Why DON’T people hate California? (Los Angeles, Eureka: 2013, buyer, bankrupt)

[LoriBee62]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

I was just reading on the Seattle forum, about a huge smelter that was closed in the 80's (very late, compared to CA), that had what was believed to be the tallest smokestack in the world. It pumped plumes of arsensic and lead toward Seattle, and over the islands in south Puget Sound. In the 90's it was dismantled, and became the subject of an EPA cleanup effort. But even today, people inquiring about moving to the area for the purpose of gardening, or having a hobby farm, or whatever, are cautioned to consult a map of the which areas and neighborhoods still have that residue in the soil.

That was pretty recently that it was dismantled (1990's). And yet, people wonder why we have environmental standards and pollution control.

It was sometime in the 70's, wasn't it, that CA prohibited incineration of household trash. People used to have backyard incinerators, and would burn all their paper trash. Newspapers were recycled, but all the packaging and other paper waste a household generates used to be incinerated.

Indeed. I understand the idea of people moving to find the "place like they grew up in", where they can burn oil, light up trash in the back yard, and basically have the legal freedom to pollute at will. Plenty of spots in America where that still flies, because there's simply not much population density. When you get 40 million people in a state, habits need to change because the ecosystems and environment can't handle 40 million people polluting their surroundings in such a small amount of real estate.

It's the beautiful thing about America. If someone begins feeling out-numbered in their views and habits and doesn't want to evolve, there are thousands of places to go to find like minds.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by LoriBee62

Indeed. I understand the idea of people moving to find the "place like they grew up in", where they can burn oil, light up trash in the back yard, and basically have the legal freedom to pollute at will. Plenty of spots in America where that still flies, because there's simply not much population density. When you get 40 million people in a state, habits need to change because the ecosystems and environment can't handle 40 million people polluting their surroundings in such a small amount of real estate.

It's the beautiful thing about America. If someone begins feeling out-numbered in their views and habits and doesn't want to evolve, there are thousands of places to go to find like minds.

Yeah. But how do I get off the planet? Because that’s literally what it would take to escape the environmental pollution we have burdened ourselves and future generations with. ... To say nothing of the even more frighteningly repulsive mental pollution (read: the Trumpster revolution).

Yipes. No escape.

(Saaay, just noticed how Trumpster rhymes with ‘dumpster’. There’s a song in this somewhere ...)

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Yeah. But how do I get off the planet? Because that’s literally what it would take to escape the environmental pollution we have burdened ourselves and future generations with. ... To say nothing of the even more frighteningly repulsive mental pollution (read: the Trumpster revolution).

Yipes. No escape.

(Saaay, just noticed how Trumpster rhymes with ‘dumpster’. There’s a song in this somewhere ...)

Yup. I've been saying for decades, now, "This is the only planet we have". Some people, but especially industry--corporations, don't get it, still.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

Yup. I've been saying for decades, now, "This is the only planet we have". Some people, but especially industry--corporations, don't get it, still.

They get it ... just don’t care.

[Grlzrl]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

When I bought my home the previous owner of 50 years was paying $1200 annual property tax... the moment it became mine the tax went to $8800.

I have experience with Washington State... 80% tax jump in one year... if you don't think that is sobering...

.

That's because the whole premise of Prop 13 is that new homebuyers subsidize older ones. Not everyone is happy about doing that.

[ObserverJC]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Yeah. But how do I get off the planet? Because that’s literally what it would take to escape the environmental pollution we have burdened ourselves and future generations with. ... To say nothing of the even more frighteningly repulsive mental pollution (read: the Trumpster revolution).

Yipes. No escape.

(Saaay, just noticed how Trumpster rhymes with ‘dumpster’. There’s a song in this somewhere ...)

Since escape to outer space is currently impossible, the next best thing is not having any child so all issues end with the current generation.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by ObserverJC

Since escape to outer space is currently impossible, the next best thing is not having any child so all issues end with the current generation.

Well, no. That would be if a person considers the “issues” to have greater importance than to humanity. The planet doesn’t care about our stupidity. It is, like the larger universe, quite indifferent. The whole point of the “issues” is how they affect humanity, ultimately. Even our concern for the welfare of other life is relational to our wholistic, if you will, well being.

No reason to stop having children ... just not nearly so many. Need to generationally cut back to about 15% of where we are ... get back to loincloths and hunting/gathering.

[ObserverJC]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Everything pollutes...

Plus my cars pass smog... so they are compliant...

The real gripe is I may drive a couple of hundred miles a year... most just before smog test

To take the smog test you really should not have old gas in the tank and the car should have some road miles on it...

So taking the smog test is the reason for more than half my annual miles

I find it amazing the government vehicles are exempt from smog testing and this has caused some real problems when surplus vehicles are disposed of... plus the National Guard and Military motor pools have nothing compared to civilian use...

Yet my 1976 car driven maybe two tanks of gas a year needs to jump through hoops only in California

The State certainly has lost some of it's luster for those in the auto hobby... yet fireworks are publicly funded and leave a haze each year and at the sporting arenas during the season... plus terrified pets and wildlife get a total pass...

As for pollution... I helped friends near Ukiah evacuate over the weekend... on tract to be the largest wildfire ever in California history... the fuel load is immense... because entire tracts of land were off limits to loggers and one reason is the spotted owl habitat... well, all this preservation and anti logging has really paid off in spades as the region is now under terrible air quality and 14,000 fire fighters plus air tankers, etc... are putting their lives on the line fighting...

Friends that raise cattle for over a 100 years are also getting squeezed... but grazing greatly reduces fuel load... have we lost all common sense?

We have the same problem at the Hospital with our emergency generator... this is a perfectly maintained unit for the purpose of life safety... the Air Quality Management District said it's days are numbered because it does not meet the new standards... don't know how others feel about it but spending hundreds of thousands replacing perfect Hospital Emergency Generators is just an example of regs run amok and who pays... the public... yet refrigerated trucks can idle all weekend behind the supermarket when they have their sea food sales...

Friends outside of California said California is a very rich state because only a rich state can impose retro actively requirements to decommission perfectly maintained equipment...

Same with Backhoes and Wood Chippers... these are sold out of state with grants of taxpayer money for business to buy new...

IMO this is transitional pain. Whether we like it or not California is changing in every aspect and it is difficult to come up with the right new rules in the early stage. It would probably take a few more years before we could come up with laws and regulations that most people could agree with.

[TacoSoup]

Originally Posted by Grlzrl

That's because the whole premise of Prop 13 is that new homebuyers subsidize older ones. Not everyone is happy about doing that.

I’ve never met one homeowner who didn’t like prop 13, especially new buyers. Most aren’t concenrned with what their neighbor is paying. All they care about is having a great rate compared to most states, and it’s not gonna up crazy every year.

[SFBayBoomer]

Originally Posted by Grlzrl

That's because the whole premise of Prop 13 is that new homebuyers subsidize older ones. Not everyone is happy about doing that.

You are completely wrong about this. Every homeowner benefits and the longer they stay in the same house, the more they benefit.