Is landlord or tenant responsible for appliance repairs based on these lease wording? (Riverside: rentals, month-to-month)
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I have a 2 month deposit from him, covering 60 days, so I'm still fine with having to give a 60 day notice. I don't think there will be any issues with this tenant though, he pays 10 days in advance each month. I prefer the security of another whole year locked in vs. him wanting to move out in a few months. I'm debating whether or not to raise his rent with the lease renewal - likely not. I want to make it enticing for him to stay considering he's such a good tenant and I've had nightmares before so he can benefit from being a good tenant with some perks - low rent.
Again, I'm still not clear if the EXISTING wording in the lease, stating it's the tenant's responsibility to keep the appliances in good working order, means they have to be responsible for any repairs or if I have to add additional wording. With a new tenant I would definitely include wording in bold print that needs signing stating appliances are not covered in the lease - they break, they fix, and once they're broken and can't be fixed, i will remove them and no longer replace - not worth the hassle.
I don't want to tell him "If I renew the lease, I'm not going to fix or replace the AC if it breaks down" then get served with a lawsuit, considering I have already fixed it in the past not knowing how to interpret the lease. So, considering there's some existing wording in the lease I can duplicate by extending the term, I still want to know if the wording means I am or am not responsible to repair/replace the AC (for the fridge, I plan to state in the new lease that since he didn't provide his own and is using mine, if it breaks down he is responsible for getting it fixed/repaired, but I didn't have similar wording saying he needs to provide his own AC).
The "keep appliances in good working order" is ambiguous. A far s I'm concerned it means they can't abuse them or deliberately vandalize or use in a improper manner.
Not worth the hassle? It's YOUR appliance. It YOUR rental. Truthfully if I saw that wording where I was responsible to repair or replace appliances I would walk. I can see if I destroyed them ok that's chargeable. But to replace simply from normal wear and tear? Not my problem.
Well he can't sue if the AC stops working. The only thing he can do is move out as you refuse to fix it therefore you are breaking the lease. But if you inform the tenant that you will not be fixing the AC once it breaks he's aware of the conditions at the time they are signing the lease. But you can't make them repair/replace it. It's your AC unit.
You really can't force a tenant fix YOUR appliances. It's unenforceable as appliances wear out over time and you benefit when you write them off. You can tell them they must supply their own (fridge washer and dryer etc) or you will not repair if broken and they must supply their own but that must be disclosed at the beginning or when the lease is due for renewal changes can be made. But anything you take away or don't offer and someone else offers as a amenity you are looking more and more like a lower scale LL.
Regardless you can't make them repair or replace a appliance you own unless they deliberately or maliciously vandalized it or mistreated/abused the appliance.
Good luck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyLandlord
Thank you, that sounds like a well informed answer that I appreciate you sharing after your years of experience.
So it looks like my options are to either:
1. renew the lease with the appliances and repair/replace them when the time comes
or
2. Tell the tenant I will renew the lease if I can get rid of the fridge and AC first.
or
3. Not renew the lease and give him a 30 day notice to move out, then rent to someone else after I have removed the refrigerator and AC 4. You can simply say you are not repairing the AC or fridge if it breaks. They would have to supply their own fridge. As far as the AC they can supply their own too.
Options:
Option #1 seems like the best route to go, though the costliest. I'm a single mom and don't have a savings for new appliances (people assume landlords are rich and don't factor in the mortgage, HOA, property tax and other bills their money goes towards, it's not free and clear to go on a shopping spree).
Your financial issues aren't the tenants problem. Even though it sounds like you want to make it their problem by pushing all repairs on them. You being a single mom isn't their problem either. Or not having savings. Guess what? You wanted to be a LL you need to get your stuff together. That's why you need to have a reserve to take care of things that just happen when you have rentals. It's called running a business. YOU'RE the one that is benefiting from the rental. If you don't have the funds to do repairs or run it properly you're doing a disservice to the tenant and yourself and your family. You don't have a problem taking the money to pay the rental overhead right? Then you shouldn't have a pribkrm repairing things that break. If you can't handle it sell and let someone else deal with it
Option #2 - I might mention this option to him, express that I fear having to replace the AC if I renew the lease to him vs. leasing it to someone else after I remove the AC, so they can install one themself and maintain it - not sure how this would fly since it's a very hot location usually in the 100s, not a very rich town so a tenant is not going to want to a) rent without AC or b) like me, not have money to buy one.
