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Old 07-26-2017, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,259 posts, read 15,271,532 times
Reputation: 12106

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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiolibre99 View Post
That's scary. But improving your skill set to catch up with advances in tech and changes in economy is the only way. Occupational centers in CA are already cheap but they're underfunded and sometimes the classes are cancelled and such. We need to restructure our educational system to get people into trades or higher admin stuff. They need to learn to run the machines that will replace some of the manual labor too.

Then again it takes a will of not only a nation but of the individual. I'm starting to think that functioning countries are still third world not just because of a history of colonialism or corruption but all the high economic activity goes to those who are in the know or take the initiative. There are a lot of rich functional countries out there with high poverty.

I mean what are we supposed to do with people who don't want to improve their skill sets or believe they cant because of XYZ and get left behind? Are we supposed to just perpetually provide for them? I guess this is why Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg keep insisting on a universal income.

I just think we are headed toward that high functioning yet high poverty level kinda country.
Yes I agree . I'd rather see people getting training in the trades as early as high school but it just seems there is so much money and political power in the higher ed-liberal arts sector .

There are these programming boot camps now which seem interesting they are pretty expensive it seems but so are grants for sending someone to a liberal arts school to get a 4 or 5 year bachelors degree .
Why not send that kid that shows an interest and promise in programming to one of those boot camps so they can get a good paying job ?

Then if they want to get a 4 year degree later on they can do that .

I really think the answer is that these colleges and universities need the bodies to keep going and that's the reason why .

There are many other trades that are high paying too but the education system doesn't seem to promote them

 
Old 07-26-2017, 02:24 PM
 
231 posts, read 202,090 times
Reputation: 232
not surprised. People can afford these basic $600-700K townhomes just to own. If its a dual income family and one loses their job, its over. Especially now that most mortgages require a good downpayment they would lose a lot. People putting 100-200K down on these 600-700K condo/townhomes or old fixer uppers just so their mortgage is close or under $3K. Then bam they lose it all.
 
Old 07-26-2017, 02:51 PM
 
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
5,297 posts, read 4,028,733 times
Reputation: 7049
Quote:
Originally Posted by taimaishu View Post
CA is in fact the 6th largest economy. Which is pretty amazing considering how all the Red States keep begging CA for money by way of Federal Aid. While screaming they hate socialism on front the the TV.

Heck, even states like TX have been known to beg CA companies to move there. Pathetic and Sad!

Can't these backward hick states do their own stuff? Why beg?
Parrot
 
Old 07-26-2017, 03:05 PM
 
5,098 posts, read 2,728,861 times
Reputation: 4636
Quote:
Originally Posted by RosieSD View Post
Interesting. Tell me more about your plans for helping people in poverty.
In a perfect world. Less entitlement spending, more incentive for people to get off entitlement programs. Eliminate incentives for illegal immigration, more restrictions on all visas from Mexico, etc.

In this world? Nothing. There's nothing that can politically be done unless the entire Democrat platform changes (which it won't).
 
Old 07-26-2017, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,259 posts, read 15,271,532 times
Reputation: 12106
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliRestoration View Post
In a perfect world. Less entitlement spending, more incentive for people to get off entitlement programs. Eliminate incentives for illegal immigration, more restrictions on all visas from Mexico, etc.

In this world? Nothing. There's nothing that can politically be done unless the entire Democrat platform changes (which it won't).
Yes exactly and we should be giving people an incentive not to have kids at an early age especially when they don't have an education or skills .

From what I see in California the "poor" can live relatively comfortably with free housing ,free food , free cell phone etc .

Sure they aren't driving new Mercedes every year but the middle class can't really afford that either after taxes student loan debt etc .
 
Old 07-26-2017, 03:47 PM
 
10,097 posts, read 7,504,397 times
Reputation: 5225
When people immigrate to America in droves to mostly live a marginal better life, it doesn't make for any changes. For instance, in the flow of immigration from the global south only the minority of the millions that move here become business owners and contribute the economy is a large scale way. The rest live only marginally better lives than what they left in their home countries.

Who are those that end up successful? The ones who learn the language, take the initiative and invest wisely. That is who we should be taking in. The people who take advantage of the major opportunities here, not just import another country's working poor. We already have a working class in this country and now they have to compete with the rest of the global south?
But that just sounds TOO harsh for Americans to hear. Yet, I get tired of people thinking that this country is some international way station where anyone and everyone has a right to be here, and citizens who were born here or put the time to become naturalized have no say to the contrary.

I think we are maturing enough as a country to expect some cohesiveness in our culture, no matter how much of a melting pot it is. I think that one thing that this election has done is awaken a sort of civic nationalism that says that we are not just an economy for all the world to exploit, but we're a country too. A country with laws. Laws that aren't being enforced to their fullest extent.

I think for the Democrats to oddly embrace globalism or globalization with such fervor to label all opponents xenophobic when they express some legitimate grievances has been their major flaw. It will also be a test to see how the GOP responds to the push back to globalization.
 
