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Old 04-07-2010, 03:33 PM
 
14,583 posts, read 12,528,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewToCA View Post
How do you believe she would be different from Brown?

What specific changes do you think she'll make that would have a negative difference in the state?
I'm not optimistic about her. But she will act as a check on union power. It's a sure thing Brown won't.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:42 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
We "are" the government esp in California where we have so much involvement in passing citizen legislation. Personally, I'd rather live in California where the people decide issues rather than some irresponsible state legislatures....
I used to think this way. But I've changed my mind. People make stupid decisions. Every one of these bond measures on the ballot should come with a broad based tax increase attached to pay for them (not just a tax on the rich). I wonder how many people would vote for these things if they really saw how much they personally would have to pay for them.

Furthermore, the ancient Greeks learned that pure democracy was NOT a good idea. It actually leads to a lot of instability because people don't think about the long term implications of their votes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
Anyway, reality is that California does not have enough $ to cover all the programs that voters approved. Like the "bullet" train. Why did California citizens vote for a super-expensive transportation initiative when the state was already in deep debt?
This is actually a typical example of what happens when you have too much direct democracy. See my previous statement.

Furthermore....I wonder how much direct democracy we really have. Would voters have approved the super generous pension plans that most public sector workers get but that few voters get themselves??? Somehow, I doubt it. Where is the voters say on that issue....an issue which is one of the largest factors in the state's long term financial health?????
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:46 PM
 
457 posts, read 612,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
Can anyone ever image governors like they have in Texas & other Southern states ever winning in California? We may have problems but at least California isn't a bunch of idiot rightwing nuts!
I don't think anyone really on the fringes is correct. Most people are fairly well centered when voting. I would at least think so.

Since you seem to be anti right wing what has the "liberal left" given this state or nation? Welfare? Foodstamps/WIC? Medicare? Obamacare? Social Security? <---- sarcasm

People tend to forget who fight and die for this country? Usually it's the more conservative base. I would like to call myself a independent / conservative / patriot / enviormentalist / protector of animals etc. I am not a republican or democrat because they both are substandard. I am not a right wing nut but have core conservative views.

Why do people think it is bad for Poizner to say he is anti illegal immigrants? They are a drain on our economy. Think schools and hospitals. How much better would they be without all of the illegal immigrants draining them of there resources. Everyone who recieves government subsidies who is able to work should work. They can take the low paying labor intinsive jobs the illegal immigrants do. If they don't like that type of work they should apply themselves and try to achieve a higher goal. Everyone in our great nation has the chance to do pretty much what ever it is they want. They just have to apply themselves and work (what a concept) for it. I know we have a large enough lower education / economic class to fill the positions left open by the removal of illegal immigrants. The difficulty will be getting them to work becuase they have been given everything for pretty much their entire life by the government and are usally lazy slobs.

I could go on but I know most of you don't view our nation as I do. It's beautiful out today so I'm going to go enjoy it.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:55 PM
 
Location: LA
6,241 posts, read 12,019,931 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
I'm not optimistic about her. But she will act as a check on union power. It's a sure thing Brown won't.
she may attempt to act as a check on union power, but ahnold also tried going against the unions and had it shoved back in his face through his special election.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:57 PM
 
14,583 posts, read 12,528,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
I agree with you, clongirl. What's funny is that Jerry Brown was probably the governor when Nita lived in California years ago & I'm sure that is not why she moved away! Jerry Brown is a former Catholic seminarian who has studied Zen & lives a very modest lifestyle. When he was governor, Brown drove himself in a beat-up old car & slept on a mattress on the floor. He refused to live in the Governor's Palace but instead rented an apartment near the Capitol. And Brown dated some interesting women including Linda Ronstadt. Even though it really doesn't matter what party a governor is from it is better that they be a Democrat in California since the overwhelming majority in the state assembly & senate are Democrats [and a few Greens who vote with the Democrats]. Democrats, in general, are more concerned about the people & don't get hung-up on stupid Biblebelt issues. Can anyone ever image governors like they have in Texas & other Southern states ever winning in California? We may have problems but at least California isn't a bunch of idiot rightwing nuts!
I don't care for idiot right wing nuts. But I'm not really happy about the idiot left wing nuts we have in the legislature, either. At least the right wing nuts in Texas understand how to balance a budget. And that's what is needed most urgently right now.

You might care to read this article from a left wing professor about how Texas & California both have equally crappy public services...but Texas has much lower taxes. Maybe those "right wing nuts" in Texas could teach us a thing or two.

The Golden State isn't worth it - Los Angeles Times
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:59 PM
 
14,583 posts, read 12,528,188 times
Reputation: 10554
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassberto View Post
I also strongly support large cutbacks of the state payroll, especially rooting out the massive waste and outright fraud in the public sector. A lot of public employees are taking the state for a ride. I don't really like Meg Whitman (actually liked Steve Poizner) but I don't really see how much damage she can actually do at this point.
The biggest problem in the public sector isn't the bloated payroll. It's the massive pension obligations.

Otherwise, I agree with what you're saying.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:05 PM
 
Location: LA
6,241 posts, read 12,019,931 times
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speaking of meg, has anyone read her manifesto? there's an ad banner on the la times website linking you to a site where you can order a free copy.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:08 PM
 
Location: Rolando, San Diego CA 92115
7,173 posts, read 18,572,972 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
The biggest problem in the public sector isn't the bloated payroll. It's the massive pension obligations.

Otherwise, I agree with what you're saying.
It's both. You have prison guards making 200k+. It's a problem.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Bay Area
3,161 posts, read 4,631,183 times
Reputation: 2930
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
Uhhh, no. Not even close. 60 million is a drop in the bucket. Billions are spent on our schools.
It was an exaggeration/joke and not meant to be taken literally.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Earth
12,010 posts, read 13,517,658 times
Reputation: 4124
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRinSM View Post
speaking of meg, has anyone read her manifesto? there's an ad banner on the la times website linking you to a site where you can order a free copy.
Given some of Whitman's positions and some of the people associated with her I could not vote for her. She does have some good positions but despite her "union busting" rhetoric is just as captive to the prison guards' union as Davis and Wilson (her campaign manager) and much more so than Arnold.

However if she came out in favor of marijuana legalization I could vote for her.
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