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Old 07-08-2009, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
11,930 posts, read 11,419,953 times
Reputation: 7186
Quote:
Originally Posted by City Boy View Post
Yeah because everybody has the same opportunities growing up where they can say gee if I just work harder I'll get out of this situation.
This has been true forever! The minimum wage wasn't the answer and shouldn't be.

There will always be people who have no more desire than it takes to be working the lowest kinds of jobs. Doesn't mean their pay needs to be enough to live on.
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Old 07-08-2009, 03:49 PM
 
Location: Joplin, Missouri
633 posts, read 818,382 times
Reputation: 242
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffdano View Post
This has been true forever! The minimum wage wasn't the answer and shouldn't be.

There will always be people who have no more desire than it takes to be working the lowest kinds of jobs. Doesn't mean their pay needs to be enough to live on.

It is important to not think that low paying (min wage) jobs are only held by those with no desire. I take my hat off to those that despite the hardship, they get up and go to work every day instead of just give up and chose to be victims and not to work.

Until we have experienced another persons life and circumstances, we cannot say that everyone has the same opportunities. In this economy many opportunities have temporarily (hopefully) disappeared. In many places, the real opportunity is having a job...period.
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:00 PM
 
Location: San Diego
16,726 posts, read 12,393,433 times
Reputation: 5738
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
For better or worse, California is part of the Global Economy.

As long as a business has the option to relocate and California makes it harder to run a business... I do not see the trend reversing.

Moving can be as simple as across the State Line or to another country...

We pay a premium to live here and the emphasis is premium... business needs to be competitive to survive.

Just last week, I had to spend time and phone calls registering my facility as exempt when the State sent a multi page questionnaire and the cost to register was $150.

Lots of small businesses get to the point where the frustration is no longer worth the effort and close-up shop.

Compliance is no longer getting zoning approval from your local city... it also entails county, state, federal and many special districts... such as water, sanitation and air quality management... to name a few.

Anyone want to buy a wood fired pizza oven? The business next door has tried for years to get permits to operate one... other restaurants in the city have them and use them... the city now has moratorium and my neighbor has one and can't use it...

California is known for surfing... the last family owned surf board blank maker found it impossible to continue because the cost of meeting new regulations on an existing business far exceeded the profit of their small enterprise.
Wood fired pizza oven? Oh man I was gonna build one, how much?
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:04 PM
 
Location: San Diego
16,726 posts, read 12,393,433 times
Reputation: 5738
Quote:
Originally Posted by City Boy View Post
Hey don't be sorry you make good points, but who do you blame for hiring them? If any illegals are working in hospitals it's doing the jobs that pay the least that most people would not want to do. I actually have never seen any "Illegals" working in the hospital. I work in a hospital.

Fast food etc, how do you know they are illegal? Latinos are the largest population here many are in poverty, just become some Mexicans work at fast food places does not mean they are illegals. It's just the numbers, Texas is the same way.
There are 3 million in CA. What do you think they are doing? All working in the fields? Are social services that easy to obtain that they don't have to work but live off the Govt? They are all "retired" wealthy S of the border migrants living out the golden years on life long earnings?. Seriously, where do you think they are working?

It's too easy to use a stolen social to obtain a job. Let's not be blind about this. What exactly are 3 million Illegals doing to get by day to day?
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:43 PM
 
13,132 posts, read 23,443,330 times
Reputation: 7389
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
Wood fired pizza oven? Oh man I was gonna build one, how much?
I'll let you know if it's still available...

The Bay Area has several Italian Restaurants that use wood fired ovens... and these places do a very good business.

Here's a link to one in my area and half way down the menu you will find - Wood Fired Pizza -

http://www.paradisosanleandro.com/menus.htm

Last edited by Ultrarunner; 07-08-2009 at 08:30 PM..
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:51 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
11,930 posts, read 11,419,953 times
Reputation: 7186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mollym313 View Post
It is important to not think that low paying (min wage) jobs are only held by those with no desire. I take my hat off to those that despite the hardship, they get up and go to work every day instead of just give up and chose to be victims and not to work.

Until we have experienced another persons life and circumstances, we cannot say that everyone has the same opportunities. In this economy many opportunities have temporarily (hopefully) disappeared. In many places, the real opportunity is having a job...period.
So a person who bags groceries or empties trash cans, whether a high school kid or not, deserves to earn a wage higher than the job deserves?

I'm sorry but I disagree with you. It has to be possible for an employer to offer an entry level job to people who are willing to work for the money offered. It is completely reasonable for SOME jobs to pay less than is enough to live on.
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Old 07-08-2009, 07:58 PM
 
Location: lala land
1,581 posts, read 1,907,016 times
Reputation: 1050
Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
There are provisions for legal immigration for asylum. Beyond that, illegal immigration is a crime, plain and simple. I dare you to illegally enter, just to pick an example, Mexico. Tell you what, you go and do that, a report back to this forum on your experience, assuming you live to tell the tale.
How would I illegally enter Mexico ? All you have to do is drive over the border. Obviously you have never been to Rosarito. I pitty you.

