What does it mean to be Canadian? (buy, Mennonites)

[movingwiththewind]

Originally Posted by netwit

Unless you want a completely anglo saxon country, part of being a multicultural country means accomodating reasonable religious practises. A turban hurts no one, and if you still can't tell an RCMP officer by the car, the flashing lights, the stripes down the pant legs and the gun at the hip, then you sound exactly like the kind of people who used arguments of that sort to deny women the vote, the right to be in the military or in the RCMP.

I'm still waiting for society to crumble around my ears as those who argued those points, argued.

Seriously? You think a turban violates something sacred? That last part sounds like the kind of thing used to keep Jews and other non-anglos out of certain clubs in order to protect some imaginary white sacredness.

How I answer the question of what it is to be Canadian is citizenship. It doesn't mean anglo or white or Christian.

I beg your pardon? What do anglo saxon white Christians have to do with my post? You've quite an imagination. "White sacredness". Are you out of your mind? Have I stated anywhere in my post that I only want to see white looking mounties officers? Take a hike! Go and look for your average KKK member somewhere else.

Every country has and should have past, heritage and traditions. Canada included. This is how one country is different from another. And this is why we study history. There is a reason you tell your kids who their grandgrandparents were. Hopefully, you're proud doing it and not ashamed about your past. And this is why families have traditions from generation to generation. You want to know who you are and where you come from. It makes you strong. Every country has it. Don't you know anything about it? It's not a bad thing, there is nothing to be ashamed of. And there is nothing anglo saxon white christian about it.

If you associate Canada's past, heritage and traditions with anglo saxon way of life only and you don't have space and imagination for anything else, fine. Whatever better suits you. If this is what Canada's heritage and traditions are, so be it. You know your country's past better. Or maybe not.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by Acajack

A resident of the true north strong and free who values peace, order and good government?

Interesting. I read about that in National Geographic, June 1996, and it was an article about Toronto.

[green_mariner]

I have met a few Canadians in my lifetime. The first one I remember was my French teacher from high school. She told me that she couldn't explain what it was about being in Canada and being Canadian, but she liked it alot.

[netwit]

Originally Posted by movingwiththewind

Uniform is uniform. An RCMP officer wearing a turban is a joke.

What should muslim RCMP women officers wear: Hijabs and face veils?

Do you guys want RCMP officers look like a joke?

My post will probably seem insensitive to some, but you can't accomodate all human tastes and codes of dress into a police officers' uniforms. They are police officers and not clowns, after all.

What are uniforms made for?

Don't tell me being a Canadian means being a RCMP officer while wearing a turban. As far as I'm concerned, Royal Canadian Mounted Police is as Canadian as it gets. It is instanly recognized all around the world and has long standed traditions and heritage. Why making joke out of it?

How far do you want to go to accommodate religious traditions and way of life of some immigrant groups and minorities who came to Canada to adopt Canadian way of life? Or maybe not? How do you want Canada look like in near future? I know, I know, Canada is a multicultural society, but seriously? Maybe some things should remain sacred? Those immigrants who come to Canada don't want to forget their traditions and heritage, so why should Canada? Otherwise, how would you be able to answer the question of what does is mean to be a Canadian?

Originally Posted by movingwiththewind

I beg your pardon? What do anglo saxon white Christians have to do with my post? You've quite an imagination. "White sacredness". Are you out of your mind? Have I stated anywhere in my post that I only want to see white looking mounties officers? Take a hike!

Every country has and should have past, heritage and traditions. Canada included. This is how one country is different from another. And this is why we study history. There is a reason you tell your kids who their grandgrandparents were. Hopefully, you're proud doing it and not ashamed about your past. And this is why families have traditions from generation to generation. You want to know who you are and where you come from. It makes you strong. Every country has it. Don't you know anything about it? It's not a bad thing, there is nothing to be ashamed of. And there is nothing anglo saxon white christian about it.

