Should California split into multiple states? (Los Angeles, San Diego: move, offices, residency)

[majoun]

Originally Posted by robertjohnson

The U.S. constitution forbids all states except Texas from doing this.

WRONG.
Texas has a provision in its Constitution that it can split into five states. Although the problem with Texas splitting up is that all the resulting states would argue over who'd get the Alamo.

The US Constitution does NOT forbid the division of states ; besides California there are also to my knowledge movements to break up New York and Florida. The NYC statehood movement has been around since the 1860s in some form ; more recently a Long Island statehood movement has emerged.

[Franklyn]

Originally Posted by Bunjee

Remember too that if we split California up, then those far outposts of rough independence lose their wallets. Time and again, when the state has had budget shortfalls it's called upon the big cities--LA, SF, SD--to tighten their belts, all the while taking revenues from them. And the cities have responded, time and again. So if anyone outside the MSAs feels so put-upon by them to want to split, be careful what you wish for.

Sorry, that thinking is so backwards that I can't let it pass. For more than three decades the south state - think of a line drawn pretty much east-west through the Tehachapi's - has drawn double tax revenue over the north. The gas tax share split is just one example. In other words whatever the ratio is, such as per mile, or dollar, or person, or whatever - the south gets twice as much as the rest of the state. Anyone who thinks LA is paying their own way on anything has been watching far too much "reality" TV or reading a "newspaper". Need to find an unbiased source for your news.

[RobE]

So if California does split into two or three, then other states may follow suit. Before you know it, America ends up looking like early Greece or the Holy Roman Empire.

[krock1dk]

There seems to be some confusion wheather or not the US Consitution allows states to be split up. FACT: The Consitution only forbids states from either leaving the Union OR giving up part of their territory to another state. No where does it forbid any state(s) from seprating itself.

Look at the cases of Virginia and Ohio and Michigan. After the Civil War, the western counties of VA seperated from the rest of the state to become the new state of West Virginia. The issue was primarily over slavery. Second, there was a dispute between the Michigan territory and Ohio in 1803 when it became a state. When OH entered the Union it took the 'Toledo Strip' from the Michigan Territory, and the US congress then gave the Upper Peninsula of WI to the Michigan Territory.

Yes, states can seperate!

[calforme]

There is a fixed group of people ruining the state and the only way to correct the problem it is for the 2 groups to go there own way. The "usefull idiots" can run there state compleatly into the ground and the rest of us can get our state in order.

[Franklyn]

Originally Posted by RobE

So if California does split into two or three, then other states may follow suit. Before you know it, America ends up looking like early Greece or the Holy Roman Empire.

Well that's always a possibility, but if state governance is working well there is probably little pressure for "change". So I'll let other states worry about themselves.

In CA governance is now akin to a comic opera. For well over two decades the legislature has gerrymandered the state in such a way that the likelihood of either party loosing an election has become nil.The result is elected representatives have little impetus to actually represent the best interests of the entire state in order to be re-elected, just their own district. So special interests - of all stripes - have more clout in Sacramento than ordinary citizens. And that state of affairs has gone on for over 12 years. Is it any wonder then that the citizenry are mumbling about ways to change the system?

Here's another thing. On the east coast one can easily drive through four or five states, or more, in less than a day. Each of those "states" has two senators in DC. In CA we can drive through LA, Orange, Riverside and San Bernardino counties - with similar numbers of residents - in about the same time period and they are "represented" by one shared senator. Eight or ten to one. Doesn't seem fair. And too many voters see little hope of honest change.

In my book frustration like that than can lead to more desperate measures. So talking here about splitting the state is better than frustrated or frantic actions out on the street.

For me, I think a three-way split is best. Tehachapi east-west line for SoCal. The Coast Range up to and including Santa Rosa and Napa for WestCal, and all the rest for NorCal. And even this would put me in the "wrong" state, but would be a fairer way to go.

Another source of ceding CA is too large is Wikipedia. Their section on "Mountain Ranges of California" is so huge they divide it three ways. SoCal, NorCal and UpstateCal.

[KarlaT2]

Originally Posted by la_fuerza

I agree. Nice places like Eureka and Arcata have lots of beautiful redwood trees and abundant rainfall, and friendly down to earth people. They should not be dragged down with the rest of California. Let's send the top 1/3 of California to the Pacific Northwest where it belongs so it can be free at last!

Excellent idea. Northern California does remind me of my home state of Oregon with all those beautiful trees.

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Other - split it quasi meridianally. The coastal, more urbanized parts would become "The Socialist People's Republic of Kalifornia" and the rest would simply remain California.

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Of course, San Diego and Orange Counties would remain part of California. Imperial County would be sold back to Mexico.

[Franklyn]

This may or may not be of interest to anybody - and I'm not recommending it - I'm just saying: If San Bernardino, Riverside, Orange, San Diego and Imperial counties were ever to form a single state, the result would be:

• Regularly shaped with even, well defined borders
• By area the 38th largest US state
• By population the 8th largest US state

And the absence of those five counties would not change California's ranking for area or population among the other states.

In fact, the area and population of a state formed by those counties would just about equal that of Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island and New Jersey - combined. Seven states. Go figure.