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I was in favour of stricter gun control than we have on Wednesday night at 7 pm before I heard the news, I still was at 8 pm after watching the news, and I still am today.
"Democide is a term revived and redefined by the political scientist R. J. Rummel as "the murder of any person or people by their government, including genocide, politicide and mass murder." Rummel created the term as an extended concept to include forms of government murder that are not covered by the term [genocide], and it has become accepted among other scholars. According to Rummel, democide passed war as the leading cause of non-natural death in the 20th century.
His research shows that the death toll from democide is far greater than the death toll from war. After studying over 8,000 reports of government-caused deaths, Rummel estimates that there have been 262 million victims of democide in the last century. According to his figures, six times as many people have died from the actions of people working for governments than have died in battle."
It's a lot easier to arrange bending people over "for the greater good" when the right time comes when the powers to be are sure that the people are disarmed. Private gun ownership works as a safeguard against rise of totalitarianism and affects balance of powers dramatically, giving more control and psychological and physical power advantage to individuals and their communities as opposed to a centralized state.
I'm not sure that after seeing the direction the US and Canada are moving in the last 20 years or so, giving up all powers and trusting state is such a great idea. States like the US or Canada are run by the top dogs who see general public as chumps and would like to disempower it as much as possible. What makes you think that Canada is any different from any other place that fell into totalitarianism and is not at risk? I already see all the signs of people being afraid of police, for instance, and feeling intimidated by the government and its various employees, meaning they are not really in charge anymore.
Plus I don't hear reports about a lot of crime from Texas, I guess it's a bit risky and scary to hijack a car there or try to stage a mass shooting. It's gun-free liberal-run cesspools like some Chicago neighborhoods or other gun free zones and states (liberal cities, as a rule) where all the recent mass shootings took place. Just a coincidence, right.
Consider the age of these miscreants. For the most part it's not your over 50 individual who grew up with a respect for human life and no access to video games showing blood and gore while you're sitting in your lounger pulling that R1 button for all it's worth killing multiple enemies without payback.
It's the disconnnect the mentally unstable have with the reality of killing actual people for relief of some perceived victimization by authority figures. This is the stuff that has to be addressed NOT the guns per-se.
All the laws in the world will not stop some nut buying a readily available weapon from the warehouse full of them below the 49th and finding a way to get it back to Canada to fulfill his fantasy of a Tomb Raider or Battlefield Three shootout with his perceived tormentors who he blames for preventing him from losing his virginity before the age of 23.
You nailed it. It's all of the above in spades. Plus it's the rabid gun fanatics and anarchists that get on the "don't tread on me" and extreme survivalist forums and other social media websites to spit out their hate mongering against authority and to encourage insurrection and revolt against society. Apparently Justin Bourque, the Moncton cop killer, was active on those kinds of websites and bit the bait, hook, line and sinker for the whole anarchy and pseudo-commando schtick which was quite evident from the things he wrote online and the way he was decked out and from his actions.
So in reply to the OP - instead of a total ban on guns, how about instead a total ban on those video games and all of those websites that the rabid dogs use to find and encourage impressionable young men like Bourque and to egg each other on in murder and mayhem.
All the same I could not stop tears from leaking from my eyes seeing those young faces. I know they probably loved their jobs as much as my brother and SIL love theirs but it is still sad beyond belief.
All the same I could not stop tears from leaking from my eyes seeing those young faces. I know they probably loved their jobs as much as my brother and SIL love theirs but it is still sad beyond belief.
I've been feeling weepy and angry about all of this since Wednesday. The whole damned situation including whatever or whoever it was that corrupted Bourque is a bloody tragedy for everyone in Canada. The only encouraging thing I can see that's come out of it is how much support has been shown for the RCMP.
I'm seeing a resemblance to the situation south of us in respect to our National Firearms Assoc. completely disregarding the inappropriateness of attempting to make a political statement out of this senseless tragedy by already making a formal statement that this proves Gun Control Laws don't work and should be abolished.
Gads; the families are still clinging to each other for solace and these nuts come out with that nonsense to make a political point using the death of their loved ones.
I'd like to suggest some control of my own. I'm for putting a muzzle on all groups who have a position regarding firearms, pro or against, until at least after the yellow crime scene tape comes down. I wonder sometimes at the ability for some to ignore the obvious. There will be plenty of time for all to be heard later after the families have at least had time to say their goodbyes.
