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Old 05-01-2012, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,937 posts, read 27,326,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I have to come out and ask this since well....I will just come right out and say it.

I've know A LOT of asians with racist views towards others, especially blacks.

Soooooo, is this true in Canada too? I've only met 1 asian from Canada so I have no significant body of work to go off of like I do here in the US.

Maybe this is more of a US phenomenon?
This is quite common in many parts of the world. Newcomers often perceive themselves as harder working than established groups and harbour prejudices against them. There are immigrant Canadians of various origins who are prejudiced against aboriginals, blacks and even French Canadians.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:20 AM
 
Location: Canada
5,689 posts, read 6,532,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
This is quite common in many parts of the world. Newcomers often perceive themselves as harder working than established groups and harbour prejudices against them. There are immigrant Canadians of various origins who are prejudiced against aboriginals, blacks and even French Canadians.
Thought I was done with this thread but I agree with you - since my husband does translations we come into contact with many immigrants from Germany and parts of the former Soviet Union. And many of them seem to have no filter at all.

I assume some of the racist comments are rooted in ignorance and the people will eventually adjust/educate/sort themselves out about that. And some of it is purely mean-spirited. Some of the adjusting these immigrants have to do is getting used to the idea that their racist comments are not common in this multi-cultural society, and in the long run, from a purely pragmatic POV, simply won't work. If you are not able to get along and expect to interact civilly at your workplace at least, with any number of ethnicities, this is not the country for you.

And while I try to adjust my own comments according to the situation and the spirit I detect behind the comments, I won't hesitate to tell anyone that racist comments are not allowed in my house.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:29 AM
 
Location: Canada
5,689 posts, read 6,532,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oleg Bach View Post
That is what I sense. We all tolerate each other. The kids are trained at an early age not to see color..which is kind of redundant..When I was a little kid my music teacher was black..she was kind of scary..hanging out with her son Marvin after the music lesson...I never had to be programmed NOT to see color..Marvin just looked like Marvin..I only learned he was black 40 years later.

Canada in truth creates racism by constantly pointing out "diversity". I just wish they would stop and let people form relationships- naturally.


As I mentioned, creating ghettos through non-profit housing caused a lot of problems..years ago I gave a black mother and her son a ride home late at night..They were doing some work on a film set...After I dropped them off at Jane and Finch...the lady said "No matter what..don't get out of the car..don't stop for gas..until you are out of the neighborhood"- That has stuck with me to this day..That their is a severe divide in Toronto between black and white..probably worse than what is in America.



Their ghettos happened on their own- our ghettos were intentionally created through poor planning and prejudice.
What's so bad about tolerance? We don't have to like each other. Tolerance is the key to civilization. Even families related by blood may not like each other - as they say, you can choose your friends but you can't choose your family - but the very best thing is to be able to tolerate each other. Friendship is a choice individuals are free to make and unrelated to tolerance.

An intolerant society would be a very uncomfortable thing.

I disagree that kids are trained not to see colour - I don't think kids see colour as something potentially different in a bad way until someone points it out to them. Kids can be taught not to think of themselves as superior on the basis of skin colour, but eventually they notice that they are different colours than maybe their friends are. How tolerantly they react to that knowledge is something that can perhaps be taught in most cases.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:54 AM
 
Location: Canada
4,698 posts, read 8,485,551 times
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In my opinion, Canada doesn't have racism, it has ethnic prejudice. There's an important distinction. In the US, race equated with ethnic identity and that fed into racism which is an ideology where people think certain races are biologically inferior or superior in relation to each other. In Canada, people have ethnic prejudice against people from other cultures. Pur Laine and Anglo Quebecois fight, Asians think the established white Canadians are lazy, some think Haitians make street gangs in a neighbourhood etc. But this isn't racism, this is just bigotry, and it's not the same thing because it's not formed in a paradigm where we're talking about race, but about culture. That's why keeping statistics about race in education situations is silly, categories like Asian include everyone from the child of a wealthy Hong Kong investor class immigrant who came over twenty five years ago to the recent Phillipino immigrant who works in a warehouse. They aren't particularly meaningful terms because races in this country don't signify cohesive ethnic groups. Even White Canadian includes Acadians, Anglo-Quebecois, Newfoundlanders etc...

