U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Canada
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 07-13-2013, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Aloverton
6,564 posts, read 12,318,710 times
Reputation: 10018

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by drknoble View Post
I never knew that Canadian immigrants who are seeking citizenship have to swear an oath to an unelected monarch of a foreign country. Why have you Canadians allowed for your country to contradict itself with such a undemocratic, primitive, and shameful practice? Anyone who supports that ridiculous monarchy is basically saying they're against equality, justice, secularism, democracy, freedom, and plain ol' common sense.

The immigrants who are fighting this oath in court are taking a righteous stand. Are you Canadians going to support them by rising up and protesting to ultimately rid your country of this undemocratic and barbaric monarchy institution once and for all?

Would-be Canadian citizens set to fight oath to Queen - The Globe and Mail
Because she is legally Queen of Canada, because Canada inherits much of government and law from her country, and because a majority of Canadians still support this. Most of your polemic is nonsensical, arrogant and insulting to Canada, so you don't offer the Canadians any reason they'd prefer anything you suggested.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-13-2013, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Aloverton
6,564 posts, read 12,318,710 times
Reputation: 10018
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
I believe wanting to become a Canadian isn't something that should just automatically accord them a better life in a new country. Each and every one of them should be willing to sacrifice something to afford them that opportunity. Accepting all that Canada has to offer including the privilege of challenging our conventions AFTER lowering of their "supposed" higher ideals until such time as they earn the right to challenge the ones other Canadians have obtained through their sacrifices.
Makes sense to me. If immigrating for purpose of becoming a Canadian, this would imply that one accepts and embraces at least most Canadian values, systems and institutions. Sure, there might be some about which one could be lukewarm, but it's a package deal, and unlike birth, it's a complete personal choice. I'm pretty sure you've never held a handgun to anyone's head (as that would be illegal on several levels, heh) to force them into Canadian citizenship. I've often thought about emigrating there, and thought it through far enough to ask myself: is there anything I could not accept? If so, I should not emigrate there, just as no one ought to immigrate to the United States without following the law and making a conscious, informed decision to embrace our values.

In the end, I decided that selling my pistols wouldn't be a big hardship.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,697 posts, read 8,771,886 times
Reputation: 7314
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuala View Post
20 years ago Canada was on the verge of changing the pledge of allegiance to a pledge to Canada. A beautiful, simple, powerful, and modern pledge was written. Chretien got cold feet at the last moment: Quebec referendum was looming, and the pledge change would be helpful to Quebec federalists.

The polls at the time showed that most Canadians favoured the change.

^^ This is a summary of this article:

Chretien nixed axing oath to Queen at last minute, ex-minister says - Need to know - Macleans.ca

As a naturalized citizen of Canada, I admit, the oath to Queen has always made me feel uneasy. I don't feel any closeness to Queen but I do to Canada. I am surprised that my good old co-posters here really think I should go back where I came from, even after being a citizen for 15-20-30 years.
I think you are misunderstanding what some are saying. We aren't talking about Canadian citizens. These immigrants don't want to take an oath to their adopted country. Too bad. They don't get to call the shots, Canadians do. So after they become Canadian, like you, then as I said before, go for it.
Until then, one has to wonder why they chose Canada. To those who didn't and who were refugees, should at least be able to appear a little grateful to Canada and it's traditions. If they can't...well they have choices.

You as a naturalized Canadian are not alone in your feelings about the monarchy. I too, as a born and bred Canadian, have my moments.

Last edited by Natnasci; 07-13-2013 at 01:16 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 01:53 PM
 
3,072 posts, read 4,282,985 times
Reputation: 6512
Let me rephrase - we don't care enough to do anything about it.

The worst I've seen is here in Quebec spraypainted on dumpsters outside gas stations - "brittish out"(sic). That's about as revolutionary as it gets.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 02:22 PM
 
18,308 posts, read 10,393,778 times
Reputation: 13375
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_k_k View Post
Makes sense to me. If immigrating for purpose of becoming a Canadian, this would imply that one accepts and embraces at least most Canadian values, systems and institutions. Sure, there might be some about which one could be lukewarm, but it's a package deal, and unlike birth, it's a complete personal choice. I'm pretty sure you've never held a handgun to anyone's head (as that would be illegal on several levels, heh) to force them into Canadian citizenship. I've often thought about emigrating there, and thought it through far enough to ask myself: is there anything I could not accept? If so, I should not emigrate there, just as no one ought to immigrate to the United States without following the law and making a conscious, informed decision to embrace our values.

