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Old 11-01-2009, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,251 posts, read 14,697,137 times
Reputation: 6464
Default Opinion Piece: The Golden State isn't worth it

It's not surprising, then, that there's an intense debate over which model is more admirable and sustainable. What is surprising is the growing evidence that the low-benefit/low-tax package not only succeeds on its own terms but also according to the criteria used to defend its opposite. In other words, the superior public goods that supposedly justify the high taxes just aren't being delivered.

The Golden State isn't worth it -- latimes.com
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Old 11-01-2009, 03:37 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
11,689 posts, read 10,429,570 times
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I think its clear with the horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush control that no taxes/no benefits does not work. A Republican-run society, where divisiveness is encouraged and preferred, where the good ol boy network flourishes in unregulated bliss, where the poor and disadvantaged can go to hell, where racism is fashionable and a modern form of Jim Crow persists, where sovereign nations that pose no imminent threat are attacked unprovoked, where military is used to the tune of a trillion dollars in wasted, poorly run-ill devised plans to mettle where we don't belong, and so forth, is NOT the way to go.

The biggest problem that this country and this state has is trying to move forward while being dragged down by a Republican party that doesn't fit in modern times or in a progressive society. Republicans/Conservatives/Clueless/Klan/Neocons stink and haven't done a damn thing since Reagan was in office.
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Old 11-01-2009, 03:38 PM
 
13,820 posts, read 11,380,339 times
Reputation: 9736
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
It's not surprising, then, that there's an intense debate over which model is more admirable and sustainable. What is surprising is the growing evidence that the low-benefit/low-tax package not only succeeds on its own terms but also according to the criteria used to defend its opposite. In other words, the superior public goods that supposedly justify the high taxes just aren't being delivered.

The Golden State isn't worth it -- latimes.com
Thanks for posting this. I don't think it will change many peoples' minds though. Probably just preaching to the choir.

I work in the public sector so I'm a beneficiary of the California welfare state mentality. But I have to be honest when I say I see the hypocrisy and short sightedness of the unions. I don't think I will see that pension I'm supposed to get in 15 years.
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Old 11-01-2009, 03:41 PM
 
13,820 posts, read 11,380,339 times
Reputation: 9736
Default Didn't 'ya know the progressives are never wrong?/sarc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexus View Post
I think its clear with the horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush control that no taxes/no benefits does not work. A Republican-run society, where divisiveness is encouraged and preferred, where the good ol boy network flourishes in unregulated bliss, where the poor and disadvantaged can go to hell, where racism is fashionable and a modern form of Jim Crow persists, where sovereign nations that pose no imminent threat are attacked unprovoked, where military is used to the tune of a trillion dollars in wasted, poorly run-ill devised plans to mettle where we don't belong, and so forth, is NOT the way to go.

The biggest problem that this country and this state has is trying to move forward while being dragged down by a Republican party that doesn't fit in modern times or in a progressive society. Republicans/Conservatives/Clueless/Klan/Neocons stink and haven't done a damn thing since Reagan was in office.
To the OP, what'd I tell 'ya???? It's always the Repbulicans' fault no matter how much proof you provide./sarc.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:16 PM
 
13,506 posts, read 24,647,711 times
Reputation: 7789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexus View Post
I think its clear with the horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush control that no taxes/no benefits does not work. A Republican-run society, where divisiveness is encouraged and preferred, where the good ol boy network flourishes in unregulated bliss, where the poor and disadvantaged can go to hell, where racism is fashionable and a modern form of Jim Crow persists, where sovereign nations that pose no imminent threat are attacked unprovoked, where military is used to the tune of a trillion dollars in wasted, poorly run-ill devised plans to mettle where we don't belong, and so forth, is NOT the way to go.

The biggest problem that this country and this state has is trying to move forward while being dragged down by a Republican party that doesn't fit in modern times or in a progressive society. Republicans/Conservatives/Clueless/Klan/Neocons stink and haven't done a damn thing since Reagan was in office.
Excuse me... since when has this country been dominated by Republicans???

Seem to recall sweeping Democratic control of Congress and just look at California... or just about anywhere in the Bay Area...

By the way... I'm not and never have been a Republican...

I just find it so convenient that everything can be blamed on one Man... you would have thought Bush is the Almighty...

As to those "Horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush" no one I know was out of work or worse... the last 12 months have been Horrific from my perspective.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:24 PM
 
3,823 posts, read 3,021,187 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
To the OP, what'd I tell 'ya???? It's always the Repbulicans' fault no matter how much proof you provide./sarc.
I don't think Alexus read the article.