Last edited by BIMBAM; 05-02-2012 at 02:03 AM..
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Old 05-02-2012, 02:38 AM
 
Location: Canada
5,689 posts, read 6,532,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIMBAM View Post
In my opinion, Canada doesn't have racism, it has ethnic prejudice. There's an important distinction. In the US, race equated with ethnic identity and that fed into racism which is an ideology where people think certain races are biologically inferior or superior in relation to each other. In Canada, people have ethnic prejudice against people from other cultures. Pur Laine and Anglo Quebecois fight, Asians think the established white Canadians are lazy, some think Haitians make street gangs in a neighbourhood etc. But this isn't racism, this is just bigotry, and it's not the same thing because it's not formed in a paradigm where we're talking about race, but about culture. That's why keeping statistics about race in education situations is silly, categories like Asian include everyone from the child of a wealthy Hong Kong investor class immigrant who came over twenty five years ago to the recent Phillipino immigrant who works in a warehouse. They aren't particularly meaningful terms because races in this country don't signify cohesive ethnic groups. Even White Canadian includes Acadians, Anglo-Quebecois, Newfoundlanders etc...
Bingo.
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Old 05-02-2012, 06:38 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,004,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
If you feel that you are being discriminated against then by all means you should speak up long and loudly about it until you get the results you want where you are. However, if you are saying the voices aren't loud enough or pronounced enough by American standards then I think you will have to wait until Canada catches up to America and has 10 times the general population it does now and 10 times the black population - just like America presently has 10 times the general population that Canada does. Then the voices of blacks and Asians and Mexicans and Muslims and whoever else might feel they're being discriminated against may be louder and more pronounced because presumably there will be 10 times more of them all in evidence to be louder about it. And maybe by that time they will no longer feel it's necessary for there to be louder and more pronounced voices speaking out against racism and discrimination.
So lets say you have a hallway with two rooms. One room has 10 people with one dissenting voice; the other 30 people with 3 dissenting voices. Which room has the greater chance of that voice being heard? Are they not both the same?

Your point about Canada requiring a larger population to have an adequate voice for a particular community is ridiculous. All anyone is asking is for the representation to match the community and that is not happening now. For example is it adequate to have only 1 Black member of Toronto City council when Black people make up almost 10% of Toronto's population? or is it enough to have only 3 Aboriginal member of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba, while Aboriginals make up 14% of the population? I am sure you will now suggest we need more people to make this happen.


Quote:
If I was going to get onto the bigotry and racism and discrimination bandwagons in Canada (or even USA for that matter) it would be the First Nations bandwagon first and foremost. The First Nations people are who have my greatest sympathies. The First Nations people have gotten more of a raw deal here in North America than any other race of people I know of here or anywhere else. They are the people in North America who most need loud and pronounced voices to speak up on their behalf for them by their own people and by people of other races and heritage.
Then hop on that "bandwagon" and speak up about there being not even one member of Legislative Assembly of British Columbia that is of Aboriginal heritage while they make up 5% of the population of your home province. That would be a great place to start.
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Old 05-02-2012, 06:45 AM
 
3,060 posts, read 7,157,024 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
... All anyone is asking is for the representation to match the community and that is not happening now. For example is it adequate to have only 1 Black member of Toronto City council when Black people make up almost 10% of Toronto's population? or is it enough to have only 3 Aboriginal member of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba, while Aboriginals make up 14% of the population? ...
Why isn't it happening? We certainly can't do away with the democratic process, so where exactly is the problem and how does one fix it? Are Blacks and Native Canadians not offering up themselves as candidates? Are members of these groups active voters? Where is the break occurring?
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:29 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,004,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunshineleith View Post
Why isn't it happening? We certainly can't do away with the democratic process, so where exactly is the problem and how does one fix it? Are Blacks and Native Canadians not offering up themselves as candidates? Are members of these groups active voters? Where is the break occurring?
Honestly, all of the above. Its a shared responsibility and trust me I am not saying we are politically active enough as a community (I'm sure Native Canadians would agree as well) so work has to be done in house.

At the same time though, we understand how politics work and if the establishment doesn't back you, the chances of being a credible candidate are nil.

For example Barack Obama energized the Black Vote, but it was even more important for him to appeal to white voters who are still the majority. Also there was no possible way he would have won the nomination if the Dem's power players and establishment did not back him 100% over Hillary Clinton who was the assumed favorite at first.

Now in Canada you have two recent opportunities to offer a more diverse group of candidates during the NDP (2012) and the upcoming Liberal (2013) Leadership elections. A glance at the Candidates with Party backing though, shows the typical one colour selection that we are accustomed to.

Just to clarify I am in no way saying that a candidate for colour should not be fully vetted like most, but encouraging them to participate in the process is a great first step.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:42 AM
 
3,060 posts, read 7,157,024 times
Reputation: 3260
While we are on the topic, a couple of good reads:

Black History Month
Prominent Black Canadians
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:14 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,004,613 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunshineleith View Post
While we are on the topic, a couple of good reads:

Black History Month
Prominent Black Canadians


And with credit to the post by Average Fruit earlier.

Mathieu de Costa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Elijah McCoy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


All these names and their accomplishments should roll off the tongues of all Canadian children easily when speaking about Canadian history (not just Black Canadian history)
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