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Old 05-30-2010, 11:43 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 17,443,656 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smh1 View Post
It depends on who you target. Someone owning a 7/11 or a 4plex may decide this is too much. But for someone like Chevron making a couple of billions in net and big apt complex firms that have hundreds of apts, it is really not that much of a difference.
It could be a huge difference, the taxes are going to hit profits which are just a small fraction of gross revenue. But energy companies are usually locked into an area, so they are not really the sort that can up and leave in the first place.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smh1 View Post
I worked in IT mostly, so most people who lost their jobs lost it to India. We don't do that much trade with India-but we are still at a big deficit and have been for a while-I wouldn't exactly call it balanced.
You may want to actually look at the numbers, the us exports around $17 billion annually to India. The US imports around $20 in Indian products/services so there is a bilateral deficit. But bilateral deficits don't matter, overall there is little to no deficit with India. The current trade deficit in the US is around 60% due to oil and the other 40% is due to China.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smh1 View Post
So they are exporting tires and we are exporting chickens??
Actually I believe it was chicken feet, something that is popular in Asian cuisine but at best used in animal food in the US. US companies were "dumping" chicken feet at prices nobody in China could compete with.

In reality this is the great thing about global trade though, the Chinese get their chicken feet at lower prices and we get someone in return at lower costs than we could produce it here.

Anyhow, California needs to take some notes from Texas. I'm by no means the only way suggesting this either, Meg Whitman has explicitly noted that California should copy some of Texas' business reforms. Prop 13 is the "sacred cow" though, so I doubt anybody is going to change that.
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Old 05-30-2010, 11:55 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 17,443,656 times
Reputation: 4321
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I would love to get a 5% bump each year... for the last 3 years... wages and rents have been flat.
I said 5% maximum, it would work just like the current system but with a higher maximum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I can honestly say that poverty was no where to be found... part of the reason is people didn't have the fixation to save
I guess you were not looking for it then? Property is all over the place in Europe, more importantly though is that the average European has a lower standard of living than the average American. Of course, some countries are worse than others. Furthermore, property costs in Europe are ridiculously high.

In terms of all your other comments, well you're going to have trouble explaining all the real estate bubbles in Europe.

By the way, high consumption taxes are horrible. Sometimes people forget that economies are driven by production, not holding real estate. Creating disincentives for people to consume and therefore produce goods is a recipe for a stagnant economy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
By the way, I've never held a Real Estate License in any State...
I'm not talking about real estate agents, they don't benefit either way really. I'm talking about real estate investors and you in fact own investment properties. Higher property taxes would eat into your bottom line, naturally you are going to go against them.
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Old 05-31-2010, 12:04 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
206 posts, read 359,695 times
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The trade deficit is a little more than that. Here are the numbers from the census bureau. exports 16.426 billion imports 21.176 billions. So about a 4 billion + deficit.

In today's world, I don't think we can go back to an isolationist economy. But we got to do something about our current state? 40 million people are getting food stamps-I am sorry but that sounds more like third world conditions, if 1 in 7 need food assistance. There are so many qualified people desparate for a job and yet in China, they actually are having trouble recruiting qualified staff-labour shortages in a country of 1 billion!

To me the trend is what worries me. That China actually for the first time achieved a surplus in high tech stuff with the US. That China is actually competing to win the high speed railway project in CA and if they win, they will be providing techonlogy and engineers and we will be providing (gasp) labour. The irony of ironies. Now China is supposed to be in a massive real estate bubble-so we will see how that goes. But otherwise my personal view in business is any system is good as long as it benefits us-if it is killing us, we have to make changes so that we benefit again..

Now TX, the jury is out. Till last year, maybe. But now all of a sudden they seem to be surprised by a massive deficit of their own. We will have to see if this deficit is a flash in the pan or just the start of massive deficits for some time to come.
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Old 05-31-2010, 12:14 AM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
I said 5% maximum, it would work just like the current system but with a higher maximum.
5% Maximum would be a 150% increase over the 2% current Maximum.


Quote:
I guess you were not looking for it then? Property is all over the place in Europe, more importantly though is that the average European has a lower standard of living than the average American. Of course, some countries are worse than others. Furthermore, property costs in Europe are ridiculously high.
Of course Property is all over the place in Europe... Show me a Swiss person with a low standard of living and chances are drugs are involved.

