost $300.00 for starving kids in other countries. They take a class focusing specifically on missions. They choose awesome friends (home, public and private schooled).

And they do school, usually only a few hours a day, since they're not competing for their teacher's attention. They both are into fine arts; music and dance. Neither one is going to win the National Spelling Bee, although that winner is usually a homeschooler. We are too busy with all their activities and just experiencing life as a family to spend so much time on one subject.

I may not have a credential, or even a college degree, but my kids are headed for bright futures because they are being educated in a loving atmosphere, with wonderful curriculae. I know my limitations, and theirs, and when they come up I seek out resources to help them. Many credentialed teachers love what they do, but are hindered by a system that forces them to "teach to the test," and deal with many, many interruptions during their very long school days. I have no such limitations, and my children's educations are reflecting that.

As far as the "socialization" issue: Most public school kids I meet (especially teenagers), can hardly look you in the eye. They have such limited contact with real life, that they don't know what to do when they're in it. We live in the real world, everyday. My children are expected to behave respectfully towards everyone they meet, and they do. Their lives are being shaped by our family's morals and values, not ones dictated by the state. And here lies the rub. The case that outlawed homeschooling (very temporarily) has to do with one family's situation, and is not at all representative of all homeschooling families. This is what makes the ruling ridiculous.

And just so you know, our liberal Republican governor had this to say:

[SIZE=3]Governor’s office press release Friday, March 7, 2008
Gov. Schwarzenegger Issues Statement Regarding Court of Appeals Home Schooling Ruling
Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger today issued the following statement regarding the recent Second District Court of Appeals ruling on home schooling:

"Every California child deserves a quality education and parents should have the right to decide what’s best for their children. Parents should not be penalized for acting in the best interests of their children's education. This outrageous ruling must be overturned by the courts and if the courts don't protect parents' rights then, as elected officials, we will.”

For once, he has his head in the right place.
[/SIZE]
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