Old 07-26-2017, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,259 posts, read 15,271,532 times
Reputation: 12106
Quote:
Originally Posted by radiolibre99 View Post
When people immigrate to America in droves to mostly live a marginal better life, it doesn't make for any changes. For instance, in the flow of immigration from the global south only the minority of the millions that move here become business owners and contribute the economy is a large scale way. The rest live only marginally better lives than what they left in their home countries.

Who are those that end up successful? The ones who learn the language, take the initiative and invest wisely. That is who we should be taking in. The people who take advantage of the major opportunities here, not just import another country's working poor. We already have a working class in this country and now they have to compete with the rest of the global south?
But that just sounds TOO harsh for Americans to hear. Yet, I get tired of people thinking that this country is some international way station where anyone and everyone has a right to be here, and citizens who were born here or put the time to become naturalized have no say to the contrary.

I think we are maturing enough as a country to expect some cohesiveness in our culture, no matter how much of a melting pot it is. I think that one thing that this election has done is awaken a sort of civic nationalism that says that we are not just an economy for all the world to exploit, but we're a country too. A country with laws. Laws that aren't being enforced to their fullest extent.

I think for the Democrats to oddly embrace globalism or globalization with such fervor to label all opponents xenophobic when they express some legitimate grievances has been their major flaw. It will also be a test to see how the GOP responds to the push back to globalization.
Most are ignorant or in denial about how the globalism and pro illegal alien policies have a negative effect .
They find themselves working more and more yet wonder why they have to keep working more and more for a lower standard of living .

I believe there will be a shift especially as housing and everything else continues to get more expensive .
I think people will wonder why we are spending so much on "immigrants" aka illegals and why we are letting other countries take advantage of us on trade .

You just look at some of these articles the liberal media puts out and it's absurd .

They make it like there are no negative side effects to sanctuary cities etc .
 
Old 07-26-2017, 04:07 PM
 
10,097 posts, read 7,504,397 times
Reputation: 5225
Illegal immigration is just a symptom of a major problem which is internationalism or globalization. Everyone, including the least skilled among us are having to compete with global everything. Being a citizen in this country means little these days. They applaud illegal aliens for taking the initiative on doing something great not knowing they or their parents broke the law to be here. Perhaps they also received a leg up with some extra funding through scholarships or grants specifically targeted for immigrant youths, IDK, I am speculating.

We have homeowners competing with foreign investors for property, and other countries are getting richer when the immigrants in this country send their money back to their families. Mexico gets more money from immigrants in the US sending their loved ones money back who in turn pump it in to the Mexican economy, than petrol. So in some small sense a portion of the wealth these immigrants create goes out of our country and back to their home country.

We have both the GOP and now surprisingly the Dems pushing for this globalization. We have globalism being preached as a matter of free enterprise and anything that might go against a fully unrestrained free trade is akin to socialism, nationalism or being anti-market.

We also have a Democratic party that labels you xenophobic for even hinting at focusing on citizens in the country now vs the free flow of immigrants both legal and illegal.

So at both ends of the social and economic discourse, politicians with an international perspective have us in check.
 
Old 07-26-2017, 04:16 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
25,259 posts, read 15,271,532 times
Reputation: 12106
Quote:
Originally Posted by radiolibre99 View Post
Illegal immigration is just a symptom of a major problem which is internationalism or globalization. Everyone, including the least skilled among us are having to compete with global everything. Being a citizen in this country means little these days. They applaud illegal aliens for taking the initiative on doing something great not knowing they or their parents broke the law to be here. Perhaps they also received a leg up with some extra funding through scholarships or grants specifically targeted for immigrant youths, IDK, I am speculating.

We have homeowners competing with foreign investors for property, and other countries are getting richer when the immigrants in this country send their money back to their families. Mexico gets more money from immigrants in the US sending their loved ones money back who in turn pump it in to the Mexican economy, than petrol. So in some small sense a portion of the wealth these immigrants create goes out of our country and back to their home country.

We have both the GOP and now surprisingly the Dems pushing for this globalization. We have globalism being preached as a matter of free enterprise and anything that might go against a fully unrestrained free trade is akin to socialism, nationalism or being anti-market.

We also have a Democratic party that labels you xenophobic for even hinting at focusing on citizens in the country now vs the free flow of immigrants both legal and illegal.

So at both ends of the social and economic discourse, politicians with an international perspective have us in check.
Yes , great post .

I don't think most realize how much leaves America and is sent back "home"
$26 Billion was sent out of the country to Mexico in 2016 alone and that's just one country .
Imagine how many billions .. or trillions have been lost.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/remitta...016-1485978810
 
Old 07-26-2017, 04:23 PM
 
10,097 posts, read 7,504,397 times
Reputation: 5225
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
Yes , great post .

I don't think most realize how much leaves America and is sent back "home"
$26 Billion was sent out of the country to Mexico in 2016 alone and that's just one country .
Imagine how many billions .. or trillions have been lost.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/remitta...016-1485978810
Yes, but you'll be labeled a xenophobe for even bringing it up. Then there will be a counter argument which includes mental gymnastics worthy of Cirque Du Soleil all in order to virtue signal, confirm bias and cast the opponent as a xenophobe.

Other retorts:
You're an immigrant too pilgrim. All Americans are immigrants.

The only true American is a native american.

This country doesn't belong to you, the citizen.
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