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Old 04-02-2012, 11:17 AM
 
2 posts, read 3,028 times
Reputation: 15

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I just came up here from the southwest for college (currently a sophomore at University of Toronto), basically because I wanted something totally different and unique as my college experience.

In general I find this city interesting and eclectic, but my real beef is more with the students here as well as the locals. I just don't get it. I come from a city about the same size as Toronto (Phoenix) yet the people are WAY more personable back home. What's up with other students not wanting to socialize before/after class? What's up with the girls totally rejecting my advances? Why does customer service suck so badly? People may hold the door open for you here and say "Pardon me" instead of "HUH?" like we do, but seriously, I'm not impressed with Canadians so far.

On top of that I have seem AMPLE evidence that folks here are just in general less likely to do the right thing for the sake of being a good person. I've seen students totally outcast others - not even acknowledge them in group work, make stupid remarks to make them look bad, etc. - for no good reason. It's like high school all over again except even more immature.

Not to mention, around town here I've seen people in bad situations basically get the cold shoulder from others and especially from businesses. Need change for a $5? Need to use a phone? Have a flat tire? Trying to move something and could use a hand? Don't expect help from ANYONE here because it won't happen.

I'm starting to lose my patience with this place, and fast. I came here admittedly with some preconceived notions - basically a more tolerant, liberal, open-minded, compassionate, and civil populace - but I'm consistently let down with this place.

I recently read something that pretty much explains what I'm saying: [url=http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/miranda-frum/canada-polite_b_934220.html]Miranda Frum: Canadians vs. Americans: The Final Showdown of Manners[/url].

Take heed especially to this:

"Although Americans, generally speaking, may seem loud when out in public, or unapologetic when they run into you in the street, I've found they are more likely to say good morning to you in the elevator, or come more quickly to your aid when you are in some sort of trouble. Manners are better than no manners, of course; but manners are something that can be taught. Actions speak louder than "please."

 
Old 04-02-2012, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
8,608 posts, read 11,104,319 times
Reputation: 10329
You're located in "THE CENTRE OF THE UNIVERSE" it's sort of what's expected in Trawna.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Des Moines, Iowa
2,401 posts, read 3,677,923 times
Reputation: 1434
Not exactly my area of expertise, but I do spend time in the Phoenix area every year to visit my in-laws. Being from Phoenix, I'm sure you have to be aware that this is a big area of the US that many Canadian's come to "winter" every year. In the specific area my in-law's stay I believe that almost 1/3 of the winter residents are from Canada so I have plenty of interactions over the yearss. My first-hand impression is they are pretty much like us.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 01:00 PM
 
34,457 posts, read 41,569,541 times
Reputation: 29927
So i guess you gonna go back to Phoenix and tell all your pals back there what a horrible place Canada is ..You've seen a few negative situations in your brief visit to Toronto and now you're going to paint all Canadians with an undeserved very wide brush.
Personally i see the exact opposite of what you are seeing. Canada? warm friendly place where most people are stress free and etc will give you the shirt off their back.
America? closed minded, paranoid, lots of hate,obsessed with politics.too many nutters with guns.
All depends on your perspective.

Welcome to the forum AmericaninCanada.

Last edited by jambo101; 04-02-2012 at 01:08 PM..
 
Old 04-02-2012, 01:15 PM
 
2 posts, read 3,028 times
Reputation: 15
Maybe I'm just ignorant, but no I've never seen or met any Canadians - as far as I know - back home.

I honestly think I'm just going to transfer to ASU. I just can't deal with it here anymore. I should state, I love the college campus and the quality of the education is excellent.

But everything else... just not feeling it.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,699 posts, read 8,505,851 times
Reputation: 4898
There's a bit of truth to what you're saying, read the Toronto forum, there are numerous threads on the local culture. But it can often be more complex than this and arise out of different expectations about how to go about things. You're used to one pattern of social interaction, and the Torontonians are simply used to another, and this dissonance about expectations can understandably lead to frustrations. You need to learn how to approach and socialize with them in the ways they're used to, there's some good tips on that in some of the threads I mentioned. I'd also add that while some elements of what you describe really are pan-Canadian, this is a very regionalized country and you can't really get a handle on Canadians as a group by interacting with Torontonians. I will say it's generally true that our culture leads most to be on average more polite, orderly, and civil, but harder to make friends with.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Toronto > Montreal > Kiev
178 posts, read 448,780 times
Reputation: 232
Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanInCanada View Post
Maybe I'm just ignorant, but no I've never seen or met any Canadians - as far as I know - back home.

I honestly think I'm just going to transfer to ASU. I just can't deal with it here anymore. I should state, I love the college campus and the quality of the education is excellent.