Again this is a decision you make and reap the consequences of that decision. They may buy a free standing unit or simply deal with it. Or they may move. But that's a chance you take when you take away amenities. That's why you can't see things like this as a hassle like you stated before
Option #3 would risk the unit being vacant for minimum 1 month, plus I would have to pay someone to remove the appliances, AC is on it's last leg wouldn't sell, and fridge I already bought used wouldn't get much if anything for it.
Again those are decisions and costs you incur as a .LL running a business.
Lesson = don't rent units with appliances in them if you can't afford the repair/replacement.
EXACTLY.
As for warranties - I guess it depends on people's personalities if they know how to deal with the companies. I used to have a warranty and when the garbage disposal broke and no longer usable, they refused to replace it, same with a washing machine. For repairs, their fees were more expensive than on Craigslist, since they charge a fee just to come out even if they can't fix it. This was with Fidelity so I'm not going to waste my money that route. I can't see them replacing an AC system
Get a different home warranty plan with a different company. There are some that are decent.
.
Bold.
It sounds like you're on a shoestring budget/ragged edge type of LL.
Last edited by Electrician4you; 05-11-2017 at 09:54 AM..
Let me describe something I do. It might be helpful to you.
For my rentals, I purchase a home warranty from someone like Old Republic Home Protection or First American Home Warranty. Typically, these home warranties have a co-pay of $65 or $75.
Then, in the lease, I specify that the Tenant is financially responsible for that co-pay.
Then, if the refrigerator or Air Conditioner breaks, the tenant calls me, I call the warranty company, and they send a repairman to fix it. The Tenant pays the repair company the modest co-pay. If the appliance breaks again within 60 days, the warranty company sends the repair company back out and there is no additional co-pay.
Let me describe something I do. It might be helpful to you.
For my rentals, I purchase a home warranty from someone like Old Republic Home Protection or First American Home Warranty. Typically, these home warranties have a co-pay of $65 or $75.
Then, in the lease, I specify that the Tenant is financially responsible for that co-pay.
Then, if the refrigerator or Air Conditioner breaks, the tenant calls me, I call the warranty company, and they send a repairman to fix it. The Tenant pays the repair company the modest co-pay. If the appliance breaks again within 60 days, the warranty company sends the repair company back out and there is no additional co-pay.
Let me describe something I do. It might be helpful to you.
For my rentals, I purchase a home warranty from someone like Old Republic Home Protection or First American Home Warranty. Typically, these home warranties have a co-pay of $65 or $75.
Then, in the lease, I specify that the Tenant is financially responsible for that co-pay.
Then, if the refrigerator or Air Conditioner breaks, the tenant calls me, I call the warranty company, and they send a repairman to fix it. The Tenant pays the repair company the modest co-pay. If the appliance breaks again within 60 days, the warranty company sends the repair company back out and there is no additional co-pay.
Hope this helps.
If as Electrician4u says, having the tenant pay for repairs is illegal, then I don't see how it could fly to have them pay for the repairman to come out just because the repair is through a warranty company vs. a non warranty company.
I think I have a good idea how to proceed. I won't state that he's responsible to repair/replace, though it seems like if they agree to use MY appliances instead of providing their own, and choose to do normal wear/tear on MY personal appliances that are freestanding objects not a part of the rental unit unless I personally provide them as a bonus because they choose not to provide their own, then it seems like a fair trade off if they CHOOSE to rent that unit with the landlords appliances vs. a unit that comes without appliances, then their "cost" is to maintain the appliance even with regular wear/tear. I'm not an appliance salesperson to freely provide them with appliances. When I buy a home, it doesn't necessarily come with a fridge, washer/dryer etc. So why should a renter expect that if they choose not to provide their own with the landlord responsible for the upkeep on top of it?