I guess it would also depend on how you define the standard... minimum 6 weeks of vacation even with entry level jobs... no health care cost worries... a collegue that I worked with decided to start her family shortly after I was back in California... she received 80% of her pay for 2 years on maternity leave, had a second child extending it another 2 years and then had a third extending it again to the maximum of 6 years... all the while getting paid AND her company was required to keep her position... doesn't quite sound like poverty to me...

Quote:
In terms of all your other comments, well you're going to have trouble explaining all the real estate bubbles in Europe.
So far, no trouble at all... European Banks were sending money our way like there was no tomorrow... the newspapers continually said things like... what could be safer than investing in U.S. property??? In general... I was selling... although I did buy the home I have now

Quote:
By the way, high consumption taxes are horrible. Sometimes people forget that economies are driven by production, not holding real estate. Creating disincentives for people to consume and therefore produce goods is a recipe for a stagnant economy.
Food, Shelter and Clothing are the necessities of life... even the courts have ruled such... a new Toyota Prius or Range Rover are not... and I can easily choose not to participate by doing without...


Quote:
I'm not talking about real estate agents, they don't benefit either way really. I'm talking about real estate investors and you in fact own investment properties. Higher property taxes would eat into your bottom line, naturally you are going to go against them.
If I am an Investor... then I am a sorry one The value of my rental properties have dropped to the mid 1980's price wise... I do operate rental property and most of my tenants have been with me since the 90's...

One of the few exceptions to rent control are pass throughs for increased taxes and govermental fees... so higher taxes could very well lead to across the board rent increases industry wide... note: I said that it could... especially when rents are significantly below market.
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Old 05-31-2010, 01:13 AM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Here's a thought... why not get rid of property tax altogether and replace it with a sales tax collected when property is sold... just add 9.75% to the purchase price and be done with it

Won't matter if the property appreciates or depreciates... the tax is due on transfer based on price.

I already pay sales tax on everything I buy for the house anyway... new shingles for the roof... tax paid, concrete for the driveway... tax paid, new paint... tax paid.
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Old 05-31-2010, 02:22 AM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 17,443,656 times
Reputation: 4321
Quote:
Originally Posted by smh1 View Post
The trade deficit is a little more than that. Here are the numbers from the census bureau. exports 16.426 billion imports 21.176 billions. So about a 4 billion + deficit.
I already cited these numbers and stated there was a bilateral trade deficit. But you are ignoring the fact that bilateral deficits don't matter. Take this (made-up) example:

The USA has a deficit of $4 billion with India
India has a deficit of $4 with Australia
Australia has a $4 deficit with the US.

Each country has a bilateral trade deficit with another country, yet overall trade is balanced.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smh1 View Post
40 million people are getting food stamps-I am sorry but that sounds more like third world conditions, if 1 in 7 need food assistance.
No, a 3rd world country is one where 40 million people starve. The number of people on food stamps increases during recessions.

Anyhow, China is no where near the US in terms of technology. The majority of what occurs in China is low-level assembling and few new technologies are coming out of China. Engineering wise they are rather good, but that makes sense. China has been growing and building like mad, where as growth in the US and Europe is much slower. Its great that California is going to use their knowledge with the high speed rail project, that is what global trade is all about.
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Old 05-31-2010, 02:36 AM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 17,443,656 times
Reputation: 4321
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
5% Maximum would be a 150% increase over the 2% current Maximum.
Sure and what is the problem? Having a maximum of 2% does not make sense, inflation is typically higher than that. Instead of a fixed maximum you could instead have a variable maximum based on the rate of inflation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I guess it would also depend on how you define the standard... minimum 6 weeks of vacation even with entry level jobs... no health care cost worries... a collegue that I worked with decided to start her family shortly after I was back in California...
Most European countries have generous social benefits, these benefits reduce everyone's standard of living while eliminating some poverty. But even with these benefits Europe is by no means free of Poverty, the Poverty rates are anywhere from 5~20% depending on the country. In the US its around 15%.