If you associate Canada's past, heritage and traditions with anglo saxon way of life only and you don't have space and imagination for anything else, fine. Whatever better suits you. If this is what Canada's heritage and traditions are, so be it.

Try reading your OP again. Maybe you aren't following your own logic because you are defining Canada de facto as white and English/French with your comment on immigrant groups. You have your own idea of what a "Canadian" is. And at one time, that was what a "Canadian" was. Canada deliberately solicited immigrants from anglo countries - so just what do you think you are talking about when you talk about history perhaps remaining sacred? Our history is white and French and anglo.

Do you think that immigrants from other traditions don't have other religions? And we have no evidence at all over the years since the first turban-wearing RCMP officer that wearing a turban in any way has interfered with the RCMP doing their duty.

The ability to keep one's home country traditions was exactly what drew many immigrants here to begin with - it had nothing to do with assimilating.

[movingwiththewind]

Originally Posted by netwit

Try reading your OP again. Maybe you aren't following your own logic because you are defining Canada de facto as white and English/French with your comment on immigrant groups. You have your own idea of what a "Canadian" is. And at one time, that was what a "Canadian" was. Canada deliberately solicited immigrants from anglo countries - so just what do you think you are talking about when you talk about history perhaps remaining sacred? Our history is white and French and anglo.

Do you think that immigrants from other traditions don't have other religions? And we have no evidence at all over the years since the first turban-wearing RCMP officer that wearing a turban in any way has interfered with the RCMP doing their duty.

The ability to keep one's home country traditions was exactly what drew many immigrants here to begin with - it had nothing to do with assimilating.

If this is all your history and past are about, and nothing else, than it's a pretty ****ty past. Nothing to bragg about. For the moment, I thought you also had the Canadian geese and the beavers.

If this is all your past and heritage is about, than there is no need to use every opportunity to bash the US either it's justified or not.

As regarding the mounties, uniform is uniform. It's all I wanted to say. And this is all my logic is about. Like the other poster said, if they don't like the uniform, why don't they get another job?

[netwit]

Originally Posted by movingwiththewind

If this is all your history and past are about, and nothing else, than it's a pretty ****ty past. Nothing to bragg about. For the moment, I thought you also had the Canadian geese and the beavers.

If this is all your past and heritage is about, than there is no need to use every opportunity to bash the US either it's justified or not.

As regarding the mounties, uniform is uniform. It's all I wanted to say. And this is all my logic is about. Like the other poster said, if they don't like the uniform, why don't they get another job?

If you have some other version of Canadian history that you are referring to, I'd like to hear it. Seriously. As you also acknowledged in your post, some of what you said might offend some people. If it was about a uniform, what was offensive? You weren't comparing turban wearing RCMP officers to beavers or geese, that I know of.

And what does the US have to do with anything? I thought we were talking about Canada.

I am not suggesting that you are consciously aware of the anglo bias in your post but your choice of words - turbans = clowns, and making a reasonable extrapolation from that argument, turbans = someone not traditionally anglo or white. So assuming this is about a uniform, it is a bias - you have an idea of what you think someone in multi-ethnic country should look like and apparently it doesn't include cops in turbans. Which in itself contradicts a multi-ethnic society.

Uniforms can be changed as the RCMP uniform has in fact evolved over the years.

The state doesn't own your soul. If someone wanted to wear something on their head because they wanted to be jerks yanking chains, I'd agree with you. Turbans are not about that - they are about an individual's private faith, which doesn't interfere with their jobs any more than the faith of any Christian does, or the lack of faith of any atheist.

Why should they get another job if they happen to be able to do the job they would like to do? I actually haven't even heard this argument from anyone since there was (here) among some people, a minor burst of conversation about it and then nothing.

[jambo101]

Nice that Canada respects religion and all that but maybe that should work both ways and the Sikh dude respect the RCMP tradition of no Turbans.Cant believe the RCMP let that one go as the guy just makes a mockery of the uniform and the apex of Canadianess which it represents.