Anyway, my options at this point is to increase the rent, which is below market price as I like to entice a good tenant with good credit long term, and instead charge more to cover the existing appliances until I can eventually get rid of them and not have to deal with it anymore. I can also offer to get a window AC once this one breaks down, which are about $299 vs thousands for a new central system and offer he agree to that if he wants to renew the lease. As for the fridge, why I bothered putting one in when it's going to just break down/have to be replaced was a bad idea now that I see how it works renting units out with appliances. I'd rather rent without appliances and they can deal with it, just like they deal with their pots and pans and food in their fridge.
If as Electrician4u says, having the tenant pay for repairs is illegal, then I don't see how it could fly to have them pay for the repairman to come out just because the repair is through a warranty company vs. a non warranty company.
I think I have a good idea how to proceed. I won't state that he's responsible to repair/replace, though it seems like if they agree to use MY appliances instead of providing their own, and choose to do normal wear/tear on MY personal appliances that are freestanding objects not a part of the rental unit unless I personally provide them as a bonus because they choose not to provide their own, then it seems like a fair trade off if they CHOOSE to rent that unit with the landlords appliances vs. a unit that comes without appliances, then their "cost" is to maintain the appliance even with regular wear/tear. I'm not an appliance salesperson to freely provide them with appliances. When I buy a home, it doesn't necessarily come with a fridge, washer/dryer etc. So why should a renter expect that if they choose not to provide their own with the landlord responsible for the upkeep on top of it?
They are not your personal appliances. They are amenities that come with the rental. YOU get to ADJUST your rent price to COVER the wear/tear/repair/replacement of the appliances. You're thinking too one dimensionally. The tenant isn't choosing anything. He simply makes a decision to rent from you based on what your lease and the amenities you offer.
If a tenant has his own appliances it's on them to fix or replace them. But it's THEIR appliance and they know that to startvwith. When they are using YOUR appliance that you offer in a rental it's the appliance in a rental and it has different tax implications than the same appliance in YOUR house. You are benefitting from the appliance both in offering it and tax implications.
You offered the fridge to the tenant. If you don't offer a fridge and they choose not to procure a fridge they simply don't have a fridge. But that's not your problem idpf they don't want a fridge. You just can't expect them to fix/replace the fridge you provide (unless they deliberately broke it and they are only financually liable for the unused portion of the fridge worth/life expectancy). Basically you put a cheap used fridge you can't cgatge them fir a top of the line Maytag. You can only charge for the unused life expectancy left in the appliance.
Anyway, my options at this point is to increase the rent, which is below market price as I like to entice a good tenant with good credit long term, and instead charge more to cover the existing appliances until I can eventually get rid of them and not have to deal with it anymore. I can also offer to get a window AC once this one breaks down, which are about $299 vs thousands for a new central system and offer he agree to that if he wants to renew the lease. As for the fridge, why I bothered putting one in when it's going to just break down/have to be replaced was a bad idea now that I see how it works renting units out with appliances. I'd rather rent without appliances and they can deal with it, just like they deal with their pots and pans and food in their fridge.
Well the reason you don't stay too far below going rate is because you need to cover your costs AND put money away for unexpected repairs which will come up. Appliances (as they are part of running a business) are part of that cost. If your revenue isn't covering your TOTAL costs and you don't have the ability to put money away and Josie a profit you're going something wrong.
I like to entice good tenants too but I'm not going to put myself to the point where I may shoe stringing scrounging to do it rather. 3-4% below going rate is a good place to be.
You really need to sit down and take a good look at your rental and how you run your business the amount you receive in rent fees and your expenses to get a grip on your costs and return on the investment. It really sounds like you're beating your head against the wall in frustration and your tenant is most likely too.
There is no reason to do this. You can have a profitable business if you simply keep your personal feelings out of it.
You're lucky. I wouldn't sign such lease. It's no different than expecting me to repair your appliance. Which is what you are asking the tenant to do.
If it it's not illegal, then I can ask my tenant to do the same. I am sure he would agree if the alternative is he has the option to move out. I thought from the posts that you were saying it is illegal. I'm still not clear on it. I just want to get rid of the appliances period.