In the end, I decided that selling my pistols wouldn't be a big hardship.

I have read both your recent posts and wish to extend an apology to you sir.

These threads bring out the absolute worst in me and I forget that when piling on the vitriole to respond to nonsense; I'm painting with a very broad brush indeed. It should never be my intent to insult reasonable people and if I've done so I'm heartily sorry for that. Idiots on the other hand, will get no such quarter.

Do not give up your pistols. There is a home for them in Canada although confined to range and your home with strict guidlines. Carry permits are the thing of fantasy here but ownership is not outright forbidden.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 05:24 PM
 
558 posts, read 547,834 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by nzrugby View Post
As a kiwi/aussie I will give you an answer, unlike you yanks we believe it boils down to trust, would we trust politicians,hell no. But you yanks believe politicians are to be trusted since the so called founders where we believe politicians are just there to be the help. As for immigrants complaining the answer is easy, send them back to Somalia.
You're not making any sense. The US system of gov is based around checks and balances, separation of powers, trust but verify. While the undemocratic monarchy doctrine, forced upon Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc, is centered only around trust. There's no legally specified way to stop the unelected queen from vetoing a bill, making an appointment, or firing a gov official. Which means those constitutional monarchies have no choice but to TRUST the Queen doesn't step out of line.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 05:29 PM
 
558 posts, read 547,834 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by nzrugby View Post
Oh you believe the monarchy no longer has any function in Australia, strange that since I'm ex Royal Australian Infantry regiment and I noticed a couple of yanks swearing allegiance to the crown when they were joining the Regiment this week. I wonder if yanks lose their US citizenship if they swear loyalty to a monarch ?
I never said that. Australia is not a democracy through and through as long as it's a constitutional monarchy with a queen as head of state.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 05:34 PM
 
558 posts, read 547,834 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltschmerz View Post
It seems to be a problem for YOU, and frankly that's your problem, not ours.
What a shame. It should be a problem for anyone who's on the side of democracy and equality.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 05:43 PM
 
558 posts, read 547,834 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
You are sooo dense.. to make it easy for you...

I'm not jealous. I'm a gay male and have been married for four years.. most places in your country I couldn't have done that.

I don't find the monarchy a fault in Canada. I live in a country i'm proud of and love willingly and would die for. You are making an issue out of nothing (and clearly not piping up about the enormous strengths of Canada under the Queen as our HOS) and clearly the majority of Canadians in here feel the same way.

And quite frankly I agree with the guy from New Zealand - if an immigrant doesn't like the way this country is - they can feel free to go back to the country they came from - clearly a bastion of human rights like Canada is lol <sarcasm>... After they follow our customs and become a Canadian Citizen than sure become a part of the conversation about what this country should be in the future.
Until then - be quiet and be grateful you aren't dodging bullets or mortars or persecution anymore and respect your new country and its tremendous history and values that have allowed you to live in a safe, free and developed land with unlimited potential..and most of all - don't forget the reason you came here in the first place!
I'm proud of my country as well, but I'm not afraid or too patriotic to acknowledge our faults so we can amend them. What I find strange is that you Canadians won't acknowledge the faults of monarchy, and constantly defend it with bogus excuses such as "it's a tradition", when that same excuse doesn't hold water in regards to other savage and barbaric traditions such as slavery.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2013, 05:49 PM
 
558 posts, read 547,834 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Monarchy is just fine, doesnt bother me in the least,i say keep the status quo..

Seems almost comical that some one from a country that is in major decline and fraught with a plethora of major problems would bring up a topic berating another country for something as trivial and inconsequential as its connection to England..I suppose you also have issues with our parliamentary system of government as well.
Well from my view, it seems almost comical that a democratic nation would so boldly and unashamedly promote and defend a barbaric institution such as monarchy. It makes absolutely no sense.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Canada
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top