Is California a good place to live in anymore? (Oakland: for sale, credit)

[sheri257]

Originally Posted by Charles

But to me, California is like an ex wife: We had some good times together, and in some ways I still miss her, but I just can't stand living with her anymore.

Yeah but for somebody who's divorced this state, you sure talk about it A LOT ...

Maybe you're not quite over the marriage yet ...

[Charles]

Originally Posted by sheri257

Yeah but for somebody who's divorced this state, you sure talk about it A LOT ...

Maybe you're not quite over the marriage yet ...

Maybe I'll have a fling with her again some day, you know, to satisfy my seven year itch (which in real life I had six years and 11 months early....)

[karenabcde]

I am a single female with a small business. I don't know how I would pay for kids and a family. My groceries are ridiculous. I am able to save money because my townhouse is paid for and I don't have kids. My big expenditure this month is dog-training classes for $180. I can't imagine multiplying my expenses by four or five. I make a decent income and can deduct a lot of stuff...but still.....

I left for North Carolina once for a year. NC was/is a great state. But I like CA because I feel like this is where the action is. Of course some of this is an illusion....the "action" might consist of getting off the freeway for a while and going to Starbucks.

On the other hand, I love the sierras. I love Sequoia Park and I know a place I can camp on the river for $10 a night. I love Napa-Sonoma, the LA Basin, El Dorado County, and Auburn. I recently travelled to a little town outside of Redding called IGO which is cute. Then there's Ukiah, San Francisco, Stinson Beach, Russian River, San Diego, Coronado, Monterey, Big Sur, and ON AND ON AND ON.

Every day I get up and think how lucky I am to be here. No joke; it's great.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by bluewatergirl888

Why is it that the school systems are so bad in California?

California ranks near the bottom of the country in per pupil spending, e.g. we spend around $7800 per pupil, while N.Y. spends about $14,000, New Jersey $13,800, CT $11,500, etc (2005 data). It didn't used to be this way. Much has changed since CA public schools were ranked near the top of the nation. It can't all be due to Prop 13; undoubtedly there are other factors.

[115db]

It depends on who you ask. Of course everyone is going to have their own personal input of where they live, which is fine. But no matter where you live, there will be no escape from weather issues, or crime, or air quality issues. But the main thing is, these issues too, depend on what part of any state you live in, too. Calif can be gorgeous, but there are the slums just like anywhere else. Nevada can be pretty, but again, what part of Nevada. Colorado, the Carolinas, all pretty in many ways, but again, they too have their issues, depending on what part of the state.

[Sassberto]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

California ranks near the bottom of the country in per pupil spending, e.g. we spend around $7800 per pupil, while N.Y. spends about $14,000, New Jersey $13,800, CT $11,500, etc (2005 data). It didn't used to be this way. Much has changed since CA public schools were ranked near the top of the nation. It can't all be due to Prop 13; undoubtedly there are other factors.

Check out the property tax bill of a house in CT, NY, or NJ and you will see why.

Smithtown NY, 500k house, 15k/yr taxes. Much of NYC-commutable CT is now at the 1k/mo mark. Most of suburban NJ and LI is at the 1k+/mo mark. That money mostly goes to local schools.

They keep it nice by pricing out anyone who can't pay those taxes, and with heavy NIMBY-ism that prevents any low-income or apartment housing from being built. The northeast is a very segregated place, much moreso than California. Property taxes are one of the primary instruments of that segregation. These are places where the residents are willing to pay a tax for better schools. They have been doing it that way for 60 years. Despite all the complaining about schools by SoCal residents, if put to a vote, 90% would turn it down.

San Diego County voted down a fire protection tax in 2004, ONE YEAR after the Cedar fire decimated several suburban communities. Last year a firestorm of much larger proportions absolutely destroyed large sections of San Diego County. Now, it is becoming clear that the only way to raise the money for the type of fire system we need is to raise a tax. The IDEA of re-visiting the fire protection tax is treated like a political football. With attitudes like this, how is it a surprise that schools, hospitals, roads, and other critical infrastructure is underserved?

LA, SF are in better shape than San Diego but all of thsoe cities - LA in particular - have big infrastructure problems that are the result of 50+ years of deferring maintenance, running on minimal service levels, pursuing this conservative fantasy that a city can be run cheaply as long as everyone behaves. Unfortunately 32 million people later that fantasy has turned quite sour. LA seems to be waking up out of it's daze, building mass transit and wind farms, starting to truly crack down on crime, etc.., SF is so expensive now it hardly matters, and San Diego is "Enron by the Sea".

[ArizonaBear]

I am going to chime in here:

Note I am a Wash DC/NoVa native; left that cesspool 30 years ago and have yet to return even for a visit------the weather alone is not acceptable. Couple that overpriced housing and overcrowding------forget it.

Moved to Calif in 1978 then would up here in Arizona. Suffice to say; I am giving hard consideration to returning within 1-2 years if things deteriorate much more here in the Phx area (again, too big now). Difference is the Yucca Valley area is definitely on my radar.......drove through there 2 years ago-------and felt the 'Old School' laid back Calif vibe of another era when i stopped off at several businesses.

If anything: Phx, Arizona is being more and more of a bad carachiture (sp) of SoCal------and, I am not referring to just the plastic BS either.

[sheri257]

"Is California A Good Place to Live Anymore?"

Yes ... this is what we did today ...

Drove over to Santa Cruz, stopped for some muffins at a cafe with live music, a creek with running water nearby.

Cruised over to the boardwalk ... checked out a few of the rides. Took the ski lift ride with a gorgeous view of the coast, strolled along the beach where everybody was playing volleyball.

Then drove over to Big Basin, took a gorgeous hike along the redwood trails ... absolutely stunning. Then drove over to Moss Landing, had a late lunch on the water with fresh seafood ... delicious.

Next weekend we're going back to Moss Landing for a wildlife boat tour so we can see the sea otters, seals, etc. up close. Will probably go back to Big Basin for a more extensive redwoods hike so we can see the waterfalls.

The weather was perfect ... 60-80 degrees depending on where we went.

I'm sorry but this is what life is supposed to be ... paradise.

[goodgirl49]

Originally Posted by Baron von Costume

I don't think it's quite so rosy as that. The problems in the schools I know are not restricted to those with a lot of ESL kids, and go way, way beyond poor test scores. Test scores are just the most obvious measure of how bad the schools are.

In one man's opinion (me ), the problems of the California schools, at least in the SF Bay area, arise because:

1) Proposition 13 and its offspring have shifted the tax burden away from homeowners and, more importantly, business property owners. This means that large capital projects - upgrading/repairing buildings, for example - MUST be done with massive bonds and borrowing, and gets put off until the bills are huge.

2) Too many non-English speakers (as Charles says) puts an enormous strain on what can be taught in the classes, and strains the already stretched budgets.

3) Lowered/watered down standards on academic performance, and the forcing into schools of non-academic programmes (basically, social work)

4) Bad parenting that is part of a larger cultural slide, as well as the fact that the cost of living is just so damned high, parents need to work more and thus have less time for their childrens' academics.

Isn't New Jersey an expensive place to live with high taxes? Is the cost of living so much less there than CA?

[CA central coast]

Although, I may retire out of state. With all things considered, CA is best place to live period. I defy someone to tell me different. Remember, I said all things considered.