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Old 06-07-2012, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Mississippi Delta!
469 posts, read 604,936 times
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I have read some articles that have led me to conclude that Quebec wants special treatment from the rest of Canada. I have read they are heavily subsidized although the province has plenty of wealth. As for those Quebeckers who talk about "sovereignty", do they really want independence or more of the same preferential treatment they have already been getting? Of course, French Canadians were discriminated against in the past, but they were never enslaved or subject to conquest or mass murder like some people in the United States.
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Thornhill, Ontario
368 posts, read 302,856 times
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Support for sovereignty in Quebec ebbs and flows like tides. Right now I would say that support for sovereignty is not significant. One of the primary concerns that Quebec Nationalists have is the protection of the French language in Quebec. To that effect, governments in the late 1970's enacted several laws promoting the French language in Quebec and some would argue limit the rights of English speakers. This had the effect of driving away many businesses and people down the 401 to Toronto thus making that city Canada's economic centre.
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,983 posts, read 27,463,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willg View Post
Support for sovereignty in Quebec ebbs and flows like tides. Right now I would say that support for sovereignty is not significant. One of the primary concerns that Quebec Nationalists have is the protection of the French language in Quebec. To that effect, governments in the late 1970's enacted several laws promoting the French language in Quebec and some would argue limit the rights of English speakers. This had the effect of driving away many businesses and people down the 401 to Toronto thus making that city Canada's economic centre.
I will post my own response later but I do largely agree with most of this.

Although I wouldn't say that a movement that has roughly 40% (which is the percentage of Quebecers who think they should form their own country today) support is not significant.
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Hillsboro, OR
2,200 posts, read 3,800,898 times
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Another thing to keep in mind is that a year ago, Quebec threw out their separatist federal party from the House of Commons, dropping them from 47 to 4 seats, while electing a left-wing federalist party whose newest leader is from Quebec.

Quebec is starting to lose interest in the separatist fight because they realise it isn't going anywhere. The only reason the PQ is doing as well as it is in provincial polling at the moment is because the Liberals are so terrible and the CAQ has showed itself to be ADQ Part Deux.

Last edited by psulions2007; 06-07-2012 at 12:11 PM..
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:06 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,310,849 times
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I don't think Quebec wants separation any more as they know their life quality will go down the hill if they really do separate. I would vote "yes" if there is another referendum though.

Is there anywhere else in the rich country world where students pay $2000-3000 a year in tuition at top ranked universities and still go on protesting like sky is falling down? I love Montreal, but I am fed up with their whining.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,983 posts, read 27,463,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psulions2007 View Post
Another thing to keep in mind is that a year ago, Quebec threw out their separatist federal party from the House of Commons, dropping them from 47 to 4 seats, while electing a left-wing federalist party whose newest leader is from Quebec.

Quebec is starting to lose interest in the separatist fight because they realise it isn't going anywhere. The only reason the PQ is doing as well as it is in provincial polling at the moment is because the Liberals are so terrible and the CAQ has showed itself to be ADQ Part Deux.
And yet separatism (the idea) still polls 8-10 points higher than the party that supports it, the PQ.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
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Since the OP's question was asked in simple terms, I will respond in simple terms as well.

Canada is the father of a family.

Quebec is the 17-year-old daughter.

The 17-year-old daughter has mused about moving out for some time, but is still willing to talk about coming to agreement with daddy. She actually quite likes daddy, but also feels he doesn't really understand her.

What the daughter really wants is the right to stay out with her friends until midnight. But daddy insists that he is the father and that she come home by 10.

Over the years, daddy has made some concessions (she used to have to come home by 9) but many of the daughter's requests for greater freedom within the family home have been stonewalled by daddy. He thinks his daughter is rather irresponsible and he doesn't really trust her with more freedom.

In lieu of granting his daughter more freedom, daddy every once in a while gives his daughter nice gifts like a TV for her room, an iPod, etc.

Of course, the daughter accepts the gifts (she is not crazy of course), but always reminds daddy that this doesn't mean she is giving up on her fight to stay out late with her friends.

Of course, under the same roof are other siblings - all of them boys. Most of them are not as uppity as their sister. They'll sometimes side with their sister in her squabbles with daddy but when the rubber hits the road they end up on daddy's side. They also tend to share their daddy's view that their sister is too irresponsible to have more freedom.

They get gifts from daddy too (some of them proportionately bigger than their sister's gifts), but there is less jealousy between the brothers over the gifts because their anger is mostly focused at their sister that gets gifts but still complains.

Daddy has grown so tired of the whole matter that he doesn't really want to talk about it anymore and prefers to brush it under the carpet.

Many of the boys are rather disinterested as well, especially since one of them won a huge lottery jackpot.

Basically, a majority of the men in the family have tuned their sister out, and even when she says something that might make sense they generally ignore her regardless.

At this point, most of the boys (and maybe even daddy, though he doesn't say it openly) think that if their sister were ever to move out, she'd be living on the streets and prostituting herself.

For some reason, they don't even think she'd have a ghost of a chance at a menial Wal-Mart job, let alone landing a professional career and building a good life for herself on her own.

If she moves out from daddy's roof - she's as good as dead. No doubt about it.

Plus she'd lose all of her friends. All of them.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,699 posts, read 8,518,721 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
Is there anywhere else in the rich country world where students pay $2000-3000 a year in tuition at top ranked universities and still go on protesting like sky is falling down? I love Montreal, but I am fed up with their whining.
I'm sure you know that tuition is free in many areas of the developed world and that tuition protest isn't just about tuition (although I'm pretty fed up with it by now too).

But this isn't about the tuition increase. I'd answer the question but its so hopelessly complex and rooted in in old history I fear it would be very difficult to do justice in a post. This is the sort of material where you just need to read a book to get a handle on it, or have grown up with it. You got to get right down into the national psyche of a foreign people and it isn't easy to do in this case by just drawing parallels with other peoples. It's not really like the old world situations that on the surface seem similar, like Belgium and Scotland.

Last edited by BIMBAM; 06-07-2012 at 02:13 PM..
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:57 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,983 posts, read 27,463,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
I have read some articles that have led me to conclude that Quebec wants special treatment from the rest of Canada. I have read they are heavily subsidized although the province has plenty of wealth.
What you mean by subsidization is probably "equalization", which a form of revenue-sharing. It is not a unique program for Quebec - all provinces have received money from this at some point in time.

At the moment, I believe 6 provinces (out of 10) receive equalization payments in Canada. The only ones that do not are BC, Alberta, Saskatchewan and Newfoundland-and-Labrador. In the latter case, this is a recent development as they were on receiving end of the payments for 50 or 60 years.

As I said, all provinces have received at one point in time. Ontario just became a recipient after many decades where it did not receive the payments.

Eligibility is based on a formula that establishes an average level of fiscal resources for a province to offer services to its population. Once this is set, they determine who is over and who is under the average. Provinces who are under receive money based on how much they are under and in relation to their population as well.

The money is paid out of the federal government's general revenues. So the money is collected across the country (in both the recipient and non-recipient provinces), but only paid to the recipient provinces.

The idea behind this is to ensure Canadians receive equivalent services regardless of which province they live in.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
21,983 posts, read 27,463,390 times
Reputation: 8627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Balducci View Post
As for those Quebeckers who talk about "sovereignty", do they really want independence or more of the same preferential treatment they have already been getting?
Most of those who talk about independence are serious about Quebec becoming an independent country. I live here. I know them. Trust me. It's not a joke and it is not a bluff regardless of what other Canadians might tell you.
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