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Old 10-10-2014, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,746 posts, read 3,209,496 times
Reputation: 7190

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
How ya doin Dixiechick?

I should have used the sarcasm emoticon of rolling eyes after that particular line that offends you but I would have thought the rest of the post would have made perfectly clear I was giving the poster what they sought to get the crappola rolling.

As I've said many times I love the south.

I've also spent time in the RCN with some black guys from Halifax who could tell you some tales of Canadian racism that would curdle your cream. There is not, nor has there ever been, a shortage of racism in Canada. The only marked difference in the two histories is the issue of slavery but even that is not as clear cut.

There's even an example of an aboriginal chief selling land grants given to his people back to the Crown so he could build a mansion and farm and staff it with escaped black slaves from the south; his name was Joseph Brant.

Sophia Burthen Pooley, Part of the Family
Okay, fair enough. I "love" you again!
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Old 10-10-2014, 07:47 PM
 
18,283 posts, read 10,383,572 times
Reputation: 13351
Quote:
Originally Posted by newdixiegirl View Post
Okay, fair enough. I "love" you again!
Haar! Let's have a pint of Guiness and throw some darts, eh.
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 11,146,540 times
Reputation: 3738
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
I don't think there is much difference.

I remember Michelle Kwan, the American figure skater, born and raise in the US, had to say "I love America" every time, trying so hard to convince Americans that she is 100% American. A white American will never bother doing that. I don't understand why a Chinese American is considered less an American than one with Irish origin.

We can deny that but in many Americans' mind, an Asian American is somewhat less authentic American.

In Canada, it is the same mentality. I remember Carol Huynh, the first Canadian gold medalist in the 2008 Olympics, was featured at the very bottom of an ariticle in MaCleans magazine, below those silver and bronze medalists. Why? because she is Asian, and most don't feel as proud about an Asian Canadian winning gold as if it were a white Canadian. Canada only won 3 golds in 2008, and she was put near the bottom of it? Are you kidding?
Another thing to look at is the sport in which the medal was won and just how high profile the athlete is.. There are certainly more high profile sports/athletes than others so even a silver is going to garner more attention than a gold in a 'lesser' sport. I think Patrick Chan got quite a bit of coverage throughout the 2014 Olympics and when he skated in the short and long programs I'd say he was the top covered Canadian Olympian in our Media over those few days.. Everyone was pulling for him to win the gold.. Its too bad because he dominated the men's field for 3 years.
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Old 10-11-2014, 07:09 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,524 posts, read 2,264,566 times
Reputation: 2168
Canadians say all the "polite" and PC words and phrases to come off as not racist but Canadians (and notice I'm not talking about Qeuebecois) often come off as much more racist than Americans, simply because they are very unfamiliar with all but a small handful of assimilated blacks. They make the classic 1940's style racist mistakes. If I was to take 50 black Marylander and drop them off in Ontario, I guarantee most would feel extremely uncomfortable. Much, much more so than than in Charlotte, NC. But I think a huge part of the issue is a widespread belief among Canadians that they have figured racism out, and entered a post-racism age where racism is a thing of the past. It is this arrogance that comes off as the most igronat.

It's the same way that among the black population in the US Boston has the reputation of a "racist" city in the US despite the fact that whites triumph it as the center of the abolitionist movement and bastion of liberality and open-mindedness. There is a big difference in how racism manifests itself in a town that is 99% white and 1% black and a town that is 50% white and 50% black. Canada is the former, and some of the things Canadians have said to me casually without any second thought is jaw dropping. When you are outnumbered 99-1 you keep your mouth shut and deal with it, when you are evenly numbered 50-50, that is when strife and incidents occur.

Much like where I live may be 1% French Canadian, but we never hear peep from them. But if the area was suddenly 50% French Canadian no doubt they would be demanding French schools and the right to be served in French (as in my opinion they should be). Outsiders journalists would seize upon the story and write sensationalist articles about the mistreatment of French Canadians in Maryland and how they are struggling to break out of second class status.

Personally, I find Canada more racist than the US, hands down. And again, I'm not talking about the supposedly racist Quebecois guy who makes a tasteless joke. Alot of it has to do with the fact that while in America people are always trying to deal with racism, in Canada, the existence of racism is frequently outright denied.

Last edited by hobbesdj; 10-11-2014 at 07:18 AM..
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Old 10-11-2014, 07:19 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,947 posts, read 27,365,858 times
Reputation: 8606
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbesdj View Post
But I think a huge part of the issue is a widespread belief among Canadians that they have figured racism out, and entered a post-racism age where racism is a thing of the past. It is this arrogance that comes off as the most igronat.
This is actually a very good point. Nowhere is perfect in this respect, and this includes the US, Anglo-Canada and Quebec. The difference is that somehow Anglo-Canada feels it has resolved the issue whereas others have not. But it's like being a smoker or an alcoholic in denial. The first step to resolving your cigarette or booze problem is recognizing it exists. Not pretending that it doesn't.
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Old 10-11-2014, 09:11 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,010,720 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbesdj View Post
Canadians say all the "polite" and PC words and phrases to come off as not racist but Canadians (and notice I'm not talking about Qeuebecois) often come off as much more racist than Americans, simply because they are very unfamiliar with all but a small handful of assimilated blacks. They make the classic 1940's style racist mistakes. If I was to take 50 black Marylander and drop them off in Ontario, I guarantee most would feel extremely uncomfortable. Much, much more so than than in Charlotte, NC. But I think a huge part of the issue is a widespread belief among Canadians that they have figured racism out, and entered a post-racism age where racism is a thing of the past. It is this arrogance that comes off as the most igronat.