Okay BillyBob, let me give you a hypothetical situation. Let's say the US economy totally collapses. I mean you can't buy a loaf of bread for $15, ok? You are eating canned tuna (or maybe cat food depending on your budget) with crackers every night of the week. You are married with a wife and 3 kids. You are trying to figure out what to do, but the only places hiring pay just enough so you can buy more canned tuna and nothing else. You have resorted to rationing toilet paper, and your youngest child is now in cloth diapers.

The US is in the crapper, Mexico is in the crapper, most of the world is in the crapper. But wait, there is your neighbor to the north who is doing just fine! Canada. The only industrial country on this side of the globe with an economy still intact. Many Americans are desperate to get into Canada. And you are too, but you decide to try the "legal" way first. Well, much to your dismay, the cost of even filing an application is worth more than your whole family makes in three years. What to do, what to do. You are worried about your son turning to a life of crime, or becoming a victim of the local crime groups. And what about your eldest daughter? What will happen to her? Will she end up like so many young women on the streets?

But wait ... you have a friend. He can get you into Canada and get you set up with a job. Maybe you can get across and then send for your family. But (gasp) that would be ... illegal . You can't do anything illegal can you? Can't break a law to provide for your family. Maybe even get your wife to a doctor because she has been sick lately. You can't even afford aspirin, let alone have her see a doctor. No not you HillBilly. You could never break a law. Not even for your own family. What a pillar of nobility and lawfullness you are.

Last edited by AllAboutEve; 07-08-2009 at 08:09 PM..
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Old 07-08-2009, 08:11 PM
 
Location: San Diego
16,726 posts, read 12,393,433 times
Reputation: 5738
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I'll let you know if it's still available...

The Bay Area has several Italian Restaurants that use wood fired ovens... and these places do a very good business.

Here's a link to one in my area and half way down the menu you will find
- Wood Fired Pizza -

drat, link no worky
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Old 07-08-2009, 08:16 PM
 
Location: San Diego
16,726 posts, read 12,393,433 times
Reputation: 5738
Quote:
Originally Posted by LizCab44 View Post
How would I illegally enter Mexico ? All you have to do is drive over the border. Obviously you have never been to Rosarito. I pitty you.

Okay BillyBob, let me give you a hypothetical situation. Let's say the US economy totally collapses. I mean you can't buy a loaf of bread for $15, ok? You are eating canned tuna (or maybe cat food depending on your budget) with crackers every night of the week. You are married with a wife and 3 kids. You are trying to figure out what to do, but the only places hiring pay just enough so you can buy more canned tuna and nothing else. You have resorted to rationing toilet paper, and your youngest child is now in cloth diapers.

The US is in the crapper, Mexico is in the crapper, most of the world is in the crapper. But wait, there is your neighbor to the north who is doing just fine! Canada. The only industrial country on this side of the globe with an economy still intact. Many Americans are desperate to get into Canada. And you are too, but you decide to try the "legal" way first. Well, much to your dismay, the cost of even filing an application is worth more than your whole family makes in three years. What to do, what to do. You are worried about your son turning to a life of crime, or becoming a victim of the local crime groups. And what about your eldest daughter? What will happen to her? Will she end up like so many young women on the streets?

But wait ... you have a friend. He can get you into Canada and get you set up with a job. Maybe you can get across and then send for your family. But (gasp) that would be ... illegal . You can't do anything illegal can you? Can't break a law to provide for your family. Maybe even get your wife to a doctor because she has been sick lately. You can't even afford aspirin, let alone have her see a doctor. No not you HillBilly. You could never break a law. Not even for your own family. What a pillar of nobility and lawfullness you are.
No, since your Country hasn't been able to help you in your life time ( You can't even feed yourself) you should have 5 kids, being Catholic means you can look to the Lord for feeding yourself and your 5 kids. That way you can paint yourself into the corner of desperation and you now have an excuse to launch yourself North to the land of the free-bies.

Steal someone's social security number? No problem, you have 5 kids to feed. Great analogy. The US has laws for a reason.
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Old 07-08-2009, 08:21 PM
 
Location: lala land
1,581 posts, read 1,907,016 times
Reputation: 1050
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
No, since your Country hasn't been able to help you in your life time ( You can't even feed yourself) you should have 5 kids, being Catholic means you can look to the Lord for feeding yourself and your 5 kids. That way you can paint yourself into the corner of desperation and you now have an excuse to launch yourself North to the land of the free-bies.

Steal someone's social security number? No problem, you have 5 kids to feed. Great analogy.
Huh ? What did you just say, really? Something about 5 kids, being Catholic and painting - that's all I got .
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