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Old 06-04-2012, 11:18 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,011 times
Reputation: 2661

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Quote:
Originally Posted by psulions2007 View Post
The US spends on average a factor of 4 more on healthcare than other western nations.

Canada tops the list of other western nations, but even then the US spends about 3.5 times as much on healthcare.
That is not debatable, the US spends more.

The debate though is how exactly does changing to a single payer instantly lower costs to a reasonable level? Considering that the most efficient systems have multiple payers that leads most people who study this to conclude that the savings cannot be found by reducing payer options.

Overhead savings are a drop in the bucket if you really want to break down why healthcare costs are so high in the US. You also have to look at R&D Investment, Health Status, Income, Ethnicity, Malpractice Insurance, Reimbursement rates and Per capita income if you want a true overview of why costs are what they are.
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Hillsboro, OR
2,200 posts, read 3,795,252 times
Reputation: 1366
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
That is not debatable, the US spends more.

The debate though is how exactly does changing to a single payer instantly lower costs to a reasonable level? Considering that the most efficient systems have multiple payers that leads most people who study this to conclude that the savings cannot be found by reducing payer options.

Overhead savings are a drop in the bucket if you really want to break down why healthcare costs are so high in the US. You also have to look at R&D Investment, Health Status, Income, Ethnicity, Malpractice Insurance, Reimbursement rates and Per capita income if you want a true overview of why costs are what they are.
You're forgetting that socialised healthcare is not-for-profit... i.e. companies like Blue Cross/Blue Shield, Humana, Aetna, and corporate hospital chains who are beholden to shareholders and must make profits do not exist in the single-payer system.
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:24 PM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,011 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by psulions2007 View Post
You're forgetting that socialised healthcare is not-for-profit... i.e. companies like Blue Cross/Blue Shield, Humana, Aetna, and corporate hospital chains who are beholden to shareholders and must make profits do not exist in the single-payer system.
Actually many of those insurance companies and large hospital systems are classified as Non Profit.
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:02 PM
 
701 posts, read 896,976 times
Reputation: 373
All other developed nations have better and cheaper health care for all their citizens than the US.

This is not debatable.
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Old 06-10-2012, 12:33 AM
 
Location: The heart of Cascadia
1,328 posts, read 2,652,268 times
Reputation: 815
Moose eh?
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Old 06-18-2012, 09:14 PM
 
Location: Canada
5,692 posts, read 6,544,693 times
Reputation: 8193
So who has had enough rain already? After a very dry year, a seriously dry spring, it seems we've had nothing but rain in Manitoba for the last 3 weeks. There's no standing water yet, due to how parched the ground here was, and the garden and the fields are looking very good, but I'm getting a little fed up.

And I have some exciting (for me, since I am a dog lover) news to share, since this is a chat thread - my old beagle died in May, and it seems that it is time for another dog (I have 2 German shepherds who are also getting on in years). I had a red heeler years ago and when she died, I couldn't bear to get another heeler but I think I'm finally ready for one. So a new heeler pup will be joining the family around the middle of July and I'll hear the pitter-patter of little feet once again.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:16 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,024 posts, read 10,578,401 times
Reputation: 8913
I just drove home to Niagara Falls from Moose Jaw and man it seemed like a long way. Just 2900 Km, I mean that's not THAT far but it sure seemed it. I'm just getting old I guess. Anyway, I didn't see to many critters along the way, 2 moose, one fox and a beaver. I have often seen a lot more on that route including wolves, bears, coyotes and lots of others.
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Old 06-19-2012, 06:10 AM
 
3,060 posts, read 7,164,852 times
Reputation: 3260
Quote:
Originally Posted by netwit View Post
So who has had enough rain already? After a very dry year, a seriously dry spring, it seems we've had nothing but rain in Manitoba for the last 3 weeks. There's no standing water yet, due to how parched the ground here was, and the garden and the fields are looking very good, but I'm getting a little fed up.

And I have some exciting (for me, since I am a dog lover) news to share, since this is a chat thread - my old beagle died in May, and it seems that it is time for another dog (I have 2 German shepherds who are also getting on in years). I had a red heeler years ago and when she died, I couldn't bear to get another heeler but I think I'm finally ready for one. So a new heeler pup will be joining the family around the middle of July and I'll hear the pitter-patter of little feet once again.
Sorry to hear about your beagle Netwit. I had never heard of a red heeler before - they look like lovely dogs - be sure to post pictures when you get him (or her)! Red Heeler Information, Pictures of Red Heelers | Dogster
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Old 06-19-2012, 06:45 AM
 
Location: Canada
5,692 posts, read 6,544,693 times
Reputation: 8193
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunshineleith View Post
Sorry to hear about your beagle Netwit. I had never heard of a red heeler before - they look like lovely dogs - be sure to post pictures when you get him (or her)! Red Heeler Information, Pictures of Red Heelers | Dogster
Heelers are also called Australian Cattle dogs and they come in both blue and red colours. The litter I'm looking at has a blue merle mother, and a red heeler for a father. Because I'm on a farm, I was also looking for a dog who would be a good farm dog, and my deceased heeler is a legend around here. When I finished riding (horses), I would hand her the reins and she would lead the horse to the barn. She was something else. I still miss her but enough time has finally passed, where I feel I wouldn't be unfairly comparing a new heeler to my old pooch.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,024 posts, read 10,578,401 times
Reputation: 8913
Not too many posts around here lately. Well today is the first day of my 60th year. Man, the last 20 have flown by so fast. I remember how long the first 16 seemed to take, like a lifetime and a half. Can you remember when the summer vacation seemed to be forever. I sure can. Those lazy hazy days just seemed to go on and on and on.

Well, the wifey took me out to dinner at Jimmy Buffet's Margaritaville to celebrate the occassion. The food gets a B- but the service gets an AAA. It was very good. We then wandered across the road to the Fallsview casino for the very first time. It's done up really nicely with awesome fountains and a really great lobby. Anyway we went in and the wife put ten dollars in a slot machine, pulled the lever and got $60 back. I liked that, it payed exactly for the dinner and the tip. $50.
We walked down to the falls and yep they looked the same as last week when I was last down there. Always amazing though. We walked back to the car and the gate were you pay to get out of the parking lot was stuck in the up position. Another bonus, life is good. If the rest of my new decade is as good as the first day I'm laughing.
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