[movingwiththewind]

Originally Posted by netwit

If you have some other version of Canadian history that you are referring to, I'd like to hear it. Seriously. As you also acknowledged in your post, some of what you said might offend some people. If it was about a uniform, what was offensive? You weren't comparing turban wearing RCMP officers to beavers or geese, that I know of.

And what does the US have to do with anything? I thought we were talking about Canada.

I am not suggesting that you are consciously aware of the anglo bias in your post but your choice of words - turbans = clowns, and making a reasonable extrapolation from that argument, turbans = someone not traditionally anglo or white. So assuming this is about a uniform, it is a bias - you have an idea of what you think someone in multi-ethnic country should look like and apparently it doesn't include cops in turbans. Which in itself contradicts a multi-ethnic society.

Uniforms can be changed as the RCMP uniform has in fact evolved over the years.

The state doesn't own your soul. If someone wanted to wear something on their head because they wanted to be jerks yanking chains, I'd agree with you. Turbans are not about that - they are about an individual's private faith, which doesn't interfere with their jobs any more than the faith of any Christian does, or the lack of faith of any atheist.

Why should they get another job if they happen to be able to do the job they would like to do? I actually haven't even heard this argument from anyone since there was (here) among some people, a minor burst of conversation about it and then nothing.

Yes, I've my own version of Canadian history. How about Native Americans who are as much part of Canadian history and heritage as mounties IN THEIR HATS? You, with your inclination to equal Canada's past with WASP and the anglo-saxon thing may argue, of course that Native Americans are not a part of Canadian heritage, but rather a part of pre-Canada history, but I'd argue otherwise. Native American art is very prominent in Canada. It is on Canadian money (also featuring British monarch, which is part of Canadian past and heritage, as well) and in Vancouver international airport, just to give an example. Both Native Americans and RCMP officers IN THEIR HATS are depicted probably on almost every Canadian souvenir and postcard and are part of Canadian heritage. A part of long-standing tradition, which, in my head at least, does not call any associations with WASP.

However, it seems to me that all you can think of when you think about Canadian heritage and traditions is this WHITE ANGLO SAXON/FRENCH thing. Seems that you're obsessed with it. Saying something like "Canadian history / past = WASP, and because you talk about Canadian history / past and want to stick to it, your post = WASP", is ridiculous. That way of thinking about Canadian past explains why you think that being a Canadian simply means holding a Canadian passport.

I use Canadian national symbols, traditions and history (as short as it is) in my effort to try to answer what being a Canadian means. Every nation relies on its past to define itself. Native Americans, mounties IN THEIR EASILY RECOGNIZABLE HATS, maple leaf, beavers, hockey, monarchy, outdoors and wilderness and Canadian geese are all part of that picture, as stupid as it may seem to you. And all this has nothing to do with Canadian citizenship.

But then again, I've no idea about your past and where you come from and about your mental state of mind. Maybe for you, all those things do not matter. What, you find my posts provoking? Well, good for me, I guess.

You wanna change mounties uniforms and put a turban on the Canadian flag instead of the maple leaf to compensate for Canada's anglo saxon past? Will you then feel better about your country and its past? That's right, another "WASP" remark on my side.

Look, we're going nowhere with this conversation. Let's stick to our own interpretations of Canadian history and heritage and about what it means to be a Canadian. After all, what is a discussion forum for?

[mikeyyc]

Originally Posted by movingwiththewind

I use Canadian national symbols, traditions and history (as short as it is) in my effort to try to answer what being a Canadian means. Every nation relies on its past to define itself. Native Americans, mounties IN THEIR EASILY RECOGNIZABLE HATS,

You meant these ones right?



If not, then you clearly meant this one...



Or did you mean the campaign hat that Sam Steele borrowed from the US Army?

[mikeyyc]

Additionally, a key component of Canadian culture is that it is truely multicultural, not a melting pot like the US. (I know more US comparisons) Immigrants are not overtly encouraged to abandon their past and embrace their new "culture" but that their individuality adds to the uniqueness of the Canadian quilt.