This is a multi-pronged societal issue that can't be dealt with by gun control alone.. I mean if you really want to destroy life you will find a way - look at what happened in the London Tubes or in Madrid at Atosha station.. Having said that, making it more difficult through official channels and having as robust a screening system as possible before releasing a gun into anyone's hands is a prudent thing to do imo. As much as this is terrible, fortunately for Canada we still live in a society whereby this is very RARE and I think we need to put that into perspective.. Terrible things happen in the world and some of them are random and we have to accept that we can't control EVERYTHING. I get clubbed in here everyday for defending our nation against some others that are bigger and richer than our country but more so than ever i'm proud of our nation, our values and our people!
On another note - my thoughts go out to these young men who lost their lives senselessly and more so to their families and like so many, my heart bleeds for the loss of fine men protecting us from the minority who lose their way! RIP
This American Liberal agrees with BruSan. The problem is not the guns but that some really deranged people that cannot be detected by acceptable means (you want a psyche screening for every teen age boy or girl) or prevented from obtaining a weapon. Guns are convenient weapons but a lot of harm can be done with old fashioned knives and clubs.
I do not see how excessive attempts to control firearms will reduce the number of these tragedies. The best they would do is make law abiding people even more vulnerable to assault. Please note that the most violent areas in the US are in the places with most people disarmed by regulation. Making a school a "gun free zone" does not make the occupants safer but announces to any crazed psychotic that these people will not be able to defend themselves. This is a dangerous "feel good" action that actually achieves exactly what it was designed to prevent. Confiscating guns from most people would just achieve the same on a national level.
I do understand why some people want guns banned and believe the criminals and crazies would also give up their weapons. Some people are not mentally able to even conceive of fighting to save their own and others lives. These people are exactly the folks we armed citizens are obliged to protect. It is absurd to think disarming us will save the innocent.
Instead of attempting to disarm everyone I suggest that children, and any adult requesting the training, be familiarized with firearms by instituting a high school level sports shooting competition on a local, state (or province) and national level. This would teach thousands of people how to legitimately use firearms for skilled recreation as well as self defense and the responsibilities that are attached to owning and carrying a gun. This would result in an armed and responsible citizenry that most likely not have to wait for the police to defend themselves.
The fact that this assault in Moncton was actually on the police is duly noted. If any group in society should be ready for an assault by criminals or crazies the police are near the top.
One of his rifles sure looked like it had a collapsible stock on it. I don't think you can buy rifles with collapsible stocks here.
I also doubt his magazines were pinned for 5 rounds.
In regards to video games - I've been playing those types for years and years. I have never had the urge to grab my rifle and point it at another human being.
So, no. I am not in favour of "dropping the banhammer" on our gun laws. They're tight enough as it is.
This is an incredibly rare occurrence in this country, and I'd say our current laws are doing just fine.
Last edited by Magnatomicflux; 06-07-2014 at 01:48 PM..
I do understand why some people want guns banned and believe the criminals and crazies would also give up their weapons. Some people are not mentally able to even conceive of fighting to save their own and others lives. These people are exactly the folks we armed citizens are obliged to protect. It is absurd to think disarming us will save the innocent.
Instead of attempting to disarm everyone I suggest that children, and any adult requesting the training, be familiarized with firearms by instituting a high school level sports shooting competition on a local, state (or province) and national level. This would teach thousands of people how to legitimately use firearms for skilled recreation as well as self defense and the responsibilities that are attached to owning and carrying a gun. This would result in an armed and responsible citizenry that most likely not have to wait for the police to defend themselves.
Emphasis added by me.
Greg, you make a number of good points, but I should make you aware of the Canadian attitude towards firearms and self-defense. In a nutshell, it is this: if you state that you need a firearm for self-defense, you will be forever prohibited from owning one in Canada.
Canadian self-defense laws are a little more complicated than I'd like to get into right now, and there are valid instances when you can defend yourself with a firearm; but for the most part, you legally cannot. As I have told a few clients who have run afoul of our firearms and self-defense laws, "You shouldn't have grabbed your gun when you heard the burglar; you should have grabbed a baseball bat." To sum up, in Canada, guns are for recreational target shooting, varmint control, and hunting. And that's all. Draw down with a gun on a burglar, and you have committed a Criminal Code offense.
As regards the OP, I do not feel that a ban would accomplish anything. We live right next door to the United States, where private ownership of firearms of all types is allowed by the US Constitution. (The UK, by way of contrast, shares a land border with nobody except the Republic of Ireland, which does not have a US-style Second Amendment.) Just as US Prohibition saw Canadian booze flow from Canada to the US, so would a Canadian firearms prohibition see American guns flow from the US to Canada. Far better, IMHO, to regulate as we have; rather than ban and have a whole bunch of unregulated, unregistered, untracked firearms smuggled into Canada from the US.
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