Also, whether its the state of the company providing pay for 2 years for maternity it is ridiculous. People should make financial plans for children, society at large should not be funding people's maternity leave.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
Food, Shelter and Clothing are the necessities of life... even the courts have ruled such... a new Toyota Prius or Range Rover are not...
So what? Economies are driven by production, if you reduce consumption you reduce production. Do you want to live in a society that only provides its people with bare subsistence?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
Here's a thought... why not get rid of property tax altogether and replace it with a sales tax collected when property is sold... just add 9.75% to the purchase price and be done with it
This would hurt the economy, one of the keys of the US economy is worker mobility. This would make it very closely to move and would increase the unemployment rate as a result. One reason why the current unemployment rate is so high is because people are having trouble moving due to having negative equity. That it to say, there are so called geographic mismatches in labor.

Furthermore, this would result in massive real estate speculation. Investors could buy property and do nothing with them for years in the hopes that they increase in price, as a result you'd have under-utilized resources.
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Old 05-31-2010, 04:24 AM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
Reputation: 20413
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Sure and what is the problem? Having a maximum of 2% does not make sense, inflation is typically higher than that. Instead of a fixed maximum you could instead have a variable maximum based on the rate of inflation.
Typically, the annual increase is always maxed in my county... I doubt is would be any different if pegged at 5%.



Quote:
Most European countries have generous social benefits, these benefits reduce every one's standard of living while eliminating some poverty. But even with these benefits Europe is by no means free of Poverty, the Poverty rates are anywhere from 5~20% depending on the country. In the US its around 15%.
The countries where I worked spoke German... I have no frame of reference on non-German areas of Europe. The people I worked with were quite happy and were always telling me the problem with Americans is they are married to their jobs and life is so much more than work.

They certainly have a safety net... medically, it is outstanding for children and young adults... not quite as good for seasoned citizens... medically speaking.

Had a chance to visit a few retirement homes and was very impressed... no one sold the farm or house to get in...

All in all, I was quite comfortable during my time there and have kept in touch with some...

Quote:
Also, whether its the state of the company providing pay for 2 years for maternity it is ridiculous. People should make financial plans for children, society at large should not be funding people's maternity leave.
Austria has or had a big push to up the birthrate... it had fallen below the replacement level... care of expectant Moms and children is outstanding... truly. My collegues thought standard 3 months US maternity leave was simply barbaric Austrian mothers receive a cash payment when they provide a completed immunization record for their child... it's around $1000 and goes strictly to the mother without regard to income...


Quote:
So what? Economies are driven by production, if you reduce consumption you reduce production. Do you want to live in a society that only provides its people with bare subsistence?
Seems someone needs to tell that to Washington and California... There is no denying consumption is persona non grata... Peak Oil, Earth in the Balance, Global Warming... well, you get my point... just like paying surcharges when you go over your baseline water usage, electricity or gas... conservation, reuse, recycle are still the buzz words today.



Quote:
This would hurt the economy, one of the keys of the US economy is worker mobility. This would make it very closely to move and would increase the unemployment rate as a result. One reason why the current unemployment rate is so high is because people are having trouble moving due to having negative equity. That it to say, there are so called geographic mismatches in labor.
You left out those that are taking time off from the job market... I have no idea how wide spread it is... but, I have heard it said more than a few times by people near the end of their unemployment checks that it is time to find a job.

Don't overlook the fact that many people rent and don't have the same constraints... also, there is a relatively new phenomenon of Strategic Defaults... it happens around here. Met a couple that are friends of the in-laws and they bought a home on their same street... it was 200k less than their current mortage. They moved in and defaulted on the first home... both have good jobs and admitted they saw an opportunity and took it.

I think those with negative equity make up the majority of those that move.

Quote:
Furthermore, this would result in massive real estate speculation. Investors could buy property and do nothing with them for years in the hopes that they increase in price, as a result you'd have under-utilized resources.
We always have speculators... doesn't matter if it's commodities, real estate or stocks... Don't forget that a lot of Speculators lost everything... that's why they call it Speculation.

Combating under-utilization of resources sounds like central planning to me.

Investors are those that willingly buy property, carry it at a loss in the hopes of cashing in on appreciation. People no longer count on appreciation and for the savvy, appreciation was only the frosting on the cake...

Return to the system I started with if you really want to keep Real Estate prices in check... 20% down payment plus closing costs, 6 months living expenses in the bank, 2 years on the same job and 3 years in the same field... oh, the house must appraise and have a pest control clearance... speculation will be tempered if the money is harder to get.

Last edited by Ultrarunner; 05-31-2010 at 04:48 AM..
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