If it it's not illegal, then I can ask my tenant to do the same. I am sure he would agree if the alternative is he has the option to move out. I thought from the posts that you were saying it is illegal. I'm still not clear on it. I just want to get rid of the appliances period.
Ok maybe I'm not explaining it right. Because the way you are describing/doing it, you are violating the lease agreement so you're in breach of contract if you continue in this manner. When a tenant calls with a problem you can't just say you fix it not my problem and hang up. You have certain liabilities and responsibilities when you're a LL. Right now you are offering amenities for the tenant to use when they rented your property.. Since your lease states tenant must use their own fridge you simply give notice that you are removing the fridge you supplied and pursuant to section (whatever the section) of your lease the tenant must supply their own fridge. But you can't make him pay for the repair.
Ok you want to get rid of the appliances, make the tenant get their own or put the repair on the tenant?
If you want to do any if the above to the appliances you simply must give proper notice of your intentions either in the beginning or whenever the lease term comes up for renewal. You can't do it in the middle of the lease term or whenever you feel like it. Just like the tenant can't just leave with no financial consequences the lease protects the tenant from you just doing as you please. You can change the lease terms when it comes up for renewal WITH proper notice. If both parties (meaning you and the tenant) agree to the changes the lease is now legally changed as long as it's not some illegal terms. If the tenant disagrees with the terms you simply give them notice or he gives you notice to move out as the terms changed but both parties can't come to a agreement.
If you offer appliances for use in your rentals in the beginning of a lease term you have to disclose to the tenant what is expected of them if something should happen. Basically in the beginning when you first execute the lease for the property and the section where the description of the use of property states "the tenant has the use of the property at 123 Any Street Any City Ca 90000 which includes the use of a stove, fridge, dishwasher etc amenity, front and back yards and surrounding property up to its boundaries/fences, two car garage and two parking stalls in the driveway". At this point the LL is responsible to take care of the repair or replacement if the appliance breaks due to normal use. Because you are including the use of the amenities as part of the lease agreement and you are supplying them and you are not stating the tenant is responsible for the repair/replace/maintaining you must provide a working appliance throughout the term of the lease. If you don't wish to offer the use, repair or expect the tenant to fix the things you must disclose that to the tenant. You just can't do so in the middle of the lease term
Now if the lease stated "the tenant has the use of the property at 123 Any Street Any City Ca 90000 which includes the use of a stove, fridge, dishwasher etc amenity, front and back yards and surrounding property up to its boundaries/fences, two parking stalls in the driveway and excludes the use of the two car garage structure" at this point the tenant is aware he does not have the use of the garage and it's written in the lease. So the tenant can't come back and say Hey Mrs. LandLady I need to park in the garage.
IF your lease states that you will not repair or replace a amenity that breaks and the tenant must supply their own, if that should happen, then the tenant simply supplies their own. You just CANT make them pay to fix YOUR appliance because it's a hassle to you. It's YOUR appliance that you're offering for use to the tenant but you're not specifying what happens when it breaks. Since you're not specifying what happens when it breaks you must provide a working appliance for the duration of the lease.
Even if it's not written in the lease in the beginning at the time you execute the lease, once a lease comes up for renewal you can now change the terms but it must be done and the tenant notified of the changes before the new lease term takes effect. This gives them the time to get the notice of the changes and agree to stay or give notice to leave.
What SportyandMisty is doing, is disclosing the requirements and responsibilities of the tenant at the time of the lease signing or at some point after with proper notice. Now if she did not disclose it she would not be able to do that. Can't have a signed lease then say btw you have to pay for the repairs. No I really don't because it's not in the lease . So her tenant knows if something breaks the process of repair is spelled out. Is it illegal for SportyandMisty to do so? No not as long as it's disclosed and tenant agrees. If it's not disclosed she would not be able to make the tenant pay. Thectenant could tell her to take a hike.
My comment was simply stating that I personally wouldn't agree to that term. I don't feel it's my responsibility or duty to pay for the maintenance of your property and its amenities. It would be like leasing a car and expecting me to pay for repairs. I wouldn't lease the car just like I wouldn't sign such lease.
Last edited by Electrician4you; 05-13-2017 at 05:42 AM..
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