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Old 04-30-2010, 11:14 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
5,635 posts, read 6,960,883 times
Reputation: 6384
OK, now go check back a little further into Hawaiian history than Queen Liliuokalani. There's plenty to read up on just by reading about King Kamehameha alone. Do you know what some 'heiaus' were used for?
Come back after your reading and tell me there weren't bloodthirsty land grabs and wholesale slaughter of innocents.
The reason you have protests in favor of "illegals" is due to the pansification of this country. Where else in the world do people question the legitimacy of the sovereignty of their own nation?
Let's just follow your argument that anyone belongs here who wants to be here....
Let's just make an announcement to the world and say, "Whoever you are, wherever you are, come on down and join us". Let's not screen anyone either because that would be racist. Let in "America haters" because that will add to the diversity of the population...and we need to have all points of views. Let's invite Al Qaeda and sing Kumbaya around great big bonfires. Let's not exclude cannibals and cultists and furry and exotic livestock from all corners of the globe.

 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:17 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
5,635 posts, read 6,960,883 times
Reputation: 6384
Quote:
If the US can grab other people's lands
Damned few countries in the history of the planet that haven't grabbed land or usurped some indigenous group. Do you think the U.S. has a monopoly on this?
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:24 PM
 
4,184 posts, read 3,835,132 times
Reputation: 1681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
OK, now go check back a little further into Hawaiian history than Queen Liliuokalani. There's plenty to read up on just by reading about King Kamehameha alone. Do you know what some 'heiaus' were used for?
Come back after your reading and tell me there weren't bloodthirsty land grabs and wholesale slaughter of innocents.
The reason you have protests in favor of "illegals" is due to the pansification of this country. Where else in the world do people question the legitimacy of the sovereignty of their own nation?
Let's just follow your argument that anyone belongs here who wants to be here....
Let's just make an announcement to the world and say, "Whoever you are, wherever you are, come on down and join us". Let's not screen anyone either because that would be racist. Let in "America haters" because that will add to the diversity of the population...and we need to have all points of views. Let's invite Al Qaeda and sing Kumbaya around great big bonfires. Let's not exclude cannibals and cultists and furry and exotic livestock from all corners of the globe.
Hahaha....so now you justify the invasion and annexation of Hawaii by saying "the natives are barbarians, they are killing each other, we may as well invade them"? How cute! You swallowed the entire justification for the colonialism and imperialism that has destroyed much of the world.
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:27 PM
 
4,184 posts, read 3,835,132 times
Reputation: 1681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
Damned few countries in the history of the planet that haven't grabbed land or usurped some indigenous group. Do you think the U.S. has a monopoly on this?
That's why I said "all is fair". The "illegal aliens" are merely grabbing back the land that belonged to their ancestors. Stop whining and accept that "what you have done unto others will be done unto you".
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:28 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
5,635 posts, read 6,960,883 times
Reputation: 6384
Point out the justification. I'm refuting your ridiculous accusation that white Americans are the scourge of the planet.
Let's also get back to the land-grabbing Americans....What was the ultimate outcome of the Spanish-American War? Tell us what happened with the lands occupied by Spain. What did those bada$$ Americans do?
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:33 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
5,635 posts, read 6,960,883 times
Reputation: 6384
One more thing...since, according to you, the USA has no right to expect a reasonable political sovereignty, do you personally go abroad to other countries and pizz in their cornflakes because you believe you have that right? Do you say, "This is Japan, so what? I have every right to live and work where I please?"
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:34 PM
 
4,184 posts, read 3,835,132 times
Reputation: 1681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
Point out the justification. I'm refuting your ridiculous accusation that white Americans are the scourge of the planet.
Let's also get back to the land-grabbing Americans....What was the ultimate outcome of the Spanish-American War? Tell us what happened with the lands occupied by Spain. What did those bada$$ Americans do?
Sure. Take the Philippines for example. The Americans kicked Spain out of the Philippines. Then the Americans promptly committed genocide on 1.4 million Filipinos during the pacification campaigns. Philippine–American War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All in the name of Manifest Destiny.
 
Old 04-30-2010, 11:42 PM
 
4,184 posts, read 3,835,132 times
Reputation: 1681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
One more thing...since, according to you, the USA has no right to expect a reasonable political sovereignty, do you personally go abroad to other countries and pizz in their cornflakes because you believe you have that right? Do you say, "This is Japan, so what? I have every right to live and work where I please?"
Since the US doesn't respect the sovereignty of other nations (it intervenes in the internal affairs of other nations overtly and covertly), why should you expect others to turn the other cheek? You reap what you sow.

Speaking of Japan, why does the US still have a military base in Okinawa? Why can't the US give that back to the Japanese?

Land grabbers.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:37 AM
 
Location: The High Seas
5,635 posts, read 6,960,883 times
Reputation: 6384
Quote:
the US doesn't respect the sovereignty of other nations (it intervenes in the internal affairs of other nations overtly and covertly)
I can't think of any nation that has been a world power or even a minor power that has not been guilty of the above statement, have you? China? Russia? even Morocco?
The Spanish-American War was the emergence of the US as a world power. In the final analysis, two countries resulted from being taken from Spain's political power: Cuba and the Philippines. You cite one, why not cite the other? "In 1916 the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 1934, and eventual independence in 1946."
McKinley embodied Manifest Destiny outside the limits of North America, yet for some reason, autonomy was granted to the Philippines and more immediately with the Teller Amendment for Cuba.
But, this is the rationale you use for why a nation's borders should not be respected? I guess your argument, to be fair, goes like this: Any country that has taken land should not have their own sovereignty respected? Then, you should equally disrespect the sovereignty of any nation on this planet because you won't find a one that has not "taken land". To the credit of the U.S., debate on the right or wrong of annexation has always taken place at the highest political levels. You wouldn't find much of that in China today.
How do Tibetan independence rallies fare there?
 
Old 05-01-2010, 10:41 AM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
7,326 posts, read 3,876,844 times
Reputation: 4321
"There was a time when our people covered the land as the waves of a wind-ruffled sea.... that time has long since passed... I will not mourn..." - Chief Seattle
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