RE the OP, Great read!!

"Between April 1, 2000, and June 30, 2007, an average of 3,247 more people moved out of California than into it every week, according to the Census Bureau."

I guess the Census Bureau didn't get the memo from all of the C-D sunshine pumpers about all of the people still relocating to California in droves.




"Instead, the beneficiaries are the providers of the public services, and certain favored or connected constituencies, rather than the general population."

I have thought this for quite awhile.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:24 PM
 
2,648 posts, read 3,031,942 times
Reputation: 1819
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexus View Post
I think its clear with the horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush control that no taxes/no benefits does not work. A Republican-run society, where divisiveness is encouraged and preferred, where the good ol boy network flourishes in unregulated bliss, where the poor and disadvantaged can go to hell, where racism is fashionable and a modern form of Jim Crow persists, where sovereign nations that pose no imminent threat are attacked unprovoked, where military is used to the tune of a trillion dollars in wasted, poorly run-ill devised plans to mettle where we don't belong, and so forth, is NOT the way to go.

The biggest problem that this country and this state has is trying to move forward while being dragged down by a Republican party that doesn't fit in modern times or in a progressive society. Republicans/Conservatives/Clueless/Klan/Neocons stink and haven't done a damn thing since Reagan was in office.
Did you even read the article? Or just spew these ridiculous ideological talking points w/o thought?

The whole point of the article is people are paying more AND not getting anything for it becuase the self serving gov't employees are sucking up all the tax money:

Quote:
In what respects, then, does California "excel"? California's state and local government employees were the best compensated in America, according to the Census Bureau data for 2006. And the latest posting on the website of the California Foundation for Fiscal Responsibility shows 9,223 former civil servants and educators receiving pensions worth more than $100,000 a year from California's public retirement funds. The "dues" paid by taxpayers in order to belong to Club California purchase benefits that, increasingly, are enjoyed by the staff instead of the members.
So I guess in your world its not ok to screw the people in the name of free enterprise, but it is ok to screw the people as long as the bureacrats get theirs, right?

UIM - Thanks for posting the article. Interesting read.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,251 posts, read 14,697,137 times
Reputation: 6464
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexus View Post
I think its clear with the horrific 8 years this country and the world endured under Conservative and Bush control that no taxes/no benefits does not work. A Republican-run society, where divisiveness is encouraged and preferred, where the good ol boy network flourishes in unregulated bliss, where the poor and disadvantaged can go to hell, where racism is fashionable and a modern form of Jim Crow persists, where sovereign nations that pose no imminent threat are attacked unprovoked, where military is used to the tune of a trillion dollars in wasted, poorly run-ill devised plans to mettle where we don't belong, and so forth, is NOT the way to go.

The biggest problem that this country and this state has is trying to move forward while being dragged down by a Republican party that doesn't fit in modern times or in a progressive society. Republicans/Conservatives/Clueless/Klan/Neocons stink and haven't done a damn thing since Reagan was in office.
I think you're making huge generalizations that are inaccurate and unfair.

Do you really think the current state of affairs in California is good? Long-term, I know the state will survive, but are we really getting the services you think we should get?

Housing is the biggest expense we deal with, but one big reason it's so expensive is because of the government regulations and restrictions on how and where housing is built.

I do wish we could combine the fiscal conservatism of Texas with the social liberalism of California. Unfortunately, with our current system, you either get social and fiscal liberalism with Democrats, or social and fiscal conservatism with Republicans. I'm registered as a Democrat because social liberty is more important to me than fiscal liberty. It's sad that I have to make that choice.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:47 PM
 
Location: Palm Springs, CA
25,251 posts, read 14,697,137 times
Reputation: 6464
Quote:
Originally Posted by OC Investor2 View Post
UIM - Thanks for posting the article. Interesting read.
You're welcome. I'm hoping that maybe with the upcoming governor's race, the Republican candidates won't bow to the wishes of social conservatives, but my guess is that they'll have to if they want to win the primary election.
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Old 11-01-2009, 05:45 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
1,157 posts, read 2,166,800 times
Reputation: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
Unfortunately, with our current system, you either get social and fiscal liberalism with Democrats, or social and fiscal conservatism with Republicans. I'm registered as a Democrat because social liberty is more important to me than fiscal liberty. It's sad that I have to make that choice.
I'm the exact same way. I wonder when people are going to finally wake up and realize that this "choosing the lesser of two evils" political system that we have just doesn't work.
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