California Government Not Bloated? (Sacramento, Davis: sales, 2009, credit)

[NewToCA]

Interesting article for those who consider the state to have excess employees, and for those folks to be overly compensated. A couple of "facts" from the article:

- California in 2007 had 103 full-time equivalent state employees for every 10,000 residents, second-lowest in the nation behind Illinois' 97

- The average payout by the California Public Employees' Retirement System to retirees is about $27,600 per year


State Worker: How pay, pensions stack up - Sacramento Politics - California Politics | Sacramento Bee

[18Montclair]

I've known that for a while.

Even our spending on social programs is not really that much. In fact, Gray Davis cut much of it before Arnold even came into office. Davis actually spent less on such programs than Pete Wilson.

Our biggest spending by far is education and law enforcement.

[hoffdano]

So where is all the money going considering total taxes are among the highest in the US?

[bhcompy]

new spending has increased dramatically since the late 90s. It's part of the reason Davis was recalled. Spending increased so much during the Tech boom and there was no safety valve for when the bubble burst. Since then, voters have continually added 10s of billions every election cycle through propositions through bonds. I wouldn't be surprised if half the tax income went to debt service with the amount of bonds we've sold in the past decade

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Someone is cooking books, parsing and issuing propaganda, being lapped up by lib biased MSM. Same deal with all the "we are going to decimate fire, police, child healthcare, poison control" scare mongering. They are trying to manipulate the vast uneducated herd into asking for:
1) Even higher income taxes
2) Even higher corporate taxes
3) Overturning Prop 13 if not formally, de facto

The Sac Bee has been leading the charge, shouting from the roof tops "baaaaaaad voters! Now you are going to be sorrrrry!"

[NewToCA]

Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly

Someone is cooking books, parsing and issuing propaganda, being lapped up by lib biased MSM. Same deal with all the "we are going to decimate fire, police, child healthcare, poison control" scare mongering. They are trying to manipulate the vast uneducated herd into asking for:
1) Even higher income taxes
2) Even higher corporate taxes
3) Overturning Prop 13 if not formally, de facto

The Sac Bee has been leading the charge, shouting from the roof tops "baaaaaaad voters! Now you are going to be sorrrrry!"

While I agree that I would like to see a more comprehensive budget overview and analysis, I disagree that folks are "cooking the books". I'm sure stuff like consultants, contractors, operating support by non-state folks and other stuff might shed some more light here, however I believe the information printed in the story by the Bee.

The vast uneducated herd, as you refer to them in your posting, certainly have a point about the tax concerns. I believe that we are in the top 10 states in terms of tax revenue per person.

[wburg]

Originally Posted by hoffdano

So where is all the money going considering total taxes are among the highest in the US?

California's state taxes are around 13th highest in the US--high, but not the highest. According to the state budget summary (here):
http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/Budget...getSummary.pdf
the biggest chunks of the budget go to education, public health, transportation and corrections. We're a big state that needs a lot of highways, we have a lot of people so we need a lot of schools and hospitals, and a whole lot of prisons.

Debt service is about 5% of the state budget.

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Why would a bigger state need a higher tax burden for a lower level of service than most states? The big state theory falls apart.

[bhcompy]

Originally Posted by wburg

California's state taxes are around 13th highest in the US--high, but not the highest. According to the state budget summary (here):
http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/Budget...getSummary.pdf
the biggest chunks of the budget go to education, public health, transportation and corrections. We're a big state that needs a lot of highways, we have a lot of people so we need a lot of schools and hospitals, and a whole lot of prisons.

Debt service is about 5% of the state budget.

I can't find the numbers in there, but according to the Tax Foundation they are wrong. Tax Foundation has California 6th in tax burden as of 08, which does not include new Sales tax increases and Income tax increases(as well as the huge reduction in dependent tax credit).

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/s...-200808073.pdf

And Statemaster shows just how large the burden is. We are the number one state in total tax dollars(state and federal), and pay nearly double the next state(New York).

Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitors sites is not allowed

Now if you want to break it down into the 3 main taxes(Property, Income, Sales):

Property tax:
10th in median $ amt
15th in percentage of income paid towards

Sales tax:
5th in average sales tax rate(state + average local tax as of 7/08)
13th in $ amt per capita(general sales tax)

Income tax:
6th per capita in $
5th per household in $
2nd highest state income tax amt(10.55%, 1mill+ bracket)
easily the highest middle class income tax rate at 9.55% from 47k and up

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/p...7-20080923.pdf
http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/salestaxmap.pdf
http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/g...7-20090205.pdf
http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/i...6-20090205.pdf
http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/s...s-20090519.pdf

Our taxes are pretty high, higher than 13th(going by total state and local tax burden we were 6th last year), and we pay the most in the nation but are shorted at the federal level making us a donor state instead of a receiver state when it comes to federal funds going back into the state. That ups the tax burden as well, without actually reflecting it on paper.

For comparison, the next most populous state is 43rd in total tax state tax burden(Texas) and is stealing a lot of our business/industry and middle class because of it.

[NewToCA]

Originally Posted by bhcompy

I can't find the numbers in there, but according to the Tax Foundation they are wrong. Tax Foundation has California 6th in tax burden as of 08, which does not include new Sales tax increases and Income tax increases(as well as the huge reduction in dependent tax credit).

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/s...-200808073.pdf

A couple of things might actually be in California's favor in this analytical discussion though.

First off, capital gains and bonuses are substantially smaller this past year, especially for many upper income households, potentially significantly lowering a lot of folks income tax burdens.

Second, property values have substantially declined, and property taxes decline in lockstep with the values. Unlike Prop 13, the decrease can exceed a 2% adjustment from prior year property taxes, so with many properties declining over 30% (some substantially more), the property taxes are much lower. Many other states don't provide this benefit.