It's the same way that among the black population in the US Boston has the reputation of a "racist" city in the US despite the fact that whites triumph it as the center of the abolitionist movement and bastion of liberality and open-mindedness. There is a big difference in how racism manifests itself in a town that is 99% white and 1% black and a town that is 50% white and 50% black. Canada is the former, and some of the things Canadians have said to me casually without any second thought is jaw dropping. When you are outnumbered 99-1 you keep your mouth shut and deal with it, when you are evenly numbered 50-50, that is when strife and incidents occur.

Much like where I live may be 1% French Canadian, but we never hear peep from them. But if the area was suddenly 50% French Canadian no doubt they would be demanding French schools and the right to be served in French (as in my opinion they should be). Outsiders journalists would seize upon the story and write sensationalist articles about the mistreatment of French Canadians in Maryland and how they are struggling to break out of second class status.

Personally, I find Canada more racist than the US, hands down. And again, I'm not talking about the supposedly racist Quebecois guy who makes a tasteless joke. Alot of it has to do with the fact that while in America people are always trying to deal with racism, in Canada, the existence of racism is frequently outright denied.
Excellent post.

Racism manifests itself more openly when the power structure in place is threatened. That is why you saw every single racist jump out once President Obama was elected and re-elected. They saw it as a threat to the order of things in the US and when you back a wounded animal into a corner they attack.

This has never happened in Canada. The white power structure is firmly in place, even in cities that are almost majority minority like Toronto. Look at this most recent mayoral election. Olivia Chow is the first legitimate non white candidate for mayor in recent history and of course the racists come out on the campaign trail in full force (Doug Ford distances campaign from racist and homophobic remarks lobbed at Olivia Chow and Kristyn Wong-Tam | National Post)

I have said this many times and will say it again. As a black professional who has lived in many different cities and countries, I felt the least comfortable in Toronto. Does that mean that people were burning crosses in my front yard? Of course not, but not having a strong black professional community to tap into was tough and something black folks take for granted in the US.
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Old 10-11-2014, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,947 posts, read 27,365,858 times
Reputation: 8606
I don't think English Canada is very racist, but it's interesting that all of all the people in my life that have told me something like ''we're not racist at all where I live'', probably 90% of them have been white, English speaking Canadians.

I know what I am talking about. I kinda used to be one of them. And whenever it was said, everyone would nod in approval. And we'd all do the circle jerk together.

The idea that Canada got the race thing right and that the U.S. didn't is an extremely powerful myth.
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Old 10-11-2014, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada
230 posts, read 435,143 times
Reputation: 352
I would agree with most of the sentiments stated here.

I would add that there is a huge disparity between university-educated Canadians and everyone else. The former group tends to be overly PC to the point of absurdity, while the latter tends to be almost completely unaware of any basic cultural sensivity/respect at all (even more pronounced in smaller cities and towns). It's a strange mix, and in both cases I see it as disrespectful.

I will say that there seems to be far less institutional racism towards people of colour in Canada. The problem is more with the people.
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Old 10-11-2014, 12:11 PM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,010,720 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I don't think English Canada is very racist, but it's interesting that all of all the people in my life that have told me something like ''we're not racist at all where I live'', probably 90% of them have been white, English speaking Canadians.

I know what I am talking about. I kinda used to be one of them. And whenever it was said, everyone would nod in approval. And we'd all do the circle jerk together.

The idea that Canada got the race thing right and that the U.S. didn't is an extremely powerful myth.
Just out of curiosity Acajack, when did you start to realize that racism is an actual issue in Canada? I must say that you are one of the few on this forum that truly "gets it" and have always appreciated your honesty. I figured you being a francophone who spent much of your life in English speaking Canada helped you appreciate this a little easier than others.

I do agree that English Canada on balance is not extremely racist in a global sense. I would say both Canada and the US tend to do better than many nations when it comes to racism. I have had an up close view of how South Asians are treated in the Middle East for example. Even me as an English speaking black man is treated like gold compared to this community. I also met up with an old friend from Jamaica recently who played professional football in the Russian Premier League for Rubin Kazan. We got on the topic of race and the stories he has about playing as a black man in Russia are pretty disgusting (He had to pick up a couple bananas off the field and even was subject to monkey chants walking around town) So I am well aware of places that do it worse than Canada or the US.

With that said, it does not mean it is not a problem that needs to be addressed and I think the sore point for most people of colour in Canada is the outright denial that racism even exists and the condescending way white Canadians tend to deal with the subject or race is general.
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Old 10-11-2014, 03:28 PM
 
369 posts, read 800,749 times
Reputation: 339
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale the male View Post
I know this has been asked millions of times but I'll try and make this thread more unique.

It seems that people automatically equate non racist as white people who are very accepting and tolerant of other races and cultures.
(so called anti racists often engage in double standards is what it seems, as I've pointed out before.)

Do Canadians often use terms like African American?

Or if Canadians are less racist than Americans, is it simply a matter of "not seeing color"?

I'd say Canadians are just as racist as Americans but they express their racism in a more subtle manner whereas Americans show it in your face.

Just because Canada is a multicultural society and is bound by anti-racist laws, it doesn't mean that Canadians are inherently and truly accepting and not judgemental of other races.

I also personally found English Canadians to be more racist than the French Canadians.
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