But everything else... just not feeling it.
You hit the nail on the head. God forbid you go to Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. The only place that's normal I hear are the maritimes where people will actually ackgnowledge your existance. The good thing for you is you can always move to one of the thousands beautiful cities in the US. And Canada does have cheaper tuition but as an international student the difference is probably negligent.

Well the Canadians can have Canada for themselves, complete with their cold and snobby "politeness". I am looking for employment in US and can't wait to leave for the same reason as you.

Most people don't seem to know what it's like to be people here. If that makes sense.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Canada
5,694 posts, read 6,549,724 times
Reputation: 8198
Here is a clickable link http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/miranda-frum/canada-polite_b_934220.html


I was surprised to find you quoting from a blog, and a blog no less, by Miranda Frum "in voluntary exile in Canada", daughter of David Frum, who in turn is the son of a beloved CBC broadcaster Barbara Frum, who must have turned over in her grave when David turned into a right-winger.


Experiences are highly personal and I'm not disputing your experience but I will say there are certain types of people, no matter where they come from or where they go to, who will always trash talk the country they left behind, just as there are people in the same circumstances who will always talk about how much better it was where they came from.

Reasonable people find good and bad things wherever they go. I read one other blog post by Miranda Frum and my first thought was that of course it would be negative because it was set in Canada. I don't have the time nor did I find her blog interesting enough to read through any more of her posts to see if it is the pattern I was starting to sense but blogs are not facts.

You don't say if this is your first time travelling outside the US. It can be a shock for any younger person when they start out in the wider world. If you do return to the US, perhaps in a few years you'll come back and have a different impression.

We are different than Americans, perhaps more reserved, and sometimes that reserve can be taken for something that it isn't.

On the other hand, it is Toronto we're talking about, as mikeyc said. Canada is about much more than Toronto.
 
Old 04-02-2012, 02:28 PM
 
Location: Mille Fin
410 posts, read 516,797 times
Reputation: 471
Quote:
I come from a city about the same size as Toronto (Phoenix) yet the people are WAY more personable back home.
-Toronto is bigger, bigger creates more alienation.

-Toronto is the financial heart of Canada. Being in a corporate setting all day does that to you and the people around you. In this case all of Toronto. I think It's a ''biggest city'' thing...

-Toronto is.. kind of... known for that. I think it's a self fulfilling prophecy in that regard.

- You're pretty much describing how many people have described a ''northern city'' after growing up in the south.

- Northerners know the stigma is true. They're not proud about it. They're sad about it if anything.

- It's an ''us vs them'' mentality, you're just part of the 'neutral' team and find it disheartening. You'll have to condition yourself to find your 'us' side and you'll find people jollier then.


Finally, I've been to Toronto many times and it does have a lot of heart, of lot of romantic souls and mysticism. It's just buried beneath this platonic gunk. I suggest you 'assert and insert' yourself more. Condemn the wrongs, praise the rights, be vocal, and you'll find a greater sense to the city, you'll feel it's pulse.

It is a Canadian and American thing, but not nearly to the extent you may be thinking. I'm just saying this cause I know you can have a great time there and I want you to. I'm from Canada's bohemian/talk to strangers/don't discuss career city... and I still felt reticent when faced with all the southern warmth I experience in the South. Just take on a missionary stance! Free them all!

Finally if you're still not convinced about Canadians having a Southern side, I would visit Montreal or the maritimes, then quickly visit Boston. You'll see it's more of a regional than national thing

Good luck and I hope you enjoy hogtown!
 
Old 04-02-2012, 02:38 PM
 
18,339 posts, read 10,411,152 times
Reputation: 13402
You're confusing affability with friendliness. True freindship is earned and not something you'll find on the sleeve as you would in some other places.

I live 5 months of the year in the U.S. and marvel at how two drinks will ellicit the unsolicited complete past history, warts and all of somone on the bar stool next to me in the U.S. You won't find that up here. We take longer to get to really know somone before calling them a friend in the very same manner that our religion, politics and patriotism tend to be our business alone and not indicated by "fish" bumper sticker's, an elephant's head decal or a flag on our garage doors.

Quality is defined by the contents and not the pretty packaging.


You say you're a sophmore so your previous university/college experience is limited to what; one other year among friends?

Could it be you're exuding some of that well known Amurikan superiority attitude yourself and others are reacting to it? Only asking; sometimes our best understanding of the "why" of a thing is when we look inward.

Would I also be out of line to suggest you sound slightly immature for even the "sophmore experience" when you suggest you would trade "I love the college campus and the quality of the education is excellent" for a place where you think the kiddies might be friendlier. You can't be serious!

I respectfully suggest you should stick it out and learn through experience before rushing to judge an entire country by your lack of acceptance fom your fellow students.
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