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Old 06-08-2012, 09:02 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,962 posts, read 27,416,532 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
Let's look at Ireland. For many years, Ireland has pulled out all the stops to preserve the Irish language. Signs are bilingual, there is Irish-language media, and learning the language is compulsory. Yet in the end, most Irish communicate with one another in English.
French is much much more entrenched in Quebec than Irish ever was (at least in the past few centuries).

By and large, Quebecers do not speak to each other in English (since a majority do not speak English at all).

The Frenchness of Quebec is not an artificially-constructed Potemkin Village, and the laws which exist and are often condemned are not meant to create something artificial or revive a language from the dead, but rather to keep something that is long-established and pretty dynamic from getting totally swamped and wiped out by largely external factors and forces.
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Mississippi Delta!
469 posts, read 603,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
They are not really Marxist. More social-democrats. Similar to the socialist or labour parties in European countries (think of the new French president). They aren't anti-American per se and certainly wouldn't align themselves with any rogue states like Venezuela against the U.S., but they wouldn't toe the American line like the current Canadian or UK governments do.
As I posted earlier, there is no right-wing in Quebec, unless you consider anti-immigrant organizations as such.
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:11 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,962 posts, read 27,416,532 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
As I posted earlier, there is no right-wing in Quebec, unless you consider anti-immigrant organizations as such.
There are two parties that pretend to be a bit right-wing and that have recently merged: Action Démocratique (ADQ) and Coalition pour l'avenir du Québec (CAQ). They have a no-nonsense, common sense (according to them) platform, but they still are fairly close to the centre because the perception (probably true) is that you can't go too far right here if you want to get elected.

There are no anti-immigrant movements, parties or organizations with any political power in Quebec.
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:38 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,292,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
The Atlantic provinces really suck then, don't they? What a bunch of good-for-nothing slackers.
that's not what I meant and is so not the point here. Atlantic provinces have very lower population, unlike Quebec, and their share of equalization payment is relatively low.

Quebec is populous, (with 8 million, same as Austria/Switzerland) and Montreal is one of the biggest cities in North America. If Quebec consistently under-performs and fails to generate as much wealth as other provinces, and keeps relying on money paid for by others, isn't it an indication that something is not done correctly?

All I am suggesting is Quebec should stop feeling as entitled, demand less, and work a bit harder to contribute more to the Canadian economy.
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:56 AM
 
1,041 posts, read 1,318,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
I have read some articles that have led me to conclude that Quebec wants special treatment from the rest of Canada. I have read they are heavily subsidized although the province has plenty of wealth. As for those Quebeckers who talk about "sovereignty", do they really want independence or more of the same preferential treatment they have already been getting? Of course, French Canadians were discriminated against in the past, but they were never enslaved or subject to conquest or mass murder like some people in the United States.
Quebec doesn't want anything special, that is a conclusion by anglo media. Quebec leans more to left politically in general and clashes everynow and then with the federal govt on a lot of issues. Quebec isn't "subsidized" because of "preferential treatment". It simply recieves equalization payments from the federal equalization program. The numbers aren't that big, per capita, but due to its relalitvely large population, totals in an amount that looks like a huge handout to the ROC. The equalization program isn't preferential treatment, it's a baisc math equation. You can disagree with that federal policy if you want, but it has nothing to do with Quebec being upitty or whiny.

A lot of people in the ROC makethe intellectual shortcut that if Quebec recieves large amount of transfer payments and still disagree with the federal govt on some issue or that a portion of its population (which is now rather small) pushes for independance, it must be whiny and needs to shut the hell up. That's a rather simplistic way to look at things.

I would also add that Quebecersw tend to be more engaged policitally so any protest is depicted from anglo media has not being justified, as if Quebecers should just fall in rank and keep their mouth shut. But people have the right to protest for anything and I would wager that Canada would be a whole lot more like the US if it wasn't for Quebec.

As for sovereignty, it is a rather complex issues. It's not necessarily economical. Most people who push for independance simply don't identify with Canada culturally and politically. I don't see anything wrong in that. Other countries have gained independance before. But for some reason, a lot of opponents of the idea, especially outside Quebec, resort to saying that Quebec gets money so it should be happy and remain silent.

Quebec has a problem that a lot of minority have. If it wants something, a lot of people roll their eyes and say "you've had enough, shut it" because they assume the minority in question is trying to make them feel guilty. The discrimination against French-Canucks doesn't have anything to do with Quebec demands. You don't have to be enslaved or slaughtered en masse to use politics in your favor. Last I checked, any one or any group can use politics to work in its own interest and in fact, most do!
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Old 06-08-2012, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Mississippi Delta!
469 posts, read 603,984 times
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Personally, I think a lot of those student protesters in Quebec are upset because they can't find jobs in their fields of study. I think they also spent too much time living on college campuses which tend to shield people from the ups and downs of the real world. And universities in Canada are probably just as bad as some in the United States when it comes to indoctrinating people with quasi-Marxist ideas.
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Old 06-08-2012, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Canada
4,699 posts, read 8,507,501 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
As I posted earlier, there is no right-wing in Quebec, unless you consider anti-immigrant organizations as such.
Well, why don't fiscal conservatives (CAQ) count? It's a different culture, most people don't even think in terms of social or liberal conservative, issues are dealt with individually as they come along through stuff like the Bouchard-Taylor commission on reasonable accommodation. Besides, most of that's dealt with at the federal level anyways and Quebeckers make their voice heard through whatever political party they vote for federally.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Mississippi Delta!
469 posts, read 603,984 times
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I'm against abortion, think marriage should be between a man and a woman, and go to church regularly. Those three things make up the conservatism I talk about. I doubt I would be a good fit in any part of Canada.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,962 posts, read 27,416,532 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
I'm against abortion, think marriage should be between a man and a woman, and go to church regularly. Those three things make up the conservatism I talk about. I doubt I would be a good fit in any part of Canada.
More Canadians than you might think would share your views.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:38 PM
 
734 posts, read 855,869 times
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what do quebeckers want?

they want cushy gubmint jobs for everyone with golden retirement pensions

they want all the goodies of euro-like nanny-states while still indulging in
the crass consumerism of americans

they want the powwers that be (including the ROC) to subsidize their distasteful and corny culture and dialect
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