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Old 08-02-2017, 08:23 PM
 
17,432 posts, read 10,510,439 times
Reputation: 8328

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Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Obama told me my costs would go down $2,500
And you could keep your doctor.

 
Old 08-03-2017, 07:23 AM
 
Location: So Ca
15,625 posts, read 14,891,593 times
Reputation: 13552
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Obama told me my costs would go down $2,500
And Trump said that everyone would be covered, at a lower cost.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Paranoid State
13,047 posts, read 10,372,018 times
Reputation: 15672
The price of health care insurance must increase to at least $10,000 per person per year plus administrative costs.

Why?

We consume at least $10,000 of health care per person per year, so the insurance must cost at least as much as the health care for which it pays.

If you are not paying at least $10,000 for your health care insurance, you're getting subsidized by someone else.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 11:39 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,300 posts, read 7,933,160 times
Reputation: 6464
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
And Trump said that everyone would be covered, at a lower cost.
Trump hasn't signed any bills to see if he is right or wrong.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 12:02 PM
 
6,392 posts, read 4,011,035 times
Reputation: 16477
Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty View Post
The price of health care insurance must increase to at least $10,000 per person per year plus administrative costs.

Why?

We consume at least $10,000 of health care per person per year, so the insurance must cost at least as much as the health care for which it pays.

If you are not paying at least $10,000 for your health care insurance, you're getting subsidized by someone else.
So a family of five pays $50,000. And here I thought the $15,000 premiums + $8000 deductible my family is already paying was too much, silly me.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
13,997 posts, read 15,994,517 times
Reputation: 12610
Increase is mostly due to uncertainty and declining quality of the pool of people getting insurance. The way the law is written insurers have to have reduced out-of-pocket expenses for low-income buyers which is currently being paid for by a subsidy paid to the insurance companies as the issue is resolved in court as to whether or not those subsidies are constitutional. There's significant doubt whether Trump administration will even choose to defend the lawsuit in which case they would be deemed unconstitutional by default. Insurance companies would still need to offer the reduced out-of-pocket expense plans for low-income buyers as that is the law. It just means that everyone else's insurance would get that much more expensive to pay for it. That won't affect most people any as it just means they'll get more subsidies so insurance is 18% higher premiums and for most people they pay the same premiums. For the small minority of those paying the full cost of it though, yeah, it'll hit us. In other words, the federal government does save a small amount of money but not all that much. Predominantly it just shifts from paying for the cost-reduction subsidies to paying more in premium subsidies.

Second thing driving the increases is that there aren't enough young, healthy people subsidizing the costs for older and/or sickly people. Partially that's nothing the Trump administration did or didn't do. When ACA passed with the 3x rather than standard 5x rules (older people who cost more can only be charged 3x as much as young people who cost less), it guaranteed that a lot of young people wouldn't buy insurance. It really isn't worth it to them from an actuarial basis. They cost far less to insure than the minimum premiums insurance companies are allowed to charge if they don't want to take a huge loss on older people because of the 3x limit versus the more standard 5x limit. Take away the individual mandate, however, which Trump administration has said that if law permits them to do so they will do, and there's even less reason. Even before Trump administration, the penalty wasn't collectible. All the IRS could do is send you a letter asking you to voluntarily pay it or withhold it from your tax return. If you're like me and never get anything back in taxes they didn't have any ability to actually collect the penalty as it was.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 05:13 PM
 
655 posts, read 467,099 times
Reputation: 824
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Trump hasn't signed any bills to see if he is right or wrong.
Hmmm, well why can't we just get Congress to vote on his plan? The one that he promised would bring down premiums for everyone and provide better care as well? I mean, he did say he had a healthcare plan during the campaign right? What was it again?

Pretty simple, he just needs to explain what his plan is and then Congress can vote on it. I seem to remember Obama saying that if a plan was put forward that did those things he would publicly back it and I would imagine there would be Dem votes in the Senate for it as well.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 06:32 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,300 posts, read 7,933,160 times
Reputation: 6464
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFlats View Post
Hmmm, well why can't we just get Congress to vote on his plan? The one that he promised would bring down premiums for everyone and provide better care as well? I mean, he did say he had a healthcare plan during the campaign right? What was it again?

Pretty simple, he just needs to explain what his plan is and then Congress can vote on it. I seem to remember Obama saying that if a plan was put forward that did those things he would publicly back it and I would imagine there would be Dem votes in the Senate for it as well.
The plan won't pass because Americans are simpletons and love handouts. Democrats and the media are much better at framing arguments and republicans cannot counter that. Any time republicans want to reduce anything democrats claim hundreds of thousands of people will die. Just like the CBO score and democrats parroting that 20 million people won't have insurance with the new plan, but all that means is 20 million people will have a choice to buy insurance or not. I thought democrats were the party of choice?

The different between democrats and republicans is obvious. The media parrots the democrat message and bills pass. Just like how obamacare passed; everyone who was paying attention at the time knew it was nothing but unicorns and rainbows and would never work. But the media got in line and then I'll got through.

Republicans point out the obvious flaws in Obamacare and propose something that is basically 95% of what Obamacare is and democrats claim that republicans are killing hundreds of thousands of people and the media just regurgitates the talking point. The American people who can't follow something unless it can be explained in 20 seconds or less just hear the democrat talking point without having a clue that the republican plan keeps almost all of Obamacare and just pushes the regulations down to the state level and removes the mandate that already has 40+ exemptions anyways.
 
Old 08-03-2017, 06:45 PM
 
Location: So Ca
15,625 posts, read 14,891,593 times
Reputation: 13552
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Just like the CBO score and democrats parroting that 20 million people won't have insurance with the new plan, but all that means is 20 million people will have a choice to buy insurance or not.
No, that means that if they truly can't afford their insurance and don't qualify for Medicaid, they go back to using the ER for their health coverage......which costs the rest of us a LOT more than what their policies cost.

Quote:
Just like how obamacare passed; everyone who was paying attention at the time knew it was nothing but unicorns and rainbows and would never work.
But it did work, and it still does work. It obviously needs some changes, but repealing it is not the solution.

Republicans call Obamacare a 'failure.' These 7 charts show they couldn't be more wrong - LA Times
 
Old 08-03-2017, 07:46 PM
 
Location: La Costa, California
900 posts, read 506,998 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Democrats and the media are much better at framing arguments and republicans cannot counter that.
that's hysterical How bout telling it like it is.....we have the moral high ground and there is no counter to that!
Dave
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